nerf dissatisfaction with delivery missions.

[Oli Garchy]

1 hour ago, Beeekonda said:

untrue

aye and has been untrue for over 3 years

[furyGer]

I am happy with the new delivery missions. Money is enough and dublones are ok with 500 and how much they are. Passengers are now a good alternative for more safety tours, but cargo is rentable too. Nobody must earn 2 million in an hour with 3 or 4 indiamans. Let's try so..

[EliotXII]

3 hours ago, admin said:

As we said before.. we brought back some doubloons to missions with a decent chance. This is the best we can do to control inflation. Reals will stay on the low side. 
 

It is still weak compared to what it was before, if they had reduced the dbls from 1000 to 800, it would even be understandable. to 500 is much lower than expected, and the actual now 62K limit will greatly limit the buying power of the player. Before the missions were not wrong, they were not bad and nothing in the market price was so high (inflated) that no one could buy, the most expensive Tier 1 was 4KK a few weeks, and now has risen to 6KK.
 

[Beeekonda]

2 hours ago, EliotXII said:

It is still weak compared to what it was before, if they had reduced the dbls from 1000 to 800, it would even be understandable. to 500 is much lower than expected, and the actual now 62K limit will greatly limit the buying power of the player. Before the missions were not wrong, they were not bad and nothing in the market price was so high (inflated) that no one could buy, the most expensive Tier 1 was 4KK a few weeks, and now has risen to 6KK
 

How do you think What is the reason people put those ships for 4kk or 6kk?

[Liq]

On 10/23/2019 at 5:57 PM, Williamsen said:

And to the people who keep saying you can hunt ships for those doubloons, I capped and killed a combined 8 ships yesterday evening, and I got a total of about 500 doubloons. Its just not a viable way.

Did some nassau pz in cheap ships, 6 kills granted me a total of about 8k dubs

[Red Tail]

💨
capped npc traider with 2k doubs on it. and git 2.5k doubs from 2 NPC 4 rates. in a row
 

[EliotXII]

1 hour ago, Beeekonda said:

How do you think What is the reason people put those ships for 4kk or 6kk?

I did not understand your logic.
I said before nerf the most expensive Tier 1 ship was 4KK.
Now a few days after the nerf already arrived at 6KK.
What I think caused it? the reduction in the cost of winning the missions either in reals or in doubles, but did not reduce the production or upgrade cost of the factories. the manufacturer has to repay this cost to someone, and guess who he will stick ....

[EliotXII]

42 minutes ago, Liq said:

Did some nassau pz in cheap ships, 6 kills granted me a total of about 8k dubs

I also did PvE, killed 3, almost lost my ship to one of them and only managed to get the loot of one, so it's unfeasible for me.

[Cetric de Cornusiac]

There are enough other sources for doubloons. Go discover them.

[Beeekonda]

13 minutes ago, EliotXII said:

I did not understand your logic.
I said before nerf the most expensive Tier 1 ship was 4KK.
Now a few days after the nerf already arrived at 6KK.
What I think caused it? the reduction in the cost of winning the missions either in reals or in doubles, but did not reduce the production or upgrade cost of the factories. the manufacturer has to repay this cost to someone, and guess who he will stick ....

There was no logic behind 4kk reals for a first rate before new patch 

There is no logic behind 6kk reals for a first rate after new patch

Retards are retards, 4th grade math is too hard for the majority of this community. 

In other words - everything you complaining about in this thread is irrelevant and is not going to change anything. 

 

[HachiRoku]

7 hours ago, Sir Max Magic said:

Seriously, i never get this inflation mystic !!

The same as in real life there will ALWAYS be very rich people who are controlling more or less the market...and those people will stay rich no matter what you do !

The only people you will hurt ith your deflation tactic are the poorer ones, for which its now much harder to get mines, farms, shipyards...and all the other basic stuff like cannons, repairs, even crew

 

I remember BEFORE you introduced the delivery missions, the economy was starving and especially new players struggled to replace a lost ship even from admirality !! Okay, thank God, those times are gone, but why always reverting the wheel ?

Let people be happy with a full pocket and when the prices go up in the following? Who cares because people have also more money !!

 

But the most important things is:

when people have more money, they can replace basic stuff more easily, can build farm, mines, shipyards more easily...and are not so scared about losing ships because of gankers !!

