jodgi

I'm looking at it too, not done yet (for Essex). I'm sure buying stuff breaks the bank, player or NPC. I disregard LH as I always have more LH than I ever need (solo crafting for own use). Want to disregard doub and permit "cost" as those things are put in place for other reasons than eco. We agree that permit and doub ships with rare woods wouldn't make you break even with insurance, not even close.

I did the simple math on a corvette, maybe you've done the numbers on bigger ships? I'd like to see those numbers...

Ok. I'm not saying you do, but I'm suspecting there is a tiny possibility you have a blindspot when it comes to resources, crafting and insurance. I have the two silly little current DLCs but haven't used them against players yet. I've used and lost my own crafted ships instead. Right now losing a ship costs me almost nothing. Unless you buy stupid expensive woods or other stupid expensive resources from players you get almost every dime back. Yes, yes, oak/oak is "useless" and "terrible" (it's not) but if you stick with things you can extract yourself or steal from bots or players you can even come out of a ship loss with a net profit because of insurance rates. When I start using my bigger DLCs I will always lose the guns and get nothing back for them, so using my own crafted ships will save me money while going with my DLC will guarantee me losing more money. Sure it'll be faster to just click out a DLC, but even if I have to go to extract and haul oak and hemp it will take me no more than 5-10 minutes of engaging eco gameplay to click out a new ship. More often crafting a ship doesn't take longer than clicking a DLC because we usually keep stuff for at least 10 ships at the ready. Guns make up about half the cost of a ship, so you should start worrying about us DLC clickers losing our reals while crafters get their cash back. How's that for a plot twist, eh?!

Hachi, with all possible deference: Saving time and avoiding work is just that and not winning with objectively more powerful purchased equipment.

Sure, but it won't happen. Oh, if I had to sub and still would have to eco to get ships (like EVE?) I'm not sure I would be able to take the eco abuse. I disagree. I think NA first and foremost lends itself to PvP-on-demand. I view eco as a malicious growth on a beautiful thing

I don't. Just don't forget that many complained about x and are now happy we have y. I have herc and I'm happy it's been taken down a notch.

I have no idea as I never play bad games. I know of three longtime running sub games: WoW, EVE and Aces High, though I've steered well clear of the two first. I've never played any F2P games that are not still running year after year either. Then there's NA which I hold in highest regard over WoT and up there with Aces High (though WoT's pvp-on-demand-all-day-every-day is so alluring I still get tricked into bed).

Oh?! I thought cosmetic DLCs were good and DLC ships evil? Why must so many people have so many wildly different opinions?!... IT'S TEARING ME APART!

The nineties are calling and want their monetization scheme back! EVE reported net earnings right after they went with the open access thing. Nothing is more risky today than to go with subs for an online game.

But not even in the same neighboorhood as expensive as WoT, WT, WoWS et al. Players already know they don't have to buy everything on offer.

Is that better or worse than me typing up "sulky"? How well are you handling responses to your posts, in your own opinion?

I'm entitled to an opinion of your opinion. I read a complaining and sulky tone in your post, it's hardly an insult. That's fine. You can yell at me in PM. Whenever you see a poster breaking the forum rules you can report the post, this also goes for me.

Yup, and I'll relay your sulking to the 10 players who started to throw themselves more into PvP with the DLCs. Umm... That's not what the numbers say, They got themselves killed and so provided content for others. They listened and it will be as you wish on this point.

Rare picture of one of the latest free-speech forum martyrs during the last moments before ban:

Could you explain in more detail? Is there a specific port you're stuck at?

I'm absolutely sure DLC ships will become very popular, probably so popular it will even annoy me a little at times. But they will provide a lot of PvP and that trumps everything else, according to moi, of course ;). Even so, when I have enough doubs and CM to spend I will want to roll in ships that are objectively better than my DLCs. I will craft them myself because I can't stand trading for cash, but others will do that and spend cash on player-sold ships. DLC ships won't even kill off crafting for one of the most reluctant crafters (me) in the game. A lot of people will still craft-grind to get those coveted 5/5 ships, it is an annoying mechanic so I'm not applauding it, but it will keep many clicking those buttons. What we "lose" by getting DLC ships is the complete and absolute power eco/crafting could have over the player base. I appreciate the fact that hard-core eco guys would like such an EVE system over happy-go-lucky DLC PvP. We could put a spin on it and say it makes player choice between eco and PvP completely free. Everyone knows I've pushed against eco from the start, but it's not to spite eco fans; I don't have the time, like at all, nor the inclination to make it as an eco player, so DLC ships enable me to make it here despite the inherently boring eco part. People I respect suggest to me and others that we should set limited goals with what we hope to achieve in the game, but I don't play games in that manner. I can sympathize with the concern that it makes things easy for people who are willing to fork over cash. While I don't agree with the claim that DLCs are ship-power pay2win, I guess you could call it eco pay2win. Firstly, I don't have a single milligram of concern for the well-being of eco, but more importantly, every single game I've played that wasn't sub-based has offered an easier life in exchange for cash. It's just a way to keep the lights on, I'm not able to force my panties to bunch up over this.

I doubt I'll level up all the way. I don't need lineships and will lazily craftgrind cheap ships until I can craft Connie. I'll use premium ships a lot and craft ships only when I want to and not because I have to. It's great because I never could keep up the cash grind to buy ships from crafters, but if I craft and lose frigates I won't deplete my cash. Those interested in winning the war can help each other in-house with the last craft levels, much like you describe it is today.

Just wait, you'll see that the eco/permit/grindable ships will still be in fashion among the aficionados.

I'm just being practical about it. I saw the numbers for wargaming, they made peanuts off bling but sustainable cash off grind acceleration and premium tanks (also grind acceleration). I know Fortnite makes cash from bling, but what is their target audience? We should probably take the high road and remember that some people enjoy the eco thing Eh, we probably won't see eye to eye on this Manny, but I still love you.

I thought eco was fun in itself for those so inclined? Don't look at me! I didn't get it in 2015 and I don't get it now.

I'm ready to be a container for all your anger! I take full moral and financial responsibility.

Don't worry, even the holier-than-thou whiners know this. I have my sea legs on and am ready to weather this storm of hissy-fit-knee-jerk protests. Most of 'em will end up buying the ships and play them in order to get the required stuff to make or buy the better permit ships so they can dominate the DLCs.

Siggi map = best map Sure! Not so sure! No, I don't dream of a persistent 1:1 scale super tiny OW. I can full well see the seemingly insurmountable difficulties that "perfect" world presents. The gameplay devolved into cheap tricks and traps when last we had universal 20 min timers. I expect similar things to happen this time around despite the good intentions and revised 20 min RoE. We'll all know a bit further down the line.