jodgi Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 12 minutes ago, Eleazar de Damas said: All other characteristics being equal, a teak / white oak ship is 3% faster than a oak/oak. Impossible to run. The poorly designed ship will have to fight. So exiting! You are right, ofcourse. The oak ship can eat a broadside or two more than the t/wo ship, so there's that.
Aquillas Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 12 minutes ago, jodgi said: You are right, ofcourse. The oak ship can eat a broadside or two more than the t/wo ship, so there's that. Hum.... don't forget fire, leak and crew resistance, all against oak built, and turn rate.
Angus MacDuff Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 1 minute ago, rediii said: You guys are just used to use other woods than oak/oak. Why not just use it in the future? Live/white: Just hugg him and trade broadsides and you win. You are faster. Teak/white: same but you are slower, its a bit tricky in this case but the cost of the other guys ship exceeds your cost by A LOT while the ability in combat isn't that different. Just go HP and reload cap in oak/oak ships and hug everyone. Since thickness is nerfed with pen values now I dont see a problem. You guys are just not used to something that is called "change" There is nothing more condescending than someone who has the best equipment, telling you how to get by with second class equipment. This is why I feel that having the rare stuff so exclusive is a major problem. I don't want to be advised on how I should settle for my oak/oak ship. I want everyone who plays the game to have a reasonable chance at all of the premium materials. Without having to be someone's friend and without paying super high prices. 6
Guest Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Angus MacDuff said: There is nothing more condescending than someone who has the best equipment, telling you how to get by with second class equipment. This is why I feel that having the rare stuff so exclusive is a major problem. I don't want to be advised on how I should settle for my oak/oak ship. I want everyone who plays the game to have a reasonable chance at all of the premium materials. Without having to be someone's friend and without paying super high prices. rediii know that he have after a few weeks the best ports but he have a problem after few month...nobody is playing anymore Edited March 11, 2019 by Guest
Tom Farseer Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 (edited) 5 hours ago, rediii said: You guys are just used to use other woods than oak/oak. [...] Just go HP and reload cap in oak/oak ships and hug everyone. Since thickness is nerfed with pen values now I dont see a problem. You guys are just not used to something that is called "change" THAT! 5 hours ago, Intrepido said: More insufferable grind, less action. As simple as that, people will not come here to spend 6 days of farming to have 1 day of action. Why do some many people completely think that everyone must sail first rates? It's only less action if you insist on sailing biggest shihps with igh-end mods because you are afraid everyone else does. Go out in an Oak/Oak 3rd or 4th rate and have some fun. Take two or three of them with good captains and you can still spoil any Bucentaures day. Currently clans and srong players live from what they could hamster on their docks before econ wipe. Once that is gone the playing field will be level again, and with prices as they are now maybe 1st and 2nd rate ships will become the rarity they are supposed to be. And to those that say they only want to sail big ships I say: The difference in sailing behaviour between a Constitution and for example a Christian is neglible. Both turn about as quick as a bucket full of lead and it's still way faster than in reality 😁 Edited March 11, 2019 by Tom Farseer spelling, if you find more mistakes keep 'em :P 1
victor Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Angus MacDuff said: There is nothing more condescending than someone who has the best equipment, telling you how to get by with second class equipment. This is why I feel that having the rare stuff so exclusive is a major problem. I don't want to be advised on how I should settle for my oak/oak ship. I want everyone who plays the game to have a reasonable chance at all of the premium materials. Without having to be someone's friend and without paying super high prices. To solve the problem we could use an handicap system like in golf. In wow, in example, the boss has HP and damage that is calculated on the number and (If I recall correctly) also on item level of the players in the raid. Let's think if in NA each player has a kill/death PVP ratio tracked by the game: when you enter in to a combat instance the system makes a comparison between the K/D ratio of all the players and uses it to "compensate" to a certain extent some stats (i.e. reload and HP) so that the best players have some of their stats - of course only partially - nerfed to compensate their higher skills and gear (or, alternatively, buffing the stats of the less good player). This system will apply also to any new player that enters the instance, depending on the side he joins. The effect will be that pro pvper shall actually use all their skill to win and average players should be less afraid to face other players in combat). This is just a basic idea, but the concept should be clear. Edited March 11, 2019 by victor
Angus MacDuff Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 1 minute ago, rediii said: It's nice that everyone tells me what I think or what I do/did and will do in the future. I didn't mean to open up a personal attack on you. Im trying to make the point that many will be very unhappy that they can't use the best mats (which others have) , and that we will see a lot of bitterness from this. It's natural to want to use the best stuff and I fail to understand why it's not available to all. In my mind, more available mats means more ships in OW. I hate making the statement "many players will quit because...", but a two (or more) tier game will cause a lot of grief.
