Arcade or Simulation, the poll

[Saintduiex]

I'm debating about building a wheel to use for Naval Action and teaching my cat to spritz me with sea water

This had me wondering and I found the solution for ya Lev.

Looks like it would do the trick. Set that bad boy on pulse and fill it with salt water. May need to put some tarps down or play in the garage but the realism can't be beat.

And best of all, no need to mess with the cat

[RedWhiteYellow]

AC4 Black flag was pure arcade not ships but speedboats with idiotic battering rams i couldent get into any game like that

[Chilly Willy]

Don't feed your pussy  cat peanuts

[Leviathan]

This had me wondering and I found the solution for ya Lev.

Looks like it would do the trick. Set that bad boy on pulse and fill it with salt water. May need to put some tarps down or play in the garage but the realism can't be beat.

And best of all, no need to mess with the cat

image.jpg

Not a bad idea but the cat is really looking forward to it

 

[Chilly Willy]

dont worry it dont take hourse unless both are very capable sailors then it might take a looooong time.

in the tournament i seal clubbed chilly willy and the next enemy bitch slaped me almost instantly.

 

[Sir. Cunningham]

Obviously for the game to be playable the controls for operating the ship have to be intuitive and rather simple, infact the way it is now seems spot on IMHO (judging from the videos and knowing what keys they're using to achieve this and that), however the game should obviously strive to have the ships behave as realistically as possible, e.g. ship speeds, turn rates, reload times etc etc. should all be as realistic as possible. And to be honest based on what I've seen so far that's also what we're going to get. In my opinion the devs have so far done an excellent job.

[Mageprince]

as long as the game is neither cod with sails or  EVE with boats i don't really care. To elaborate there's definitely finding a nice mix that can entice the average player and the enthusiast as well. The idea of a game, is that it is an distraction from life; while still being an enjoyment, so that definitely must mean this game can't be a true sim. however a game needs to have a challenge or the game won't have any play value (not replay just play value), so it can't be a interactive story (like cod). For instance i feel that UGG could have benefited more from having some more sim elements to it but that's just my preference.

[racketyjack]

defiantely would like the game to be a sim, at least as far as the ships and enviorment behave and interact. Sea swells, sounds, wind, currents would all be nice to have modeled. The ship should be influenced by these things as well as the skills, training, and motivation of the crew. I would like to see very realistic ship handling, gunnery, etc. Real world risks such as fire, mutiny, boarding, etc. would all be outstanding in my little world. I also know thats asking a lot of the devs. One of the nice things about DCS flight sim is that it can be scaled for the casual player and the simmer. Maybe that would be a good option here too.

[AmericanSailor98]

i think it should have a kind of "Arcade" game mode, and for more historical like "Realistic" or "Historical" game mode so every players would have their own preferred game mode.

[Bixol]

If you have 3 game modes, what will be played in open world? And why?

Or would you have 3 different wolrds?

[Mirones]

big no to arcade for that there is Potbs or AC4

 

open world and a matchplay system(currently seatrials) is what we get in the end

[Spankybus]

I am leaning to simulation, but not so much that you'd actually have to have served time in a tall ship to know what you are doing.

I'd like to have the option of deciding which sails to set, vs arbitrary speed settings...but people who prefer speed settings should have them and their sails trim automatically. Those who manually trim their sails might get an edge when matches with the same ship...or they might be at a disadvantage if they are setting their sails wrong...pressing her down, for example.

Sail evolutions should take time and crack crews should have an advantage, same for gun play....3 broadsides in 5 minutes would be considered fast historically, but we might count that as slow by in-game standards...again, brand new crew full of landsmen.

Guns can explode after prolongs engagements.

Two deckers should not be able to open their lower ports in running seas or when heeling...they could on the high side.

Supply's should matter to crew health and moral, which effects sail evolution and gunnery speed.

[Balck]

I am in the middle camp of the sim side.  With enough arcade sailing games on the market there's bound to be more than a few players pining for a bit more.  That being said, on average, two hours a night is all I'll be likely to devote to the game so full sim wouldn't be feasible nor desirable.  

[Flixerine]

I'd actually enjoy if there was a bit more realism to it, like in terms of fleet supplies, not unlimited ammo and food rations etc, so there would be a need to have a 'supply' fleet so to speak, which would also enable raiding said fleets. Just annoying things like distances, and repairs should maybe be sped up a little, I don't really feel like sitting in the middle of nowhere for several hours without meeting anyone.

 

But of course all within reasons of gameplay fun, so also 'solo' players can enjoy it.

