Mortar brig vs Brig

[Thonys]

hi all

i do know that the developers knows the stats

but 

what i want to accomplish is to balance those  ships more to reasonable  proportions instead of looking at a comic book.

both ships are almost identical but for some reason the speed without the mortar guns is almost 2.5 knots lower what is a huge impact on the performance of the mortar brig

look at the stats of the picture from the mortar brig and the almost identical brig (look at speed)

 

@admin  can you please balance those ship 

in ow i can't even catch up a small ship to tag it in a decent way to grind for the knowledge slots....

 but this is just unreal

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

This is purely for the "gaming" aspect, right ?... You are not considering the reality involving both vessels as I'm guessing, because the construction of both would be very very different and resulting in obvious and exceptional differences to sailing characteristics.

 

 

[Thonys]

18 minutes ago, Hethwill said:

This is purely for the "gaming" aspect, right ?... You are not considering the reality involving both vessels as I'm guessing, because the construction of both would be very very different and resulting in obvious and exceptional differences to sailing characteristics.

 

 

i am not sure what you mean :

 

if you look at the build of the 2  brigs there are no guns on board 

the hull and the woods are the same ...

sail composition is the same...

speed should almost be the same 

but 2.5 knots is to much of a difference 

 

a mercury/lynx/niagara/brig/ in ow escapes from tagging...... what is ridiculous... for doing grind (exaggerating of course)

 

!......but if you put a mortar on it >>you have a anchor on it whats been thrown overboard

i hope developments sees the difference.

 

 

Edited September 14, 2019 by Thonys

[Malcolm3]

11 minutes ago, Thonys said:

if you look at the build of the 2  brigs there are no guns on board 

the hull and the woods are the same ...

sail composition is the same...

speed should almost be the same 

but 2.5 knots is to much of a difference 

In reality mortar vessels were built much heavier with very strong timbers to withstand mortar recoil. So there should be much more HP and thickness for the mortar one

[Thonys]

1 minute ago, Malcolm3 said:

In reality mortar vessels were built much heavier with very strong timbers to withstand mortar recoil. So there should be much more HP and thickness for the mortar one

but it isnt..right..

the original mortar brig was a much better option for this ship in comparison of what we have now .

 

Edited September 14, 2019 by Thonys

[Sella]

What others are trying to say is, although the in-game model looks almost identical with the normal brig, its stats are altered to reflect the performance and build qualities of a proper mortar brig. It may not look right but it is right. 

[Sea Archer]

...and the fore sails of mortar vessels would be differ a lot. Usually using chains as forestays, the sails were cut in another way, having much worse sailing properties. For firing the motar, you had to anchor (with 4 anchors), takes a lot of preparation time, and then you might fire the first shot. Leaving your position may take a lot of time as well, so the port battle is over, before the mortar brig is ready for action.

Still I think it should be slower than the brig and should be worse sailing close hauled.

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

30 minutes ago, Thonys said:

i am not sure what you mean

Realism vs gaming.

Mortar vessels construction main concern was not speed and weatherliness but constructed mortar platforms, especially the areas designated for the pieces.

A typical brig, in reality, would always be faster and better sailor than a mortar vessel.

[Thonys]

6 minutes ago, Hethwill said:

Realism vs gaming.

Mortar vessels construction main concern was not speed and weatherliness but constructed mortar platforms, especially the areas designated for the pieces.

A typical brig, in reality, would always be faster and better sailor than a mortar vessel.

agreed 

lets kill a victory with a basic cutter:)

fine

remains that the mortar brig is the worst ship in the game

Edited September 14, 2019 by Thonys

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

?? How does the cutter and Victory come to the discussion ?

... whatever. cya

[z4ys]

55 minutes ago, Sella said:

What others are trying to say is, although the in-game model looks almost identical with the normal brig, its stats are altered to reflect the performance and build qualities of a proper mortar brig. It may not look right but it is right. 

some visiual additions

Mortar Brig

 

 

[Aquillas]

Mortar brig became voluntarily useless by developing team, to justify the incredible high price of the fortifications. 

It is just one of these consequences of the RVR rules, of the promotion that only BIG clans are allowed in game. Other sad rules being the incredible BR of all port battles. 

