Dont Worry abut the DLC-Ships...

[_Alucard_]

47 minutes ago, HachiRoku said:

Would you buy the rat for 10 euro? 

I'll explain my point of view.

The problem is that all the people are willing to buy all DLCs even without thinking what they are paying for. 

The first dlc opened the path and after its success, I think developers saw the way to get money from players. Even a lot of people talk here in forums suggesting more posible DLCs...

 

I won't buy DLCs until I see the game is released. The other day I watched Reverse's stream and at peak time only 280 players online.....

The game is getting to a very dangerous point because you need at least a minimum of players for it to be playable and enjoyable and 280 is way bellow that minimum.

I see the devs are focusing now in other games and as they say, only 2 or 3 people working on this one. I don't understand this. 

If we are so close to release, why don't you finish this game first? If you do that, you'd expect a lot of players coming to the game (because it's finally released after years in alpha beta or whatever the name is) and those players would mean money from new people. Until now they are getting the money from us, players in this game for 3 years or more and in my opinion they past the point in which I am comfortable investing more money into this game.

So, let's think again: we have forged papers (this dlc is ridiculous), paints, hercules, requin, admiralty, and now this one ( 34 euros when full game was 15€ sometimes.......)

Finish the game, attract new players, fill again the servers, but don't milk always the same players who by the way are the loyals to this game.

These are my thoughts right now. 

 

 

[HachiRoku]

1 minute ago, _Alucard_ said:

I'll explain my point of view.

The problem is that all the people are willing to buy all DLCs even without thinking what they are paying for. 

The first dlc opened the path and after its success, I think developers saw the way to get money from players. Even a lot of people talk here in forums suggesting more posible DLCs...

 

I won't buy DLCs until I see the game is released. The other day I watched Reverse's stream and at peak time only 280 players online.....

The game is getting to a very dangerous point because you need at least a minimum of players for it to be playable and enjoyable and 280 is way bellow that minimum.

I see the devs are focusing now in other games and as they say, only 2 or 3 people working on this one. I don't understand this. 

If we are so close to release, why don't you finish this game first? If you do that, you'd expect a lot of players coming to the game (because it's finally released after years in alpha beta or whatever the name is) and those players would mean money from new people. Until now they are getting the money from us, players in this game for 3 years or more and in my opinion they past the point in which I am comfortable investing more money into this game.

So, let's think again: we have forged papers (this dlc is ridiculous), paints, hercules, requin, admiralty, and now this one ( 34 euros when full game was 15€ sometimes.......)

Finish the game, attract new players, fill again the servers, but don't milk always the same players who by the way are the loyals to this game.

These are my thoughts right now. 

 

 

Smart but there is one issue. The devs sold many of us sea trials and we kept on asking for more. The Devs kept on releasing more and the sandbox that was not part of the original development plan  and cost them a shit ton of money. I would agree 100% with you on many other games but since the devs kept on adding more content and not charging a cent for the majority of it I think it is acceptable to make dlc pre release. Many games end up being canceled or just released unfinished because there is no money to do the final touches. Day 1 DLC is bad and you are 100% right but I really don't see their options. 

Forged papers need to be expensive. I would charge 10 euro for every nation change though. I think people should not have infinite switches. I know it hurts some players. 

[Zoky]

On 4/6/2019 at 7:45 PM, HachiRoku said:

The Devs kept on releasing more and the sandbox that was not part of the original development plan  and cost them a shit ton of money. I would agree 100% with you on many other games but since the devs kept on adding more content and not charging a cent for the majority of it I think it is acceptable to make dlc pre release.

When I got game OW was already listed on steam store page with lots of ships, realistic sailing etc. I don't care about their original plan with only 10 ships and no OW. It's on them to manage their finance and not in me!

Edited April 8, 2019 by Zoky

[HachiRoku]

3 hours ago, Zoky said:

When I got game OW was already listed on steam store page with lots of ships, realistic sailing etc. I don't care about their original plan with only 10 ships and no OW. It's on them to manage their finance and not in me!

You have the game for some time Zoky. You cannot complain about a lack of ships. We might complain a bit about the dlcs but nowhere near as much if they did not break game 

[Zoky]

19 hours ago, HachiRoku said:

22 hours ago, Zoky said:

 

You have the game for some time Zoky. You cannot complain about a lack of ships. We might complain a bit about the dlcs but nowhere near as much if they did not break game 

Its not about lack of ships. I don't even care about anything in particular. I'm just disappointed with lack of vision and direction. Even now I log in and when I see that there is less then 300 people online I get sad and log off. I really liked this game. But all these new P2W stuff are driving people away and me together with them 😕

[jodgi]

11 minutes ago, Zoky said:

But all these new P2W stuff are driving people away and me together with them 😕

When people inevitably come back after release and we keep a healthy online count, WITH DLCs. What will your explanation be?

[HachiRoku]

2 hours ago, jodgi said:

When people inevitably come back after release and we keep a healthy online count, WITH DLCs. What will your explanation be?

