Port Bonuses are way OP

[Liq]

17 hours ago, z4ys said:

I like that the people who said "books make no difference" are now saying port bonus is op. Now that almost everyone has all the books and we were finally back to an even gear lvl port bonus got introduced. Now you guys know and experience how a new player felt when he joins the game before and had to face all the ency and stacked books + mods. But that stuff makes really no difference - yes 😉

I run most of my ships (frigates here) with the following

• Carpenter Combat Reports
  • + 3.5% Repair
• Repairing
  • + 3% Repair
  • - 4% Repair time
• Rigging
  • -15% Sailing Crew
  • +20% Sail setting speed
  • +10% yard turn speed
• Powder Monkeys
  • -7% Reload
• Gunnery Encyclopedia
  • -7% horizontal dispersion
  • -5% Reload
  • -6% Vertical dispersion
  • +3.5% vertical gun range
  • +5% horizontal gun range

Now if you compare that to the list of port bonusses on page one, it should be pretty obvious it's nowhere near as imbalaned  

[Armored_Sheep]

30% bonus is means that you have ship of different class. Is that realy necessary? First "upgrades" in game were usualy with trade off - increas this and slightly reduce another thing. More skilled crafter, better shipyard - more reliable outcomes. But why someone should be allowed to dominate by aquring some bonuses? Bonuses are nice motivation and can add diversity but they should not brake the balance.

[van Veen]

Simple solution, proposed many times by various players: do not allow stacking of boni of the same parameter. Instead of sum(bonus1, bonus2,...), use max(bonus1, bonus2,...). 

[z4ys]

port bonus should be more like "you are allowed to stack said bonus with books and mods" not add on top

Port bonus speed tier 1 = Allows to use copper or navyhull or....

....

Port bonus speed tier 3 = allows to use copper + navyhull + art of ship handling

Edited May 5, 2019 by z4ys

[Liq]

btw notice how it says "standard" on Anolytics golden super modded l'ocean... yeh totally the norm now isn't it

[Licinio Chiavari]

The fact quoted ship is 5/5 doesnt change the fact.

Someone want to try his 4/5 purple no port bonuses vs. a 3/5 with capped port bonuses?

Moreover for those saying mods/books unbalance the game... reply is yes: BUT NOT TO THIS DEGREE... at least because you had to make a choise on what fit to do what at best.

On top of that...

Rightfully high investment costs for upgrading a port... but thus losing a main crafing port will totally cripple a clan, alliance of clans or even the nation.
Losing the port, technically, being surely defended as hard as possible... means the enemy is already stronger.
And then the enemy will become even stronger... being able to keep dishing out super ships... zeroing weaker side competition.

Therefore as I said too many times already... this system (ludicrous port bonuses + capitol centered frontline + high BR PBs) will be widening more and more the distance between alphadog(s) and other... destroying and balance and room for smaller clan/nations (aside case they will gratiously allowed to exist).

Widening the gap and making it unrecoverable for losing side.

A suicide for any MMO.

 

As repeated = county town based frontline + limited hostility from FFA towns + reviewed (closer to the past) PB BRs + reducing port bonuses to nothing more than a couple mod more*.

*) meaning medium port able to unlock 1 bonus, good ones 2, and maximum bonus of any kind should not go beyond 1 encyclopedia/ 1 elite mod values.
And/or eventually getting slight higher better quality ships or being able to choose ship trim (no more random and even also only AI trims).

So between the normal 3/5 and the maxed top ship 5/5+trim + port bonus the difference will be like 4-5 mods. So already ENORMOUS (like a 4/5 high end modded vs an unmodded ship). Still - INCREDIBLY - FAR LESS huge than now.

 

Otherwise the game will be dead in a matter of time.
Also because the eventual alphadog could not be countered by players leaving it... because they'll lose their production bases so they even more bounded in allegiance.

[Licinio Chiavari]

8 hours ago, Liq said:

I run most of my ships (frigates here) with the following

• Carpenter Combat Reports
  • + 3.5% Repair
• Repairing
  • + 3% Repair
  • - 4% Repair time
• Rigging
  • -15% Sailing Crew
  • +20% Sail setting speed
  • +10% yard turn speed
• Powder Monkeys
  • -7% Reload
• Gunnery Encyclopedia
  • -7% horizontal dispersion
  • -5% Reload
  • -6% Vertical dispersion
  • +3.5% vertical gun range
  • +5% horizontal gun range

Now if you compare that to the list of port bonusses on page one, it should be pretty obvious it's nowhere near as imbalaned  

Not forgetting port bonuses ends ON TOP yours already high end bonuses.