[Devante del Nero]

My dream;

 

Mechanics: Realistic simulation -- realistic sailing, wind, physics, etc. strictly adhering to historical and physical accuracy

 

Game World: Player influenced -- customizable ships, flags, characters, ports, not strictly historic accuracy

 

Gameplay: Open world pve/pvp and also queue/lobby pve/pvp, player influenced (if not driven) economy, malleable reputation/loyalty mechanics

[Charles Vader]

I really don't know if such a topic has been raised before even though i'm reading most of them or at least trying to so moderators may remove it and provide me with a link in order to express my point of view there. 

My favorite topics to read are the ones in Shipyard section and i really admire people who are putting together some serious research in order to find numerous of different types of vessels along with ship plans escorting their topics. Also i pay attention on everyone's reply and i truly respect everyone opinion. Recently i have notice that people raise some thoughts about some kind of ships especially those which built before 1700 and if those ships should be added in game or not. Either because they will be outmatched by later built ships or because they had flaws like Wasa did.

I remember once a post by an admin saying that Naval Action is not going to be an age of sail simulator and that they will try to make this game as historical accurate it can be but in any case gameplay will and always should come first. At first when i red this was a little skeptical but then i came to a conclusion that indeed gameplay should come first and historical accuracy second. The reason is simple. If a game is lets say 80% historical accurate or less but gameplay rocks then people even those who insist in historical aspect of a game and details could overcome this and still enjoy their game. But when a game has crappy gameplay then most of the times is doomed to fail.

I honestly  believe that ships like Wasa for example or built before 1700 could make a great addition to this game. Their speed , firepower , maneuver characteristics might not be as accurate as they were for real providing players the opportunity to sail their favorite ship without lucking in terms of competitiveness with other similar ships later built and this even for those who are obsessed with historical accuracy is something that can be tolerable. Otherwise i suppose that we would all end up sailing the same ships just because their characteristics are superior just like in potbs was happening. In my opinion it would be better if players could have the choice to choose from different types of 3rd rate ships lets say, properly balanced each other.

This game has a great community and developers are doing great job taking advantage of this in good terms. So i honestly believe that we should let people hope of sailing their favorite ships even if this will not be historical accurate as long as it doesnt mess up Naval Action's gameplay and characteristics. 

Also one more comment since i dont post often enough.I  hope this game to become a great one attracting lots of people and i hope that when people who building this become a big company to not loose their interaction with such a great community. I'm only saying this because it's a common feature in lots of MMORPG out there. Uniting our efforts and love for age of sail era we may all achieve having a great game in every aspect.

Looking forward for your comments.

Edited February 28, 2015 by Charles Vane

[Brigand]

I've merged you post into the previous discussion on the same topic. You clearly gave this some thought, so let's give this some more discussion :-)

~Brigand

[SchurkjeBoefje]

My problem is that catering too much to gameplay will eventually turn it into an arcadeyfest where the devs will have to manually rebalance things 'for the sake of gameplay'.

 

 

I've had it up to here *holds hands above head* with developers (in general, not GL specifically) 'rebalancing'. 

 

 

Maybe it's just too optimistic to condense 200 years of naval technology into literally one arena, one timeperiod. Do it 'realistically' and the older ships will be crap, do it 'for balance' and well...once you start balancing, the end is always far away. What's the next thing to be balanced then? Manual balancing is a massively slippery slope. 

 

I agree that everyone sailing 'the latest and best' ship would not be conducive to varied gameplay, but the same can be said for 'manually rebalanced' ships with wildly varying looks but very similar performance 'because balance'. 

 

 

 

 

I don't want to see 1628 Vasa, a horribly flawed ship, have a fighting chance against a Vic or a Temeraire. That's idiotic imho. That's like making a tank game and wanting your Pz IV to perform like a T-54. Or your Spitfire to have F86 performance. 

Edited February 28, 2015 by SchurkjeBoefje

[Charles Vader]

So i suppose ships which are already released in alpha test perform based on how they were performing back then without any balance interference from developers? I think not. Otherwise Santisima would be docked in a port performing as a fort.  

[SchurkjeBoefje]

So i suppose ships which are already released in alpha test perform based on how they were performing back then without any balance interference from developers? I think not. Otherwise Santisima would be docked in a port performing as a fort.  

 

 

There's still a lot of progress to be made on the entire game which affects all ships. Like sailing models, damage models, etc etc.

 

 

I wouldn't be surprised if eventually in the open game, Santi would indeed be best used for that. Floating fort. 