Except it won't stay that way. Just cause the game is released doesn't mean the playerbase will be stable 

[manuva85]

2 hours ago, jodgi said:

When people inevitably come back after release and we keep a healthy online count, WITH DLCs. What will your explanation be?

Unless you meant F2P release, it won't give you back big stable playerbase. Na did bleed out those players for a reasons, that werent fixed, or even were made worse. Downtime after death was made longer and battles are still instanced and action in na is still ganking.

[Zoky]

2 hours ago, jodgi said:

2 hours ago, Zoky said:

 

When people inevitably come back after release and we keep a healthy online count, WITH DLCs. What will your explanation be?

Why would they come back with release?

[jodgi]

35 minutes ago, HachiRoku said:

Except it won't stay that way. Just cause the game is released doesn't mean the playerbase will be stable 

 

25 minutes ago, manuva85 said:

Unless you meant F2P release, it won't give you back big stable playerbase. Na did bleed out those players for a reasons, that werent fixed, or even were made worse. Downtime after death was made longer and battles are still instanced and action in na is still ganking.

 

12 minutes ago, Zoky said:

Why would they come back with release?

I don't pretend I know what will happen. I just push against opinionated and negative predictions stated as truth. I can play that game too: "Ahahaha! If this game doesn't become an arena game where we get max fun/time people won't come back and we're doomed!"

@manuva85 Isn't sandbox = ganking? I don't know how flexible you are towards lobby vs. OW, but I assume sandbox guys approve of ganking (I actually think most of them are impossibly conflicted about it but let's not go there :P).

[HachiRoku]

14 minutes ago, jodgi said:

 

 

I don't pretend I know what will happen. I just push against opinionated and negative predictions stated as truth. I can play that game too: "Ahahaha! If this game doesn't become an arena game where we get max fun/time people won't come back and we're doomed!"

@manuva85 Isn't sandbox = ganking? I don't know how flexible you are towards lobby vs. OW, but I assume sandbox guys approve of ganking (I actually think most of them are impossibly conflicted about it but let's not go there :P).

Its actually a general fact that games loose the majority of the playerbase in the first month. 

[PG Monkey]

On 4/6/2019 at 5:22 PM, HachiRoku said:

Would you buy the rat for 10 euro? 

I would

[Guest]

1 minute ago, PG Monkey said:

I would

Me too.

Max is 15

[balticsailor]

Of all the dlc i only bought the herc for less then 6 € and i only have one account i bought in dec 2014 for 36€. Atm i don't realy have much intention to spend any money on NA, although i spend over 4.4k hours playing the game. But i will wait and see how thing will develop till release.

[Forbin]

Yep, the same for me.

She's good now, but no garantee she'll stay like this…..will see after release. The Le Requin and Hercules DLC expérience dissapointed me so much, bought usefull ships and ended with pointless ones.

[jodgi]

2 hours ago, HachiRoku said:

Its actually a general fact that games loose the majority of the playerbase in the first month.

I believe you. I've only engaged in those horrible arena games that kept growing even after years.

[MassimoSud]

Here we are! New meta? KPR (or others capitals) blockade with 15 rattvisans  sinking new players! Next after wipe? Full rattvisan PB fleet! Very funny! You better think to give some kind of protection to new players who doesn t want to buy dlcs from the beginning, or we will have a lot of rage quit after few days after release.

[Diceman]

On 4/5/2019 at 9:38 AM, Meraun said:

...The L'Hermoine https://store.steampowered.com/app/1045190/Naval_Action__LHermione/

and the  Rättvisan https://store.steampowered.com/app/1054071/Naval_Action__Rttvisan/

Are soooooo expensive only very, very few Players will actually buy them.

Bought a Hermione.

Will decide about the Ratt when I get enough crew...

Ta...

[Capitalism]

10 minutes ago, Diceman said:

Bought a Hermione.

Will decide about the Ratt when I get enough crew...

Ta...

Pretty opinionated on in depth game mechanics when you can’t even crew a fourth rate yet. You might consider reserving judgement until you actually have experienced end-game content, lol.

You can’t really expect to understand the impact DLC has on the economy and RvR if you don’t actually engage in those things... 🙄

[Diceman]

13 minutes ago, Capitalism said:

Pretty opinionated on in depth game mechanics when you can’t even crew a fourth rate yet. You might consider reserving judgement until you actually have experienced end-game content, lol.

You can’t really expect to understand the impact DLC has on the economy and RvR if you don’t actually engage in those things... 🙄

Been a Rear Admiral twice at least in this game...

Been max level craft qualified twice too. 

I’m aware of what I speak...

I also like the grind... no I love the grind. 

I particularly enjoy the mid range ranks and all the various ships to try... not interested in meta ships at all to sail. Just to craft a sell to pubs.

Edited April 11, 2019 by Diceman
Not complete

[Angus MacDuff]

I don't mind the grind, especially if everyone is doing it.  I think that the game may be ruined if crafting and trading are dead.  And with the current path of the game, DLC rules and you can't compete if you don't buy. 

