World Ceasefire Declared - Hostilities stop on Monday.

[Cornelis Evertsen de Oude]

18 hours ago, admin said:

We don't have OUR theory .. There is universal theory.
What we meant is this - If all things with the hull are being equal then the longer ship will have faster speed 
Hull speed is the maximum theoretical speed. Meaning whatever your Block coefficient is, whatever your sail power is, you wont ever exceed hull speed, because that`s how it works. 

Below that speed many other things matter. But the max possible speed for the ship is determined by its hull length https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hull_speed 
Of course this is 18/19th century theory has been improved later - but we are in the 18/19th century right?

What people are complaining about that the 14th meter wide Redoutable is faster than another 14 meter wide, shorter ship. And they both correct and are incorrect too, as until we have variable wind and ability to set sails individually and until the safety is removed (ability to capsize your ship with too much sails), we will always have these discussions. But everybody know that if we remove safety (ships start to capsize due to too much sail) we will remove many players too (sea legends will have proper model in this regard)

Let's keep this conversation on earth shall we😉

[Forbin]

6 hours ago, Cornelis Evertsen de Oude said:

Let's keep this conversation on earth shall we😉

[mexicanbatman]

patch tommorow?

 

[Cap Trujis]

Limpie el mapa por favor, no puedo ver los remedios en danés xD

Edited May 25, 2020 by Cap Trujis

[ChineseBatman]

2 hours ago, Cap Trujis said:

Limpie el mapa por favor, no puedo ver los remedios en danés xD

Nice English 👌

[Macjimm]

On 5/22/2020 at 10:29 AM, admin said:

We don't have OUR theory .. There is universal theory.
What we meant is this - If all things with the hull are being equal then the longer ship will have faster speed 
Hull speed is the maximum theoretical speed. Meaning whatever your Block coefficient is, whatever your sail power is, you wont ever exceed hull speed, because that`s how it works. 

Below that speed many other things matter. But the max possible speed for the ship is determined by its hull length https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hull_speed 
Of course this is 18/19th century theory has been improved later - but we are in the 18/19th century right?

What people are complaining about that the 14th meter wide Redoutable is faster than another 14 meter wide, shorter ship. And they both correct and are incorrect too, as until we have variable wind and ability to set sails individually and until the safety is removed (ability to capsize your ship with too much sails), we will always have these discussions. But everybody know that if we remove safety (ships start to capsize due to too much sail) we will remove many players too (sea legends will have proper model in this regard)

I appreciate your effort to clarify your thoughts.  It's interesting and thoughful.

Too bad that many of the children in game seem to think that you are talking-down to them when you use words with more than one syllable.   Perhaps if we removed players by creating proper models, their absence would attract intellegent ones.

 

[BoatyMcBoatFace]

2 hours ago, Cap Trujis said:

Clean the map please, I can't see the remedies in Danish xD

u see a lot more in danish soon............... aaajajajajja

[erelkivtuadrater]

8 hours ago, Chungus said:

maybe in 42 weeks

didnt specify which monday 25th though, might be 2020 or 2026

Edited May 25, 2020 by erelkivtuadrater

[mikawa]

Why so pessimistic?

I am curious how the new flag mechanics will work ...

Just be a bit patient and lets test it. There are so many faces in this game where *players behaviour* makes the difference, so lets be fair and do less think about game mechanics and do more think about your own behaviour. If everybody just looks at his own advantage this may be a cruel less enjoyable environment for others; it has much of our real world - it's the tiny things which might ruin a game players experience - being sunk because an overpowered ship enters a fair 1 vs 1 battle, being sunk a few sea miles before your home town after traveling across the map to make some profit of a trading good, being ganked by 5 ships while you are in your very fast trinco with poods on it ...

[Sir Max Magic]

On 5/20/2020 at 10:38 PM, rediii said:

And you think that eill change? Hahaha

Now its easier for a small group to conquer the map. Say bye to new players because who needs them now anyway where numbers dont matter anymore

So true +1  

..and this coming from one of the best captains and Port Battle Commanders we have in the game yet...with a highly professional and trained crew behind him, who would be a winner of the change...

 

Big respect to you, @rediii for caring for the welfare of the ENTIRE game  

[Malcolm3]

16 minutes ago, RepairyMcRepairous said:

Lol, test whats already been tested and failed

I think most wont bother xdd

They probably changed it, so better wait for new conquest system and blame it only after proper testing

[Busterbloodvessel]

Ok, its Monday.