 

I seiously dont understand your attitude also in this area

How do you think inflation should be solved? As long as missions give you money there will be major inflation. Its like printing loads of money. Imo player production makes it worse because in the old system you had to return some of that gold to the ai at least. Economy is very complicated and its very likely that no one on these forums is qualified to design it. Including the devs. Games and real life have nothing in common because in real life there must be deficit were there is profit. Not everyone can get rich in real life but in game everyone can. The only way to improve the economy is to increase the gold grind. I doubt that people will welcome that. People cry that inflation is to high yet also cry when gold is to hard yo get. It's one or the other so choose. 

[Alvar]

1 hour ago, HachiRoku said:

¿Cómo crees que se debe resolver la inflación? Mientras las misiones te den dinero, habrá una gran inflación. Es como imprimir montones de dinero. La producción de Imo Player empeora porque en el antiguo sistema tenías que devolver parte de ese oro al ai al menos. La economía es muy complicada y es muy probable que nadie en estos foros esté calificado para diseñarla. Incluyendo los desarrolladores. Los juegos y la vida real no tienen nada en común porque en la vida real debe haber déficit donde haya ganancias. No todos pueden enriquecerse en la vida real, pero en el juego todos pueden. La única forma de mejorar la economía es aumentar la rutina del oro. Dudo que la gente lo agradezca. La gente llora porque la inflación es demasiado alta pero también llora cuando el oro es muy difícil de conseguir. Es uno u otro, así que elige. 

To reduce inflation, they don't just have to reduce money. They should also reduce cost prices, such as building a shipyard and others. If not is absolutely stupid

[znôrt]

from the perspective of a solo player, fwiw: 
(hey, i'm still a full 1/500 of the playerbase!)

i used to craft my own ships, 1s rates and all, but since port bonuses and wood lock-out that obviously went out of the window.

the ship market i see like always: loads of crappy ships for relatively cheap, and very few fine ones with impossible prices. as has been for years, really, the market has never been a reliable source of ships.

i only do pve and pvp combat and with the rate reals come in there is no way i'm going to spend 2m on a ship which i will probably sink before a week passes. so the only use i have for ship market is to occasionally buy a trader or some cheap version of a ship i like just to get knowledge up with it.

i also suspect (warning, speculation ahead) that since crafting is now a clan thing, ships are provided to clan members completely bypassing the market, which just makes economic sense.

so you guys might be terrified by inflation but from my perspective it doesn't matter, the ship market is as useless as it has always been. now without crafting i just stick to dlc ships and what i can cap. the good side of crap/repeatable ships is that you don't worry about loosing them.

if you ask me, ships are still far too valuable. fear of loss is still a barrier for happy pvping. funny how devs keep tweaking the map and roe to foster more pvp and messing around with numbers to try to revive a non-existent economy while completely missing the point. i still enjoy the game, though.

my 0.00000002 doblones.

[John Cavanaugh]

1 hour ago, znôrt said:

from the perspective of a solo player, fwiw: 
(hey, i'm still a full 1/500 of the playerbase!)

i used to craft my own ships, 1s rates and all, but since port bonuses and wood lock-out that obviously went out of the window.

the ship market i see like always: loads of crappy ships for relatively cheap, and very few fine ones with impossible prices. as has been for years, really, the market has never been a reliable source of ships.

i only do pve and pvp combat and with the rate reals come in there is no way i'm going to spend 2m on a ship which i will probably sink before a week passes. so the only use i have for ship market is to occasionally buy a trader or some cheap version of a ship i like just to get knowledge up with it.

i also suspect (warning, speculation ahead) that since crafting is now a clan thing, ships are provided to clan members completely bypassing the market, which just makes economic sense.

so you guys might be terrified by inflation but from my perspective it doesn't matter, the ship market is as useless as it has always been. now without crafting i just stick to dlc ships and what i can cap. the good side of crap/repeatable ships is that you don't worry about loosing them.

if you ask me, ships are still far too valuable. fear of loss is still a barrier for happy pvping. funny how devs keep tweaking the map and roe to foster more pvp and messing around with numbers to try to revive a non-existent economy while completely missing the point. i still enjoy the game, though.

my 0.00000002 doblones.

Adding to this as a solo player (hey that makes 1/250)

no trading outside of selling hull repairs in freeports, about 1kk a week income, no ships owned above 5th rate. I disagree that the ship market is useless if you can buy from crafting ports like baracoa. Decent ships at feasible prices do come along now and then. Hercules is bread and butter for this reason. It’s a consequence of being solo, and ships are easy enough to steal around pve ports that it’s not a huge problem. Choose the solo life and you need to accept the high risk pirate way of playing. This is fine. For solo players with no DLC, though, the hurdle must be immense. 