Incredible high prices of  buildings removed small clans and independent players from port development. But even big clans won't pay such prices for defenses that can be easily destroyed. 

As another consequence of this game development strategy, mortar brigs must be set out of battles. If you find a way to use them, they will be nerfed again...

[Sir Texas Sir]

8 hours ago, Aquillas said:

Mortar brig became voluntarily useless by developing team, to justify the incredible high price of the fortifications. 

It is just one of these consequences of the RVR rules, of the promotion that only BIG clans are allowed in game. Other sad rules being the incredible BR of all port battles. 

Incredible high prices of  buildings removed small clans and independent players from port development. But even big clans won't pay such prices for defenses that can be easily destroyed. 

As another consequence of this game development strategy, mortar brigs must be set out of battles. If you find a way to use them, they will be nerfed again...

What they need to do is keep the Mortar brig for shallow waters and such and bring out a 3rd rate that can handle the deep water ones better.   They nerfed them to death so they are useless now and as OP meantions the slowest ship in game.

[Aquillas]

We need defences that can be destroyed or boarded during PB's. We need cheaper defenses, which can be more easily replaced when scratched down. We need defenses for all ports, including those which are developed for economy or crafting. In fact, these ones should be the most defended ones. 

[Raekur]

While I used to love operating the mortar brig before release the changes to the ship has made it not worth the time. It is near impossible to grind knowledge slots on it without resorting to having to ask others for help. Even trying to do a 6th rate mission is a gamble as the MB has very little armament when compared to other 6th rate ships. The MB has a damage output of only 300 points making it 100 points weaker then even the Brig. So without help from another person it is very unlikely that you will even complete missions to gain experience with the ship. The only tactic I can think of to solo grind is to craft the ship as Teak/Crew space and outfit it for boarding since the AI does not use it's deck guns but even this is risky but better than trying to slug it out with a ship that can have up to double your damage output. Any 6th rate other than a Brig or Navy Brig will have a high chance to sink you. 

[Aquillas]

Another fun content vanished in Naval Action haze... Just sad.

[Thonys]

13 hours ago, Aquillas said:

Another fun content vanished in Naval Action haze... Just sad.

you are absolutely right.
I'm not even going to defend or criticize the posts anymore, they just have to figure it out for themselves.
if they want to ruin it for everyone and for themselves, they have to do that, who cares anymore 
at some point it is all impossible to make something of it at all.
the end justifies the means shall we say, it is not consistent with anything, or logical for normal players.

it feels like a stone it looks like a stone and it does not even smell,.... it is... it's dinosaur shit (TM)

...but whatever....... cya

Edited September 15, 2019 by Thonys

[Captain2Strong]

mortars are very heavy, it makes sense!

[Raekur]

3 hours ago, Captain2Strong said:

mortars are very heavy, it makes sense!

You do realize that the conversation is in regards to the ships hull not the weapons on board right?

The problem is that a few whined about how effective mortar brigs were at taking out forts, now with the asinine cost of building forts it made the mortar brig a financial nightmare. Their solution was to decrease the accuracy of the MB, Increase the range of the towers to longer than the MB could reach (which means towers are invincible in shallow port battles) and with the MB being so undergunned normally as far as ship to ship combat, it is a painful grind to just open knowledge slots on the ship. As usual, instead of making a small adjustment, the devs exterminated the ship. It would have been better if they had just removed the ship entirely after the wipe. Then at least people would have asked why instead of feeling screwed.

[Captain2Strong]

1 hour ago, Raekur said:

with the MB being so undergunned normally as far as ship to ship combat, it is a painful grind to just open knowledge slots on the ship

it is indeed bullshit that shouldn't exist, but it's not really mandatory! especially on this ship!

 

1 hour ago, Raekur said:

You do realize that the conversation is in regards to the ships hull not the weapons on board right?

The problem is that a few whined about how effective mortar brigs were at taking out forts, now with the asinine cost of building forts it made the mortar brig a financial nightmare. Their solution was to decrease the accuracy of the MB, Increase the range of the towers to longer than the MB could reach (which means towers are invincible in shallow port battles)  It would have been better if they had just removed the ship entirely after the wipe. Then at least people would have asked why instead of feeling screwed.

well yeah, that's absolutely retarded, but hey, mortar brigs are boring and we still have the fun ships, at least for now!