[James Thomson]

I have to say as Small clan leader, it feels so unsatifying to play RvR game when you know you cant have access to these ships.

Wich means we are not eager to enter PvP because we know we are already in ships that dont match propaply our enemies.

Right now we are on Clans rotating friend list, so we may have a chance to build some ships at some point. Feels damn stupid.

 

And just to think those players who play solo...

[p i t]

Port investments was a good idea, just implemented badly

I want to invest in brothels on my island, just so I can have happy men and naked women on port ui

[p i t]

21 minutes ago, Wraith said:

What about happy women and naked men too?  

I'm sure they can release a dlc for that

[HachiRoku]

On 5/4/2019 at 7:57 PM, William Death said:

Carta is old news.  Only +5cm

Navy Planking is +6cm. 

C'mon now try to keep up with the metas 

Is planking 6% or 6cm? Are you certain it is cm? 

[James Thomson]

19 minutes ago, Wraith said:

Ask yourself, how does one make up for a difference in quality?  Quantity.

Organize, ally yourself with others, and figure out how to win.  This is the nature of a full-loot, multiplayer, online sandbox game.

Now that said, please do not read this as a defense of the port bonuses. They are absurd. They need to be changed/balanced to reflect trade-offs in ship configuration. But all of this whinging about solos and smaller clans not having access to end-game RvR content doesn't reflect the spirit that such games represent in my opinion.

So you are saying small clans should stop trying, and join big clans? We already have so many small clans that we dont fit in the 15 clans firend lists. So we are out, and the big clans have all ports. But there is no room on their list for us all.

I also think bonuses are great and mods are certainly a keeper. But the way they are now in the game just ruin it. Bonuses over bonuses, making ships so OP, regular ships are obsolete when compared.

[Farrago]

But please don't nerf the book and perma mods benefits UNTIL the port bonuses are also nerfed. Imagine if they first were weakened and then had to face the frankenstein ships that a few nations can now build.

[James Thomson]

8 minutes ago, Wraith said:

I didn't say that at all. There should be room in the game for small clans but you need to realize that you have to work with each other to do anything that relates to end-game clan content. That should be natural.  I fully agree with you that the friendly-clan management in-game and its arbitrary limits is silly. It needs to be reworked for clan-oriented mechanics like port management.

That i agree. You should work towards your nations, you should work with other clans. But benefits too should be spread either to whole nation or be balanced the way they will not cause the endgame to be blocked from others. Im worreid that regular OS / Screening PvP will be dominated with only ships that have certain powers gained from bonuses that are restricted from casual/solo/small clans.

[Roadkill]

At SALTP we are a smaller clan that has survived by working alongside other clans.  We usually have at least one player helping at Port Battles in nation and have worked successfully with other small clans to help increase revenues and support building at each other's ports.  We also have a more relaxed approach to the game and all play because we enjoy each other's company.  I'm sure that is why a lot of players play this game but we can understand the solo player's mentality so we allow people to play the way they want.  A good way to keep your clan's identity is to sail with other clans or come onto TS/Discord so that you can communicate and raise the clan profile.  We welcome smaller clans if they want to join us but we also welcome smaller clans who just want to sail with us and keep their own identity.  Expect to laugh a lot usually at each other's expense 😉

[James Thomson]

3 minutes ago, Roadkill said:

At SALTP we are a smaller clan that has survived by working alongside other clans.  We usually have at least one player helping at Port Battles in nation and have worked successfully with other small clans to help increase revenues and support building at each other's ports.  We also have a more relaxed approach to the game and all play because we enjoy each other's company.  I'm sure that is why a lot of players play this game but we can understand the solo player's mentality so we allow people to play the way they want.  A good way to keep your clan's identity is to sail with other clans or come onto TS/Discord so that you can communicate and raise the clan profile.  We welcome smaller clans if they want to join us but we also welcome smaller clans who just want to sail with us and keep their own identity.  Expect to laugh a lot usually at each other's expense 😉

Well dunno about "smaller clan" 60 members, dont know how many online there is. We are 5 members max at this time. I think we are on SALTPs rotating clan allies list. At least that i was negotiating for ^^.

[Roadkill]

21 minutes ago, James Thomson said:

Well dunno about "smaller clan" 60 members, dont know how many online there is. We are 5 members max at this time. I think we are on SALTPs rotating clan allies list. At least that i was negotiating for ^^.

We have 15-20 active members out of 60.....majority of those have not been online for at least 3 months...some a year.  We have different nationalities but are mostly UK but the clan was originally a US player clan.  

[Licinio Chiavari]

3 hours ago, Wraith said:

Ask yourself, how does one make up for a difference in quality?  Quantity.