NA in Lockdown for Caribbean Flu. 

Initial indications are:

Dentine Pump Seals leaking

Toredo worm infestation into ships biscuits

Need to open windows for ventilation

Masked men onboard.

 

All ships stay in port.

No ships to sail within twice the grappling reach

No RvR, No PvP … PvE only within you own nation.

 

Failure to comply will result in first rate DLCifiction.

Buff up your traders lynx and get you flag holders ready.

By Order of

Buster (Bank Holiday admin)

Edited May 25, 2020 by Busterbloodvessel

[Conte D. Catellani]

Since there was no patch today, was it so terrible to remove hostility missions when you announced it?
Yesterday we had fun against the REDS but honestly it wouldn't have been bad to have two other ports south of Cuba ...

[Archaos]

50 minutes ago, Conte D. Catellani said:

Since there was no patch today, was it so terrible to remove hostility missions when you announced it?
Yesterday we had fun against the REDS but honestly it wouldn't have been bad to have two other ports south of Cuba ...

They never said there was going to be a patch today. The OP only said they were removing hostility missions today. Maybe they need no hostility generated or outstanding before they introduce new RvR mechanics, or maybe even they want to give people a rest from RvR for a while.  We do not know till they provide us with more information.

[erelkivtuadrater]

we all know the true reason they disabled hostility missions is to stop Poland expanding

[van Veen]

On 5/22/2020 at 7:29 PM, admin said:

We don't have OUR theory .. There is universal theory.
What we meant is this - If all things with the hull are being equal then the longer ship will have faster speed 
Hull speed is the maximum theoretical speed. Meaning whatever your Block coefficient is, whatever your sail power is, you wont ever exceed hull speed, because that`s how it works. 

Below that speed many other things matter. But the max possible speed for the ship is determined by its hull length https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hull_speed 
Of course this is 18/19th century theory has been improved later - but we are in the 18/19th century right?

Since you cross-linked the wikipedia entry, you should know that the hull length is by no means a hard limit to ship speed, as mentioned by @Archaos. So what is your point? 

[Aquillas]

On 5/23/2020 at 10:08 AM, admin said:

that was indeed a good link @Archaos

send me more in pm if you have! we are collecting those. 

Also, something really noticeable is the ship heel when turning sharp. And this also should impact the speed a lot (breaking Kinetic energy).

Whit such heel than herebelow, I don't think that a ship can fire a broadside anywhere else than at 5 feet from hull.

(NB: I know that USS Nimitz is not a Snow...)

 

Edited May 25, 2020 by Aquillas

[van Veen]

On 5/23/2020 at 1:35 PM, Archaos said:

I agree with what you say, my point was a bit simplistic to indicate that just looking at length to breadth ratio and block coefficient does not tell you how fast a ship will be as that depends on the motive power. For sails, as I mentioned, you cannot just keep adding more and expect to go faster as other factors come into play, in the same way for modern ships you cannot keep increasing engine power to go faster as you have to consider the increased weight and "hull speed", although "hull speed" is not a limit and ships can exceed it.

The naval architect has to play around with all these figures when designing a vessel and there are always compromises made to achieve the optimal design for a particular vessel. In the case of super tankers one of the main requirements is cargo carrying capacity, the size of them increased during the Suez crisis when the canal was closed so oil from the Arabian Gulf had to be transported round the cape which was a much longer trip but speed was not essential if they could carry more. For fruit trades the ships needed to be quick as well as carry cargo so you get a finer form with a much lower block coefficient, its all a balance and the same types of compromises were made with ship designs in the age of sail.

Edit: on a side note another interesting article I came across regarding maneuverability of sailing warships

https://www.cnrs-scrn.org/northern_mariner/vol14/tnm_14_3_57-68.pdf 

For those interested in the subject here is another article regarding sail warship design

https://research-information.bris.ac.uk/files/34486018/247182.pdf

If you like it a bit more technical then there is this article

https://www.mpiwg-berlin.mpg.de/sites/default/files/Preprints/P308.pdf

For those interested in a simple explanation of bogus hull speed limit watch this video

 

Thank you for the interesting links. o7

Don't you think that sail area to displacement ratio is a better concept for sail ships than the motive power alone? I mean, you already said that motive power cannot be increased easily, so putting it in relation to something might be the better approach. Sail area correlates with the motive power and displacement increases the wetted area and thus drag. I found that parameter quite helpful with modern sail boats to get a quick idea of their speed capability and found it well correlates with yardstick tables (which are simplistic and old-fashioned, I know, but still good fun when you don't take racing too seriously). 