Edited September 15, 2019 by Captain2Strong

[Raekur]

4 hours ago, Captain2Strong said:

it is indeed bullshit that shouldn't exist, but it's not really mandatory! especially on this ship!

 

well yeah, that's absolutely retarded, but hey, mortar brigs are boring and we still have the fun ships, at least for now!

How exactly is what i said bullshit? How would you grind the knowledge slots on the ship if it can't even match the other ships of its own rank? 

Considering this conversation was in reference to the mortar brig, what does playing other ships have to do with it?

If you can not stay on topic, you might want to stay OUT of the conversation.

[Captain2Strong]

6 hours ago, Raekur said:

How exactly is what i said bullshit? How would you grind the knowledge slots on the ship if it can't even match the other ships of its own rank? 

that's not what I said 😉 and this is the reason why it's bullshit, the grind

 

Quote

If you can not stay on topic, you might want to stay OUT of the conversation.

I think I can actually manage to do that, but thanks anyway 🤣

Edited September 16, 2019 by Captain2Strong

[Raekur]

1 hour ago, Wraith said:

Mortar brigs are extremely easy to grind. Just do it with a friend.  Go attack 3rd+ rates with a friend sailing a first rate.. let him demast them for you while you stay at distance and then drop them with your mortars. You'll open up all the slots in no time because of the BR differential.

You can even do this on your own if you're desperate, just put the mortar brig in your fleet and then go swap to it in the middle of the battle after demasting your targets. The only downside in doing it this way is that you won't have any of the books, etc. to make it faster once you swap onto your AI MB.

There's no need for all this whinging. MB's should be slower and less maneuverable.

And this is precisely the issue I have with most peoples attitudes towards the mortar brig. NO OTHER SHIP requires or needs another ship to perform or gain knowledge in. It is complete bullshit and I dont know why there are so many (including admins) that feel that the mortar brig is such a massive threat that it should be unique  and handled like it is some kind of nuclear weapon. No other ship needs someone to act like a shield against the towers since the MB would get blasted to bits while it is attempting to fire at a tower. How many shots would it take for a tower to sink a MB compared to how many shots would it take for a MB to take out the tower. If you want to whine that the towers are much more expensive than the MB, fine bitch at the devs to reduce the cost of building the tower as it is already past stupid level already. Hell, it already takes 2 WEEKS for a MAX level stone mine to produce the amount of stone needed to build a tower. As far as grinding knowledge slots, I have not heard of any other ship that needs some 1st rate to putter around and demast a target so they can sail up and bounce their balls off of it. Maybe we should just rename the mortar brig Baby Cub since it is incapable of going anywhere without a parent.

[Captain2Strong]

4 minutes ago, Raekur said:

And this is precisely the issue I have with most peoples attitudes towards the mortar brig. NO OTHER SHIP requires or needs another ship to perform or gain knowledge in. It is complete bullshit and I dont know why there are so many (including admins) that feel that the mortar brig is such a massive threat that it should be unique  and handled like it is some kind of nuclear weapon. No other ship needs someone to act like a shield against the towers since the MB would get blasted to bits while it is attempting to fire at a tower. How many shots would it take for a tower to sink a MB compared to how many shots would it take for a MB to take out the tower. If you want to whine that the towers are much more expensive than the MB, fine bitch at the devs to reduce the cost of building the tower as it is already past stupid level already. Hell, it already takes 2 WEEKS for a MAX level stone mine to produce the amount of stone needed to build a tower. As far as grinding knowledge slots, I have not heard of any other ship that needs some 1st rate to putter around and demast a target so they can sail up and bounce their balls off of it. Maybe we should just rename the mortar brig Baby Cub since it is incapable of going anywhere without a parent.

they think that you should spend the year grinding, and that's why mortar brig is supposed to be useless

this is nothing new I think!

[Jim Beamreach]

I miss the old days grinding XP on the MotarBrig. Sinking 1st and 2nd Rates.