Organize, ally yourself with others, and figure out how to win.  This is the nature of a full-loot, multiplayer, online sandbox game.

Now that said, please do not read this as a defense of the port bonuses. They are absurd. They need to be changed/balanced to reflect trade-offs in ship configuration. But all of this whinging about solos and smaller clans not having access to end-game RvR content doesn't reflect the spirit that such games represent in my opinion.

Sorry Sir: crap.

Quantity with such gear gap doesnt work... in PB where numbers are limited.

[Barbancourt]

26 minutes ago, Wraith said:

No, you misunderstood my comment. Quantity in terms of players contributing to an overarching goal is what I explicitly referred to.  This might include quantity over quality in OW battles, but my point was more focused on the ability of a coalition of small clans to contribute to a crafting port and its bonuses, therefore giving them a crafting hub to produce more competitive ships out of.  

PBs are only the final manifestation of a lot of organization and collaboration, and if not occurring within one large, organized clan, it can occur across multiple smaller clans if they're willing to do it. And f they aren't willing to collaborate then they deserve to be locked out of RvR, end-game activities.

Why do we need to "produce more competitive ships"?  Why aren't ALL ships competitive?  The differences should be entirely in the captain, not entrenched in the gear.

Being content wag fingers and lock groups of players out of "end-game activities", which are really the core activities of the game, is one of the many reasons why the server is dead.  We need people happily playing, not feeling locked out and scolded. 

 

[Licinio Chiavari]

18 minutes ago, Wraith said:

No, you misunderstood my comment. Quantity in terms of players contributing to an overarching goal is what I explicitly referred to.  This might include quantity over quality in OW battles, but my point was more focused on the ability of a coalition of small clans to contribute to a crafting port and its bonuses, therefore giving them a crafting hub to produce more competitive ships out of.  

PBs are only the final manifestation of a lot of organization and collaboration, and if not occurring within one large, organized clan, it can occur across multiple smaller clans if they're willing to do it. And f they aren't willing to collaborate then they deserve to be locked out of RvR, end-game activities.

Partly* my apologizes. Still.

 

a) a nation still need 20+ approx skilled (and well geared) players (at same time - PB time) to be able to withstand enemy attacks. Otherwise they will stand no chances in RvR. They will exist as long as "allowed".

b) a nation even able to could not be able to stand repeated attacks (crappiness of PB every other day - especially now with forts to be rebuilt) by the sheer number of (natural) losses.

c) a smaller nation, even if organized, stands no chances, especially now, against a fairly organized bigger: simply the weight of farming will allow the latter to farm faster so full port bonuses faster and faster building new buffed ships (that balance - LoL - wise are simply out of the sky).

d) a smaller even skilled nation could not stand repeated attacks on their main shipyard (that it's rarely a secret - the power of real P2W: alts): they will be dead the same time they lose it a single time (remember b.); losing a (even not topped but still the most invested) upped shipyard will cripple for weeks and weeks to come their ability to rebuild their forces competitively (making c. even more unbearable).

e) they stand no chances retaliating, due to sheer numbers - even without skill (and today Alpha HAS a good degree of) - will preclude a smaller nation to effectively attack enemy bases: 1- due to frontlines 2- more important, as in the past, due to sheer size of screeners.

 

Conclusion:
it will be only matter of time being destroyed to the point even of losing interest in playing (being unable to recover - contrary to the past: rebuilding a Shipyard lvl.3 and moving WHs was not such an issue; embarassing and disturbing but NOT deadly) by a stronger team.

[Angus MacDuff]

59 minutes ago, Barbancourt said:

Why do we need to "produce more competitive ships"?  Why aren't ALL ships competitive?  The differences should be entirely in the captain, not entrenched in the gear.

We're all hitting the speed cap in 3/5 5th rates with these port bonuses.  Now ships are all equal

[Licinio Chiavari]

7 minutes ago, Angus MacDuff said:

We're all hitting the speed cap in 3/5 5th rates with these port bonuses.  Now ships are all equal

Yes. IF you have Sailing4 :DDD

[Angus MacDuff]

Just now, Licinio Chiavari said:

Yes. IF you have Sailing4 :DDD

Sailing 3 will do it...with mods/books

 

[Licinio Chiavari]

3 minutes ago, Angus MacDuff said:

Sailing 3 will do it...with mods/books

 

Right. And when facing another Sailing3 + 4/4/4/2 what'll do?

Not to speak: the new uses of Pandora/Herc/Herm/Ratt without port bonuses? Targets?

Edited May 6, 2019 by Licinio Chiavari

[Angus MacDuff]

DLC is now PTL (pay to lose)