The Frigate "Cherubim"

[BungeeLemming]

Frigate, 5^th rate:

 

The name of the frigate is "херувимъ" which you can read as "Cherubim". Cherubim is a supernatural beeing who has wings an animal body but a human face.

She is a very powerful creature which is seen as a tutelary goddess.

However this is not the whole story. You may have noticed the fallen off letters of the Frigate's stern (^image above)? Well that gives it a whole new meaning. 

"хер им" translates as "a dick to them" and means something like "they will not reach us". or "you receive nothing".

A russian play on words.

 

The ship is modeled after A Chapman design with a 135ft long gundeck.

 

 

 

Fighting capabilities:

 

The Figate is the first ship to be able to carry 18lb cannons. She carries 13 of those in her main battery.

On her upper decks she can either mount six 6b cannons or if the player wants it she can carry 24lb carronades.

Depending on this choice you end up with a broadside weight of either 270lb or 378lb when chosen the carronade setup.

IMO Carronades work best with normal guns in the main battery.

 

Her total compliment is 280 men and her Captain.

 

 

Speed:

 

 

As a squarerigger the frigate reaches her topspeed on a broad reach (135°).

Her preferable sailing area starts at about 85° where she accelerates noticable faster than beeing closer hauled.

You can find even greater detail in this post

 

Handling:

 

Turning:

 

The frigate handles very responsive. She turns through the wind as fast as the Surprise.

I coordinated a turnrace with a buddy to check her turning capabilities. She may even bequicker.

We both used manual skipper to get the fastes possible tack so there is human error incorporated.

Due to her short hull she is a really good turner over all. Through the wind or bevore him.

 

 

Heel:

 

The Frigat is a very stable gunplatform. She starts to heel over when beeing closer to the wind . This is no surprise due to her rigging.

Sailing on a beam reach you still dont have to worry about depowering sails. In doubt simply go to battle sails. That will do the job most times.

Only when fighting close hauled you have to neutralize the yards and depower the jibs as well if your foe is point blanc.

 

Compared to her bigger competitor the Trincomalee the frigate heels a lot less.

 

 

Conclution:

 

 

The Frigate is a very powerful ship. Due to her exellent handling characteristics it is a real joy to sail her. You will be able to turn inside every Trincomalee.

But be careful:

Even tho she carries 18lb guns that does not mean she ins heavily armoured. She still is a frigate. That means you have to watch out how much damage you soak up. And try to acoid geting trapped between multiple enemies.

Plan your engagements. Once stuck in the fight you do not have the speed for a quick departure.

 

 

 

© BungeeLemming

special thanks goes to Jodgi who provided this fantastic speed chart!

_____________________

 

so. This was my first ever rewiev of anything in a written down form.

Tell me what you think is rubbish or what part is plain wrong. I also appreciate tips for edits

Typing errors. false grammar etc

[akd]

For the love of god, please change her name to Cherubim.  "Frigate" is incredibly confusing in an open world full of various frigates.

[Mighty_Alex]

For the love of god, please change her name to Cherubim.  "Frigate" is incredibly confusing in an open world full of various frigates. :)I'd

I'd rather have a real HMS Diana or a historical russian frigate (there are plenty of  plans). I thought they didn't want to have made up ships in the game.

[Inigo Balboa aka Ronda]

Great info, BungeeLemming!

I'd also add these links 'cause this cartoon (and a book) are what devs refer to probably.

Adventures of Captain Wrongel. 

 

https://youtu.be/JwPTStU3Ubg?t=4m47s

 

The yacht was made of rough wood and that's why it began to grow roots

Edited June 18, 2015 by Inigo Balboa

[Alex Connor]

I'd rather have a real HMS Diana or a historical russian frigate (there are plenty of  plans). I thought they didn't want to have made up ships in the game.

Bit of a strange ship this one, but not completely invented.

 

She's based off a Chapman frigate design but the plans were altered by a model kit company to portray a British frigate. I'm not sure sure if the original plans were used to build a ship, not all of Chapman's designs were used, but if this ship was built it would have been Danish. 

 

http://www.sjohistoriska.se/ImageVaultFiles/id_3063/cf_1768/33.JPG (Credit: Captain Armstrong found these plans)

 

Oddly, this makes her quite suited to be a Russian ship, the Russians liked captured Danish ships and built several copies of Chapman frigates. They also had Royal Navy influences and built some ships from plans obtained from the british (including a class of 10 half-sisters to HMS Victory).