Inb4 the “join a clan if you want nice things” argument. Try joining a clan in most nations. You get called an alt most of the time. 

 

[John Cavanaugh]

5 hours ago, HachiRoku said:

How do you think inflation should be solved? As long as missions give you money there will be major inflation. Its like printing loads of money. Imo player production makes it worse because in the old system you had to return some of that gold to the ai at least. Economy is very complicated and its very likely that no one on these forums is qualified to design it. Including the devs. Games and real life have nothing in common because in real life there must be deficit were there is profit. Not everyone can get rich in real life but in game everyone can. The only way to improve the economy is to increase the gold grind. I doubt that people will welcome that. People cry that inflation is to high yet also cry when gold is to hard yo get. It's one or the other so choose. 

Supply and demand is relatively simple. There is no scarcity for basic shipbuilding resources outside of doubloons. Upgrades are a functional market, draw from this. I remember the iron and hemp shortage in GB in early 2016, when there were no buildings for resources. Either all items must be gotten from AI in the same way as for upgrades (raise prices and sink reals out of market) or make all things tied to building resource,(drive all costs down and let more people have nice things). 

Scarcity and fight for resources drives RVR. Universal plenty creates complacency and boredom 

[znôrt]

10 minutes ago, John Cavanaugh said:

Adding to this as a solo player (hey that makes 1/250)

no trading outside of selling hull repairs in freeports, about 1kk a week income, no ships owned above 5th rate. I disagree that the ship market is useless if you can buy from crafting ports like baracoa. Decent ships at feasible prices do come along now and then. Hercules is bread and butter for this reason. It’s a consequence of being solo, and ships are easy enough to steal around pve ports that it’s not a huge problem. Choose the solo life and you need to accept the high risk pirate way of playing. This is fine. For solo players with no DLC, though, the hurdle must be immense. 

Inb4 the “join a clan if you want nice things” argument. Try joining a clan in most nations. You get called an alt most of the time. 

 

yes, dlc are a huge help, and i guess that's exactly the reason why ships can be grinded to op levels and these are scarce, so you can pay for a shortcut at least until mid-game. personally i'm quite sick of this tendency in games in general but i've become quite adept at playing around this. that said, i'll check in more crafting ports more often, just in case ... 🤞

[Beeekonda]

7 hours ago, Alvar said:

To reduce inflation, they don't just have to reduce money. They should also reduce cost prices, such as building a shipyard and others. If not is absolutely stupid

Do you understand that devs dont make prices? Its people. And if people will not start doing basic math inflation is not going anyway regardless of changes? 

 

Edited October 26, 2019 by Beeekonda

[Raekur]

33 minutes ago, Beeekonda said:

Do you understand that devs dont make prices? Its people. And if people will not start doing basic math inflation is not going anyway regardless of changes? 

 

Wow, guess I was totally wrong when I thought it was the devs who put the price for a level 3 shipyard to 3 MILLION real and 50000 doub. Thanks for clearing that up.

(next time, read what the person has actually written instead of just ignoring it)

[Beeekonda]

2 hours ago, Raekur said:

Wow, guess I was totally wrong when I thought it was the devs who put the price for a level 3 shipyard to 3 MILLION real and 50000 doub. Thanks for clearing that up.

(next time, read what the person has actually written instead of just ignoring it)

Explain how do you sell level 3 shipyard please?

(next time, read what the person has actually written instead of just ignoring it)

[Raekur]

1 hour ago, Beeekonda said:

Explain how do you sell level 3 shipyard please?

(next time, read what the person has actually written instead of just ignoring it)

The question was: 

To reduce inflation, they don't just have to reduce money. They should also reduce cost prices, such as building a shipyard and others. If not is absolutely stupid

Your answer was:

Do you understand that devs dont make prices? Its people. And if people will not start doing basic math inflation is not going anyway regardless of changes? 

 

Devs DO MAKE the prices for ALL buildings which which was what Alvar was referring to if that is unclear to you. What does the cost of a building have to do with people?

Crafters build ships and the prices they charge are a direct result of the cost involved in the purchase price for the buildings and the cost of gathering resources. My guess is that you have not done either otherwise you would understand this a lot more than your responses indicate. 