[Dazzlin Flame]

Here is what I see, it should be closer to the way of simulation historical orientation, an importance on logistics, making sure you have sufficient supplies prior to a battle, like EVE. Come with too little ammo, and you're gonna have a problem. But in this game, coming with too much ammo could also be a problem, as your ammo could be struck, and it could make you explode. I want to be able and 'forced' to make important decisions that can have an impact on the outcome of things. 

Literally just heard about this game today, to what I've read it's orienting to be quite realistic in combat mechanics, I just hope there's a level of realism in the rest of the games world. I've been craving a naval game of this era that focused on realism, logistics, economy. Personally I want this to be as realistic as possible, maybe not in every sense of the word. But regarding the dangers and potential for gain on the high seas, think EVE but in the oceans instead of space. I want to have a player run economy, money and resources traveling around the high seas supplying player based projects and even wars. I want pirates to be a real danger to the careless on the high seas. I very much so hope that there isn't extreme 'barriers' and massive 'safezones' in this game that make pirates a non-issue that you can ignore, not matter what you're doing, or how you go about things. 

Also, please note I'm talking about pirates being pirate players, not random npc's. Sorry for the rant, but I got high hopes for this game already, and I hope I dont get dissapointed again. -stares at potbs, archeage, AC:4-

[StuffinBeard]

I voted for balanced but I would like to see some options for a lot more complex sailing as I get better at the game.

That being said sometimes just "having" to learn a complex system can be more satisfying in the end as long as it is intuitive. Pressing the 5 key then holding alt and right mouse click at same time in order to do something isn't realism to me.

By NO means do I want any auto aim or auto control type mechanic of any kind!

I have spent a couple of days here reading the forums lately (been following for a while now) and I have to say I have learn a lot about the game and the community. I hate to say this but by the game being closed for purchased has forced me to turn my enthusiasm to learning and not playing. I feel that when I get the chance to be a part of the game I will be way ahead of the game. Like how to be a good team player and how the game mechanics not only work in game but how they are based on real life parameters ( or perceived parameters) at least for the arena gameplay. I'm no noob to gaming but each game has its own quirks and especially one with a simulation aspect to it. Try flying the Huey in DCS with the realism all the way up. Whew I couldn't even get the damn thing started for 30 mins until I read a huey startup procedure! ( not recomending that game just a example) then try to get it off the ground without flipping it over! Anyway some really great reads here for anyone interested in this kind of sailing! This has been one of my favorite style of games so I'm hoping it pans out well.

[Elysion]

I put second to last, but with a strong leaning towards the full blown simulator. Logistics and planning should be very important to the outcome, and maneuvering properly should be critical to success, but i dont think the logistics and preparation should be modeled in a totally realistic way.

 

Id like to say that the actual engagements should be as realistic as it can possibly be made, but the preparation should be streamlined a little bit, not to the point that it throws you into battle at a highly accelerated frequency, but more that you dont have to calculate every single logistical detail, but can pay more attention to the overall picture instead.

Edited March 15, 2015 by Elysion

[SYN_Bloody-Bandy]

Maybe it's just too optimistic to condense 200 years of naval technology into literally one arena, one timeperiod. Do it 'realistically' and the older ships will be crap, do it 'for balance' and well...once you start balancing, the end is always far away. ...

I don't want to see 1628 Vasa, a horribly flawed ship, have a fighting chance against a Vic or a Temeraire. That's idiotic imho. ...

 

Agreed.  While the older ships (like Vasa and other 1600's era) are beautiful, they are completely anachronistic if sailed with the likes of Napoleonic-era ships.  

 

If the devs and community absolutely want them in game (they'll die without them, oh the drama), then perhaps consider creating a time-line in the persistent world to work through the styles and technological changes.  Many more ships then.  Not a bad idea, but would take a heck of a lot longer to get released.

 

The "hard" time limits for inclusion should be more exclusive, but that's just IMHO, and since people seem to have been voting towards the more realistic end of the poll, I'm surprised to see so many old ships being advocated...

[Austrum]

If the game goes full on simulation, I am out.

 

Honestly I am not sure why the devs are having this poll now.  They need a much, much larger player base in order to get any sort of realistic results.  I mean lets face it, right now the player base mostly consists of hardcore age of sail fans and they naturally are going to be be drawn to wanting the game to be very much a simulator however, the vast majority of people who might end up playing this game, aren't going to be in to that.  Most are going to to want to relatively casually have fun.

 

Sorry guys, but the reality is, unless you are prepared to devote your life to the game, full simulations are not fun.  Anything more difficult than what we currently have in game is going to turn off the vast majority of player who might otherwise have gotten involved.