[Capitalism]

19 minutes ago, Diceman said:

Been a Rear Admiral twice at least in this game...

Been max level craft qualified twice too. 

I’m aware of what I speak...

I also like the grind... no I love the grind. 

I particularly enjoy the mid range ranks and all the various ships to try... not interested in meta ships at all to sail. Just to craft a sell to pubs.

Well masochism aside, surely you acknowledge that you exist at the far end of the typical game playing spectrum?  But aside from those of us who've ground several alts to max rank and max crafting there aren't too many folks who can reflect on the new player experience as you can.  And my conclusion is that it's far, far worse now than it was at the beginning of Early Access, but I'd be interested in your perspective. Mine is this:  

Grind is not content.

And the content that we have for new players throughout that grind has actually shrunk considerably (removal of crafting, change in mission structure with a focus on RNG and random loot, etc., huge emphasis placed on DLC and combat/pvp rewards, etc.). New players have never had a more confusing and hard to navigate path to end-game content as they do today and adding more grind to the gameplay experience actually doesn't result in players playing longer.  In an OW sandbox game players should be the content, and when you drive them away through mechanics and grind then what do you have left?  No content.

[Diceman]

2 minutes ago, Capitalism said:

Well masochism aside, surely you acknowledge that you exist at the far end of the typical game playing spectrum?  But aside from those of us who've ground several alts to max rank and max crafting there aren't too many folks who can reflect on the new player experience as you can.  And my conclusion is that it's far, far worse now than it was at the beginning of Early Access, but I'd be interested in your perspective. Mine is this:  

Grind is not content.

And the content that we have for new players throughout that grind has actually shrunk considerably (removal of crafting, change in mission structure with a focus on RNG and random loot, etc., huge emphasis placed on DLC and combat/pvp rewards, etc.). New players have never had a more confusing and hard to navigate path to end-game content as they do today and adding more grind to the gameplay experience actually doesn't result in players playing longer.  In an OW sandbox game players should be the content, and when you drive them away through mechanics and grind then what do you have left?  No content.

Good points!!

My perspective is this...

I am a solo through and through. Anti clan from the beginning. I have been in a couple clans and was meh... and went solo again. Anti clan in WoT and WoWS, DCS, and IL2  too...

If you think you’re going to buy this game and just fly up through the ranks, you’re in for a rude awakening. It’s a total grind fest, a grindapalooza!! ... for everything! And that’s fine with me. I feel that’s why so many join clans... to get through the grind and that’s ok! They got their goal more power to them!

I think there is far more now to do now than there was long ago!! Kill missions, Delivery missions (cargo and passenger), Hunt missions, Patrol zone, Shipwrecked fleets, fishing for Sealed Bottles, OW hunting AI and players, port management, coast guard duty, ship crafting, resource gathering, hostility generating, screening PBs, fighting PBs...Books, modules, perks... oh my! Paints, flags, forgers, loot boxes, and more...

In my opinion this is awesome. There’s always something to do. Some new goal to achieve. It’s far better now than the early days just sailing OW chasing the great pig cloud in the sky... I’m never bored  and while some changes to this game may have pissed me off, it also gave me the opportunity to modify my gameplay and have/make new and different experiences.

Everything has evolved during testing, some good changes, some bad. And despite all the negative Nancy’s screaming on forums every time a change occurs that the game is ruined... it’s still here... it’s still fun... I still get tense and sweaty pits in battle... best $50 I have ever spent on computer gaming period! 

Its hard for beginners, true but by and large the oldsters help and guide the youngsters better than in most other games. YouTube videos and the tutorials help with that now too... 

And when I’m tired of the grind, lost my ship to a gank, lost all my money on a gamble, and just fraking fed up with the absolute failure of my nation to unscrew itself, I can take a sail and just enjoy the sunset/sunrise... 

This game is what you make it... if it sucks, who’s fault is it???

 

 

[kae]

19 hours ago, Diceman said:

This game is what you make it... if it sucks, who’s fault is it???

Of not having the sufients dlc in the portfolio

 

ez

Edited April 12, 2019 by kae

[Farrago]

On 4/11/2019 at 11:59 AM, Diceman said:

This game is what you make it... if it sucks, who’s fault is it???

 

 

A bit oversimplified, don’t you think?

I don’t make the randomness of whether I have certain books and mods.

I don’t make the randomness of ship construction. After spending days gathering everything needed to make a ship it can vary greatly in its quality, value, and capabilities.

I can not make many ship permits. They happen randomly.

I don’t make whether I will ever find woods decent enough for a competitive ship. I can not create other players, extra clans, a bigger player population or capture ports by myself to grab resources from others.

I can not make economic activity around trade goods matter to my nation and it’s war effort.

So you see, it’s not really in a “if life gives you lemons, make lemonade” scenario. We have no lemons.

I want complexity and difficulty, not brick walls.