So here are a few numbers for you to consider:

To get a level 1 in the resource production to build ships (not counting wood beyond fir and oak) is 565000 real.

To get a level 2 in the same is 1,400,000 real for a total of 1,965,000

This usually is enough to handle most low level crafters. Now add the cost of the shipyard 3 and you have 6,215,000 plus about 60,000 doubloons. This is not taking into account fair compensation for the time and lost resources along the way or the cost of the rare woods that people want the ships built from (teak alone is 500,000 for a level 2 which only produces 800 per day)

ALL of those prices are set by the developers not the players or do you think that a crafters efforts should be for free so you dont have to pay a fair price for a ship??

[IceBurg]

On 10/26/2019 at 12:13 AM, Beeekonda said:

untrue

I say its right on, in fact how can you argue that when people have more money they can replace basic stuff is UNtrue? look at your number of posts, its this 1% mentality that makes this game continue to loss ppl, 

Saying ppl can't replace stuff if they have more money in their pocket is untrue, what a joke

[Bluetooth]

Economy missions are now balanced.

New players can earn some relatively safe cash and alts can't earn as much as before. Nice balance.

Thanks devs for adjusting this.

[John Cavanaugh]

8 hours ago, Intrepido said:

I remember upgrades costing me several times the price of my ship.

 

Dont think the word functional is the most appropiate one.

It is a thriving market then. Many people compete to purchase the necessary resources, and are then able to sell a completed product at a profit. Large amounts of reals leave the market in player - environment purchases so reducing inflation caused by money minting missions. 

Compare to ship market, where most ships you’ll find are either sold at loss to recoup crafting costs, at exorbitant prices (see national capitals and LT) or are AI captured boats being sold at whatever price the market will bear. Where there is no resource competition whatsoever outside of buy contracts for doubloons, and little cost besides this after the start up cost. 

Another functional market is hull repairs. Many purchase cheaply in national capitals and resell elsewhere. Purchase hull repairs in LT, so close to a capital. From average 150 reals cost to 550-650 sale price. Go to Dariena, and they are 1100+. Supply and demand. 

[Beeekonda]

2 hours ago, IceBurg said:

I say its right on, in fact how can you argue that when people have more money they can replace basic stuff is UNtrue? look at your number of posts, its this 1% mentality that makes this game continue to loss ppl, 

Saying ppl can't replace stuff if they have more money in their pocket is untrue, what a joke

With the amount of time I play I have:

Rank - Scourge: 900 crew

I do have LVL 3 Shipyard, Forge, Workshop, Teak and Live Oak forest as well as other farms. My docks are full of ships I do PVP almost exclusively and I do die a lot, because I sail solo. I dont have problems replacing my ships/mods. I do have around 5mil total across all accounts with ~80k dubs stocked. 

Your post and the majority of other posts in this and similar topics are just whining.

People unable to make simple math to calculate how much they need to replace a ship is just ridiculous. 

Current price making looks like this "I saw trinco in the store for 2mil so Im gonna sell mine for 1.999.999 because reasons"

 

[Beeekonda]

9 hours ago, Raekur said:

 

ALL of those prices are set by the developers not the players or do you think that a crafters efforts should be for free so you dont have to pay a fair price for a ship??

4,250,000 lvl3 shipyard
1,650,000 lvl3 teak
1,650,000 lvl3 wo
1,750,000 lvl3 iron

9,300,000 total

prices for a 1st rate strating from 4mil

9,300,000/4,000,000 = 2.325 First rates 

2.325 * 224030 = 520870

9.3kk + 521000 = 9821000 <- this number divided by 4mil (price for lOcean) = 2.45 

2.45 L'Oceans sold by the price of 4mil is equal or almost equal for an entire production chain. 

 

Cost to built a L'Ocean

Oak Log            1490 x10  14900
Fir Log               800  x4   3200    
Hemp                333  x58  19314
Iron Ore             305  x62  18910
Lignum Vitae    66   x36  2376
Stone Block     165  x14  2310
Coal                  230  x4   920
Teak Log            2985 x40  119400
White Oak Log    655  x40  26200
Provisions           1100 x15  16500
              224030 Total 

Plus

Doubloons    9166

Combat Medals 30

 

So in few words

You are saying that it does worth for me or any other player to buy ships by the prices we have now when 1st rate starts from 4mil is worth rather than setting up my own production chain and craft ships.