 

The model itself we have here was built by Axionelis (spelling?) and given to Game Labs as one of the first ship models, it's been reworked a few times and only just reappeared.

 

Not sure where the connection to HMS Diana has come from, perhaps invented by the model kit company. The armament we have ingame was definitely invented by the kit company, this ship is much too small to be an 18 pdr frigate. From the dimensions (135ft gundeck?) I would say that she is a 12 pdr frigate, probably with 6 pdrs on the weather deck, about the size of the Belle Poule.

 

Now, there a few problems with this model (mostly left over from the kit company's conversion to a British frigate). First, this ship was not a true frigate with the normal unarmed gundeck and main battery on the upper deck like all the other frigates we have. Instead, the guns are carried on the gundeck, lower down to the waterline (because Danish frigates were for use in shallow waters and valued a shallow draught over being able to fight in rough seas). But the kit company has given her a british style stern gallery, and they've placed it about half a deck higher than the original (where a normal frigate's stern gallery would be), so it's not in line with the deck it's supposed to be on. They've also raised the sides of the hull, creates this odd appearance with a fairly normal looking frigate that for some reason has a very low gundeck.

 

So what I'd suggest is either cutting down the sides and re-positioning the stern gallery as per Chapman plans above, or raising the gunports/decks/chainplates about 3 feet to bring the guns in line with the stern gallery, either modification would produce a "correct" and very attractive frigate. (assuming Game Labs is not tired of this model after 2nd rework and are going "F*** it, the ship is finished"  )

[BungeeLemming]

Alex I own the Chapman book and had a look at it.

And if the Frigate is indeed modeled after Plate XXXIII she is was planned to carry 18pd cannons in her main battery.

26x18pd and 12x6pd on the upper decks.

Here is the index page where the plate is described:

145 feet long gundeck btw.

[jodgi]

Good stuff, Thanks!

Now I don't have to cover that ship

Pounds per broadside was clever, gonna steal that idea.

Edited June 19, 2015 by jodgi

[VEYRON]

what we need is some beautiful exotic ships like the xebec corasair,,lot of these ships in the game now are the most boreing,and dont inspire people to play,,your customers will be looking for beautiful ships and cool looking ones,,this game seem bent hell on gearing up on nothing but ugly looking battelships for war,,instead of adventure,speed,,,ill be kicking back  drinking beer in the best lookin ship in the game yet my pleasure battelcrusier yhat with the band has yet to arrive

[Alex Connor]

Alex I own the Chapman book and had a look at it.

And if the Frigate is indeed modeled after Plate XXXIII she is was planned to carry 18pd cannons in her main battery.

26x18pd and 12x6pd on the upper decks.

Here is the index page where the plate is described:

145 feet long gundeck btw.

 

Oh, nice find 

 

18 pdrs make sense if she's supposed to be 145ft length. Only problem, the model was built to 135ft gundeck length (see build thread below), so it's too small and will need to be scaled up. Perhaps the modeller misread and took the length for the plate XXXIV frigate (which was a 12 pdr ship)

 

http://hangsim.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=4367 

 

These are the plans used, if you compare them to the model and the chapman plans its obviously the same ship. (ignore the different stern gallery, was changed for Naval Action)

http://i.imgur.com/jPdPYOx.jpg?1

 

Edit: Being 145ft is great news, makes her a real rival to the Trin, could even increase the armor to match (just so long as the model gets scaled up).

[Arvenski]

what we need is some beautiful exotic ships like the xebec corasair,,lot of these ships in the game now are the most boreing,and dont inspire people to play,,your customers will be looking for beautiful ships and cool looking ones,,this game seem bent hell on gearing up on nothing but ugly looking battelships for war,

:facepalm:

 

Cry me a river. "Ugly battleships"? Dude, that is not an ugly battleship. That is a rather attractive-looking frigate, though it may be hard to tell from the pictures in the OP. And there already is a xebec in development.

[Souvenir]

The Russian word-play which is in the name of this ship, is very amusing also it a little abusive. Has one pronunciation, but some faithful translations. 

"You receive nothing" -the most cultural)

[Thomas Cochrane]

For the love of god, please change her name to Cherubim.  "Frigate" is incredibly confusing in an open world full of various frigates.