Sir Loorkon Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 (edited) I do not see any problem with the woods. Those players that run away with T/WO ships today will run away with whatever ship (T/WO or oak/oak) tomorrow. Those players that fight today in whatever ships will fight in whatever ships tomorrow. Adapt! Don't stay fokussed on old metas. Edited March 11, 2019 by Sir Loorkon 5
Aquillas Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 (edited) 41 minutes ago, rediii said: Crew resi ok fire? whats that? leaks ... is that 1 leak you need more to sink someone? turn rate, how much % is that? I agree that crew resistance is the highest point here. Others will just have a cumulative impact. Better turn rate would avoid one more leak, which could be the one which makes you sink or not, etc. In another hand, we all know that the most important wood is the wood in which the captain is built. Edited March 11, 2019 by Eleazar de Damas
Vizzini Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 7 minutes ago, Sir Loorkon said: I do not see any problem with the woods. Those players that run away with T/WO ships today will run away with whatever ship (T/WO or oak/oak) tomorrow. Those players that fight today in whatever ships will fight in whatever ships tomorrow. Adapt! Don't stay fokussed on old metas. just wait until they have painted them !!!!
Angus MacDuff Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 (edited) 43 minutes ago, rediii said: You guys are just used to use other woods than oak/oak. Why not just use it in the future? Live/white: Just hugg him and trade broadsides and you win. You are faster. 27 minutes ago, victor said: To solve the problem we could use an handicap system like in golf. 9 minutes ago, Sir Loorkon said: I do not see any problem with the woods. Those players that run away with T/WO ships today will run away with whatever ship (T/WO or oak/oak) tomorrow. Those players that fight today in whatever ships will fight in whatever ships tomorrow. Adapt! Don't stay fokussed on old metas. 9 minutes ago, Eleazar de Damas said: I agree that crew resistance is the highest point here. Others will just have a cumulative impact. Better turn rate would avoid one more leak, which could be the one which makes you sink or not, etc. All of these suggestions address how a player should compensate for not having a rare commodity. What it does not address is that handing rare stuff to specific clans puts power over other players into the hands of that clan (clan leader). This is effectively giving someone a monopoly over a resource. Not good for the game, IMO, but i'll leave it alone for now. Edited March 11, 2019 by Angus MacDuff 1
Vizzini Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 Just now, Angus MacDuff said: All of these suggestions address how a player should compensate for not having a rare commodity. What it does not address is that handing rare stuff to specific clans puts power over other players into the hands of that clan (clan leader). This is effectively giving someone a monopoly over a resource. Not good fore the game, IMO, but i'll leave it alone for now. I understand your point of view and your fears but how many big battles would their have been for cartagena tar if the same resource was available for all via the admiralty ? we fight and trade for the resources.i have always had to try and build up my cash reserves to be able to afford some upgrades and books admins trying to stimulate resource wars 1
Aquillas Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 1 minute ago, Angus MacDuff said: This is effectively giving someone a monopoly over a resource. Not good fore the game, IMO, but i'll leave it alone for now. For the moment, monopoly to a nation, allowing and encouraging use of alts. To kill the game, just limit this monopoly to a clan. 1
Angus MacDuff Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 3 minutes ago, Vizzini said: I understand your point of view and your fears but how many big battles would their have been for cartagena tar if the same resource was available for all via the admiralty ? we fight and trade for the resources.i have always had to try and build up my cash reserves to be able to afford some upgrades and books admins trying to stimulate resource wars I agree with you that that is why it's happening and I also agree that we need a reason to take ports. 2 minutes ago, Eleazar de Damas said: For the moment, monopoly to a nation, allowing and encouraging use of alts. To kill the game, just limit this monopoly to a clan. And here is the solution. Not perfect... (Perfect is the enemy of good enough)
Teutonic Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 (edited) I wish the wood difference would be seen as a mute point now. Honestly I am with @rediii and of the opinion that because of the new damage model, woods really don't make a whole lot of difference. If you're in a te/wo ship, and I in an oak/oak. The battle will be won by who has more experience. I am not saying wood doesn't have a factor in helping, but with all the perm mods and books we can find and have, you can customize your ship any way you want. The 2 ships with different woods can just become the "same" after mods and books are applied. Edited March 11, 2019 by Teutonic 2
Guest Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 44 minutes ago, rediii said: How do you even know I have the best equipment? You get told by someone who sailed sab/sab ships in portbattles, sails Cag/sab oceans (and told whole dutch nation to do it) and sails whatever ships he has. You think you have problems atm but actually you wont see many good wood ships in future after wipe and if you do probably only pve players sail them outside of PBs its funny how everyone thinks its all about the ship, but in the end its about the individual skill of every single player
Rabman Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 This argument crops up from time to time and is just as weak each time it comes up. If two top clans fight in a contentious port battle, with identical fleet comp and one has gold ships and the other has cag/sabicu ships, that will probably make a difference. However your random patrol zone or pvp fight, it doesn't matter, and it has never mattered. How many screenshots of Ram and Liq do people have to see or how many other screenshots of lopsided fights being won by better players before this can stop being brought up. There is no point to rare woods if everyone has them. Min, maxing every percentage is a luxury not a requirement. 4
Archaos Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 2 hours ago, admin said: With new damage - xp is now doubled (will need to be tuned) so this statement is incorrect (and we know for sure that some players can reach top rank in just a week) Overpriced ships is also partially incorrect - as both LH and materials for all ships below 3rd rates were lowered. Ships are cheaper now than before (considering all elements including LH). Lineships are more expensive but even them got lower LH. (8 days before vs 4 days now) It was never easier to craft with loads of goods available in buildings Belle poule - a good workhorse - cost is just 13000 reals and you can craft 5 more of them per day than before (2.4 days vs 0.49 days in lh). I dont think the over price and scarcity of ships is due to the labor hours, I think it is due to the scarcity of rare woods. People still want to buy the meta wood ships so it is pointless crafting basic wood ships and hoping they will sell. There appears to be a problem with some of the clan resource missions that is stopping people getting rare woods, but have not heard anything back about that issue. At the moment people are still using ships they built before the patch, but eventually those will run out and there are not many people gearing up their production because they know there will be another wipe fairly soon. I think it would have been really telling in this last patch if ships had been wiped too as PvP would have been almost non-existent apart from DLC ships.
