Report for griefing Capt Hardy and Richard Caley

[Earl of Grey]

6 minutes ago, Despe said:

This section is for reporting players with abusive actions. What they think or what those players want is not my business

But it should be ... I See you often reporting in tribunal .... seems there is something what makes you a prefered victim ... think about it 🤔

[Despe]

16 minutes ago, Earl of Grey said:

I See you often reporting in tribunal .... seems there is something what makes you a prefered victim

What kind of response is that? Not victimism here, if i see an abusive behaviour i report it, and you shoud do the same. I post on tribunal in the last months 3 times, 2 reports in which tribunal take actions vs players reported, and one asking for a possible exploit.

Do you think it is wrong reporting players with abusive behaviors?

Edited December 19, 2019 by Despe

[Chromey]

Russia has best players so this must be grief

[Thonys]

one of my clanmates in battle yesterday

after 1 hour 20 minutes and he did not call it griefing but a good fight

its all in the mind i say.

Edited December 19, 2019 by Thonys

[Earl of Grey]

26 minutes ago, Despe said:

 

Do you think it is wrong reporting players with abusive behaviors?

1. Not sure If we have abusive behavior here. The grey zone is huge ... and all is depending in their subjektive motive ... maybe they reallly thought your mast will break soon or sth. 

2. Reporting clear violations of rules is useless here, so why reporting things that are almost Impossible to prove ...?

3. If you report and nothing happens (best you can Hope is a warning) didnt you make it worse?

 

[Despe]

2 minutes ago, Thonys said:

one of my clanmates in battle

after 1 hour 20 minutes and he did not call it griefing but a good fight

its all in the mind i say.

This is an screenshot and i put a video.

If is ok for your mate, dont means that it must be ok for me.

[Thonys]

1 minute ago, Despe said:

This is an screenshot and i put a video.

If is ok for your mate, dont means that it must be ok for me.

that's the point really

sometimes ....you can't have it.... your way

leave it alone and carry on to more successful fights

 

[Despe]

3 minutes ago, Earl of Grey said:

1. Not sure If we have abusive behavior here. The grey zone is huge ... and all is depending in their subjektive motive ... maybe they reallly thought your mast will break soon or sth. 

I can be agree with that. And I think that we as a community have a duty to contribute with our posts so that those gray areas disappear, which will help to balance the game.

6 minutes ago, Earl of Grey said:

2. Reporting clear violations of rules is useless here, so why reporting things that are almost Impossible to prove ...?

One video is a proof.

 

7 minutes ago, Earl of Grey said:

3. If you report and nothing happens (best you can Hope is a warning) didnt you make it worse?

nothing happens? If there is griefing we will know more clearly what griefing is. If is not, the same.

I think that the rules of this are not clear at all and if posts like this help to clarify, it's good for everyone.

[Despe]

6 minutes ago, Thonys said:

that's the point really

sometimes ....you can't have it.... your way

leave it alone and carry on to more successful fights

 

I put a video and you put one screenshot. Put a video and i can give you my opinion if the situation is the same or not.

[Thonys]

6 minutes ago, Despe said:

I put a video and you put one screenshot. Put a video and i can give you my opinion if the situation is the same or not.

imposible 

you of all know that every handmade croquetas you make,  is different from the other one .

[Despe]

8 minutes ago, Thonys said:

imposible 

So is irrelevant them, not comparable.

[Thonys]

2 minutes ago, Despe said:

So is irrelevant them, not comparable.

exactly,.. not every  fight is the same.

even if you splat or flatten a croqueta there are still the same ingredients and still can eat it .

but you can't sell it to the public .

 

Edited December 19, 2019 by Thonys

[Angus MacDuff]

3 pages of good argument on both sides!  Hopefully @Ink will settle it soon (maybe he's on holiday).  Personally, I feel that they should have either pressed the fight to a conclusion or disengaged.  A Herc with 65% sails is a juicy target for a Prince.  The rules are quite clear.  If it is not your intention to fight, then it's griefing.  I don't believe that assaulting the sails for 1.5 hours is intent to fight.  They deserve a warning and perhaps a firm finger shaking!

[Gregory Rainsborough]

It looks like they're just taking their time. They're in range of longs but outside carros.

Maybe use longs in future?

[Despe]

8 minutes ago, Gregory Rainsborough said:

Maybe use longs in future?

yeah, longs are very good for tagging snows 1:30 hours

[Earl of Grey]

40 minutes ago, Angus MacDuff said:

 @Ink

The rules are quite clear.  If it is not your intention to fight, then it's griefing.  

Is this clear? Whats about Screening? Whats about waiting for reinforcement? Whats about Holding in Battle until retag-fleet outside is ready? 

From time to time i meet players they complaining that they already have 50/100/200 masthits and my mast didnt break... they just dont know that a counted hit means nothing If He dont pen ... 

 

[Despe]

21 minutes ago, Earl of Grey said:

Whats about Screening?

Is not my case

21 minutes ago, Earl of Grey said:

Whats about waiting for reinforcement?

only the 20 first minutes, after this no reiforcement possible, battle is closed. And in my case after battle thay go to port, no reiforcements in OW.

[Angus MacDuff]

56 minutes ago, Earl of Grey said:

Is this clear? Whats about Screening? Whats about waiting for reinforcement? Whats about Holding in Battle until retag-fleet outside is ready? 

From time to time i meet players they complaining that they already have 50/100/200 masthits and my mast didnt break... they just dont know that a counted hit means nothing If He dont pen ... 

 

I said the rule is clear.  I didn't say everybody agrees with it.  Many will say it is perfectly acceptable to drag major warships into a battle and hold them there for screening purposes.  That is an argument for another thread (IMHO) and does not apply here.  The reinforcement argument is no longer valid after 20 minutes and again...not applicable here.

[Hullabaloo]

I got tagged by the same Prince 5 times in a row yesterday. The first 3 just to keep me in place til his mates arrived the 4th and 5th when he tried (and failed) to chain me down so they could catch. They didn't even get close. In the final battle I repped only once and after over an hour my sails were at 98%. It took over 2 hours until they finally gave up. Theoretically they could have done it for another 2. You might argue that they did nothing wrong but if so then there is something fundamentally wrong with ROE atm where someone can waste hour after hour of your game-time with very little possibility of an end result.

I understand that it is very difficult to apply concrete rules to this. I would suggest an 'ungentlemanly conduct' (very British lol) rule where a common sense ruling is made on a case by case basis. 

In Despe's case imo they wasted an unreasonable amount of time on something that had very little chance of success and that should qualify as 'griefing'.

Either that or change the ROE

Edited December 19, 2019 by Hullabaloo

[Henry d'Esterre Darby]

Locked, looking at the posts for cleanup.

[Ink]

Based on provided evidence and additional investigation there are no sufficient facts to consider violation of rules (griefing) to be true. Based on video both sides had their chances, it wasn't a fight from 1 km, ships recieve damage through the whole battle length.

Thus the case is closed.