 

Or go in the other direction and call it "ship".

[HotDog]

For the love of god, please change her name to Cherubim.  "Frigate" is incredibly confusing in an open world full of various frigates.

 

Yes indeed. Its just looks silly.

[Diceman]

My question is... Is it worth purchasing or is the Belle Poule a better choice??

I'm currently a post captain sailing a Suprise looking to upgrade. I do not like the Trincomalee because of its heeling issue. And it'll be awhile til I rank up enough to get a Consitution...

I've found a "Fine" Frigate for sale but its the same exact price as a "Common" Consitution.

Anyone out there sail both and have comparison info to share?

Thanks

[Flavalicious]

Frigate for speed, belle for survivability

Id go frigate for pvp, belle for pve

[BungeeLemming]

also I have to edit this guide since the recent patch bufffed her quite a bit.

 

But I dont have too much spare time and the time I have I use playing with a bud atm..

 

What needs an update:

Speed: 16kn mas

armour: 2250? something around that value.

 

But I will update it during the next week.

And I may do a Belle Poule overview as well.. holidays are coming

[Alex Connor]

Quick comparison, 

 

Belle Poule: 16kts speed, 4.60 turning, 2503 armor, 280 crew, 28x18lb and 10x12lb plus 2x sternchasers.

 

Cherubim: 16kts speed, 4.60 turning, 2276 armor, 280 crew, 26x18lb and 12x12lb plus 2x bowchasers. 

 

Basically the two ships are nearly identical except one has a little more armor and the other an extra pair of 12 pdrs. Plus bowchasers vs sternchasers. I've used the Belle Poule in PvP and it seems pretty competitive against against the Trincomalee, perhaps slightly weaker but more than capable of holding it's own if you have the edge in skill.

 

Edit: Right, if the Belle Poule has an extra pair of 18s vs the extra pair of 12s that definitely gives it the edge. Really the leading pair of maindeck ports on the Belle Poule should be chasers angled at about 45 degrees (meaning you'd follow off someone's quarter and not directly behind them), normally these ports would be empty but if you needed chasers you'd move a pair of guns from the broadside ports.

[DesertRat]

this would seem to make the Belle Poule, the better ship, as it has the larger BR and more armor with no negatives other than the difference in bow vs stern chasers.

[Robert Danforth]

I prefer stern chasers, but it's hard to argue that the B.P. isn't the better ship. More armor, more weight, better turn radius?

[Souvenir]

Cherubim I liked more. I like the nose guns more than the availability of fodder, as this more important tactical moment.

On top I put carronades and one more than the Belle Poule. When the sailing side by side, it's not a big plus, but a plus.

[Surcouf]

Quick comparison, 

 

Belle Poule: 16kts speed, 4.60 turning, 2503 armor, 280 crew, 28x18lb and 10x12lb plus 2x sternchasers.

La Belle-Poule has not historically of 18-pdr, but just of 12-pdr.

[Robert Danforth]

If that changed, it would make the frigate superior for certain, but as it stands now (although the carronade angle is a good point, Souvenir) I'm not so sure.

 

It might be close enough I just stick with the frigate because she's prettier and I like the stern guns.

[DazednConfused]

BTW is this ship going to be lengthened to its appropriate size? at the moment its a twin to the surprise - which is a 28 gun 6th rate (yeah yeah i know in game it has more) - when it should be very close to the trincs length. 

[Johny Reb]

But what is the ship modeled after? I hear this question a lot and here I found the answer which I got from the devs a long time ago:

 

HMS Diana was launched in 1794 as a 5th rate which carries 38 guns. 14 x 18lb in her main battery and a total of nine guns on her quarterdeck and forecastle together.

Here you see a huge discrepancy to our ingame model wich only features 13 x 18lb and an addition of six guns on her upper decks.

I believe the "long time ago" post refers to an entirely different ship that has nothing to do with the current cherubim.

 

I direct you to the opening page of NavalAction.com...  scroll down to the picture of ships. Right above the Connie is the "frigate" that old post was referring to. If I remember right there was a post that once described it as a generic frigate.

[Diceman]

I have the Frigate Cherubim and I'm loving it!!

I've engaged several Belle Poules and Frigates in 1v1s and handled them easily. Met a Trincomalee last night and did very well against it, even though I had to repair twice.

It's a sharp turner with a nice punch!

Highly recommended!!