La bouche Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 2 hours ago, Eleazar de Damas said: My general conclusion is Naval Action is especially designed for unemployed or retired singles. They can play for 7:00 to 11:00 to earn reals. They can go to the max rang in just a week. Morning to get reals, afternoon to get doubloons (transport missions), evening to gank Lol 😆 I just think how many married ones divorced since they started to a play this game. But seriously, to keep increasing the pop and not losing people what this game urge is casual content (exploring, hidden caches filled with precious stuff, etc) other way, only guys with serious mental disorders will keep playing it. 2
Archaos Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 56 minutes ago, Vizzini said: I understand your point of view and your fears but how many big battles would their have been for cartagena tar if the same resource was available for all via the admiralty ? But how many big battles were there for Cartagena tar since the one spawn port was introduced? For other resources such as Copper ingots I dont believe I ever saw a port battle for Esteros. The problem with the way these resources were handled is that it was too easy to get round the restriction by using alts as everyone could access the resource in the nation, and this is what I like about the new system where access is limited to clan members and those on their friends list. This should generate a need to attack these ports to secure the resource. 2
Tom Farseer Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 29 minutes ago, Intrepido said: A oak oak christian VII has 72 thickness. A live white one, 86. Please guys, stop being naive. An Oak/Oak Christian is also one full knot faster. Also 6 pound longs penetrate 102 thickness on parallel sides. Stop comparing only the values that fit your narrative and start painting the whole picture. 3
Archaos Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 1 minute ago, rediii said: Esteros is in US timezone. There were plenty of PBs for little harbour. And for cartagena there were several campaigns. Cartagena is a too big of a port to attack it a lot also becaus eof playernumbers. With more numbers you would see more battles for cartagena. Also when you talk about cartagena you have to talk about the surrounding ports aswell. But overall considering the importance of the resources there was not that much action in RvR for them because people could get round it using alts and even if your clan owned the port there was no way to stop alts getting access to the resource. The only real benefit of owning these ports was the added income as the auction price for the rare resource went up.
Aquillas Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 5 minutes ago, Archaos said: I like about the new system where access is limited to clan members and those on their friends list. This should generate a need to attack these ports to secure the resource. Knowing general behaviour of clans, this would not work at all. Or this game would first require: - Either an in game diplomacy system, that clans cannot overpass. - Or the cancellation of nations (and as a consequence of all independent players)
Vizzini Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 9 minutes ago, Archaos said: But overall considering the importance of the resources there was not that much action in RvR for them because people could get round it using alts and even if your clan owned the port there was no way to stop alts getting access to the resource. The only real benefit of owning these ports was the added income as the auction price for the rare resource went up. Resource shortages should drive RVR but alts have a way of sneaking in and getting it. Locking it behind clans friends only would sort some of that. Not sure how many more whines that would create Plenty of battles for many of the good ports but we will always come back to timers being set unfairly ( depending on our own pov and playtime ) and alts which could easily be restricted. the bigger clans and bigger nations will always hold sway , the rest of us will be left to pick the scraps
Aquillas Posted March 11, 2019 Posted March 11, 2019 9 minutes ago, rediii said: Esteros is in US timezone. There were plenty of PBs for little harbour. To be more clear about Esteros, it was first owned by the French clan EDR, of which I was diplomat. An American clan moved to France. They asked us this timer, to give them a chance to have content. What EDR did. A pirate clan attacked. This clan was far weaker than defenders but the port was not defended. Then, American clans reattacked the weak pirate clan, to own the port... Clan behaviour... No more attack after that. Maybe, there would have been more content with a stronger US player base in game. 1
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