Edited May 25, 2020 by van Veen

[admin]

1 hour ago, van Veen said:

Since you cross-linked the wikipedia entry, you should know that the hull length is by no means a hard limit to ship speed, as mentioned by @Archaos. So what is your point? 

Hull speed is a 18th century understanding of speed and could be used in games about 18th century. Captain of that time had limited understanding of sailing behavior and should not use modern theories on seamanship. Froude who advanced these theories was just [-5] years old when Trafalgar happened. It was all found later.

What is your point of arguing? Its just seems you are arguing for the sake of arguing - which leads me to believe you are just a veiled hater who just tries to sneak "AHA THEY ARE WRONG" statement in every post you can. 

[Luvstruck]

I'd be happy to see ramming do damage... so when small ships try and cut in front of big ships, crunch....

 

[Luvstruck]

27 minutes ago, admin said:

Hull speed is a 18th century understanding of speed and could be used in games about 18th century. Captain of that time had limited understanding of sailing behavior and should not use modern theories on seamanship. Froude who advanced these theories was just [-5] years old when Trafalgar happened. It was all found later.

What is your point of arguing? Its just seems you are arguing for the sake of arguing - which leads me to believe you are just a veiled hater who just tries to sneak "AHA THEY ARE WRONG" statement in every post you can. 

I'd wager that captains of the 18th century had THE best knowledge of sailing and the effects of on speed.

[Nixolai]

9 minutes ago, Luvstruck said:

I'd be happy to see ramming do damage... so when small ships try and cut in front of big ships, crunch....

 

the ship just flips over xd

[Redman29]

15 minutes ago, Luvstruck said:

I'd be happy to see ramming do damage... so when small ships try and cut in front of big ships, crunch....

 

Oh please no. This was in game once and led to the most griefing there was as well as some of the most fun I've ever had. (A swarm of cutters ramming and sinking a Connie was hilariously fun but not good gameplay). 

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

27 minutes ago, Luvstruck said:

I'd wager that captains of the 18th century had THE best knowledge of sailing and the effects of on speed.

Not so linear and would vary a great deal. Same ship on the hands of different crews would behave different in records. A captain would report it as a horrible post while another would report her as capable and with proof to back it up. ( HMS Nymphe comes to mind, previously French La Nymphe )

Force that propels the ship is well above water unlike post sail ships. At the same time rudder work also changed a big deal, as a propeller will create enough flow for rudder action while sailing rudder depends on wind to induce motion and thus flow. ( reason why many 18th century captains often used more rig than rudder ).

In any case, truth is Drake voyages compared to the modern ( 70's ) Golden Hind crew. Captain said that there's too much we don't know and that it would require an entire lifetime of seamanship under sail - which is true for any age of sail contemporary. But that is not a validation that they knew why a hull was this shape or the mast 7 hands longer.

But is all good natured exchange of information, let not opposition to game design decisions obscure that is the best so far. Also technology limits to simulate it all might be a hindrance ( hence Sea Legends might be a simulator that NA isn't ) and the basis of age of sail naval combat is in NA, despite all the mmo gear galore.

Some like more authenticity theme, others with more fantastical elements. All good. Place for all in both servers.

 

Edited May 25, 2020 by Hethwill

[Malcolm3]

46 minutes ago, admin said:

Hull speed is a 18th century understanding of speed and could be used in games about 18th century. Captain of that time had limited understanding of sailing behavior and should not use modern theories on seamanship. Froude who advanced these theories was just [-5] years old when Trafalgar happened. It was all found later.

Actually this is not about captain knowing (or not knowing) of his ship speed qualities, but about this qualitis as they are.
Problem here is that to achieve realistic results your sailing model must be as close to reality as possible. That means you should use modern theory describing movements of hull underwater, ship speed etc., not the 18th century ones (British scientists have built worse ship then professional shipwright).
And besides hull shape there were other factors defining speed (sail pressure, mast rakes, trim difference etc...)

P.S. For me current sailing model is good enough (though not without some flaws). There are other more important things to do.