Too many doubloons in AI trade ships

[Archaos]

Can anyone confirm how the doubloons that drop from a PvP kill are calculated, I mean the ones that appear in the sunk ship? 

Is it completely random or is it based on the number of doubloons the player has in their chest? I heard someone say it was based on the number in their chest and thus it was wise to have as few as possible in your chest to restrict what other players can get from killing you. But if this is the case then PvP'ers can dictate the amount of doubloons in circulation by always having maximum doubloons in their chest as this will make PvP kills more attractive. As far as I know the doubloons that appear in the sunk ship do not actually come out of the players chest so it is not a loss to the player that has been sunk.

Quite often I have got no doubloons from a PvP kill apart from those given at the end of a fight, and that is from players that I know have made previous kills and so should have some doubloons.

[Angus MacDuff]

I think the AI doubloon drop is pretty good right now.  It was very high last week.  Twice, I got over 6K doubloons from AI traders.  Lately, it seem to be around 500-1000.  I agree with those who say that kill missions don't pay enough for the effort in comparison.  I also think that doubloon drop after PVP kills is pretty good.  What I would really like to see is the chest rewards be buffed.  More gold and silver chests for killing 15 ships in a class and better books/mods in those chests.  Even a mission chest should have something good.  I feel let down every time I open one.

[La bouche]

The doubloons are the coin that devs introduced to regulate the economy. It’s like dollars and devs team made something like federal bank reserve: the reason that you can find tons of doubloons in traders is that “greeders” are inflating the market. Once the conversation rate is stabilized in lower prices, the doubloons drops will decrease automatically.

In fact it was an genius movement from devs introducing that coin.

Once you understand all the mechanics involved behind the economy changes and the value of doubloons as a regulation tool of market you will be fine and anticipate some things. Time now is to stock doubloons...

All working fine to me.

[La bouche]

50 minutes ago, Hemp Amore said:

No, that is precisely the point.  You say they’re too many, but they economy says they’re not enough from any and all sources.  The 300 real price point says that.  The devs desire a 10 real price point for the doubloon.  So the only way to get that is to increase the supply in the economy from all sources.  It doesn’t matter where they come from, but they have to get infused into the economy aka players pulling doubloons of any and all activity they do in OW.  When all global players have more doubloons to spend, it will drive the price down because supply & demand = price.  Right now doubloons have too high a perceived value because simply put people don’t have enough.  Until  all players as a whole have more the price will remain inflated because demand is greater than supply.  

You got it 😉.

 

[Sea Archer]

In the last two weeks I found several trader with a few hundred or even more than thousand doubloons. It is currently bad balanced. I hope devs will take care of it.

[greybuscat]

1 hour ago, Draymoor said:

Why does every change in this game even a hot fix has to be done in extremes...? We needed some more doubloons in the economy but now you can easily get between 1500 and 4000 doubloons from 1 lousy AI trader that takes no effort to sink. While missions continue to reward 1000 doubloons for sinking multiple SOLs??? 

A kill mission will reward you with less 100 doubloons for sinking 3 ships equal to your own ships rating but go and sink one trader brig and you can score 1500 doubloons? Where is the sense? Where is the balance? If you're going to increase the amount of doubloons rewarded it has to be done in every instance in which doubloons can be earner and increase it according to the challenge and difficulty of each task. A immediate hot fix is needed to reduce the amount of doubloons dropped by AI traders to at least 25% of their current values and AI warships to around 50% of current values. 

Please increase the doubloons rewarded from other sources like all mission types, damage done in pvp, events. We can't fix the economy by breaking it in a different way. 
 

Are you talking about the patch that just dropped, or how it's been recently? Last night I captured 5 AI traders and got 1400 in one and vendor trash in the other four. This is consistent with my experiences in the past week or so, sinking dozens and dozens of trader snows, trader brigs, and LGVs. Unless something changed in the last couple of hours, 3000 doubloons in an LGV is an outlier. I know some players have seen payouts like that (looking at you, Vodka! *shakes fist*), but I have been testing this stuff pretty extensively (as in charting my results, not just estimating), and I'm yet to see anything over 2200.

Now, 1400/5 averages out to 280 each, which isn't some huge amount. Since AI ships tend to show up in clusters, with long stretches of open ocean in between, enough doubloons for 3 1/2 Navy Hull mods in exchange for an hour of sailing about, boarding, dodging enemy players in buffed out Essex's cruising in their safe zones that are in front of my port for some reason, etc, doesn't seem out of balance to me.

Sure it's not hard, but it isn't risk free, and it's still time-consuming.

I'd have to do this for a couple of hours to pay for one 3rd rate lineship, and even longer to get a good PB ship. And that's just for the doubloons for the ship! Admiralty mods cost more, rare mods require even more work, etc. What's wrong with this, exactly? What's being "thrown out of balance?"

If you want "kill" missions buffed, since they're even more of a slog, I'm all for that. I would just rather they buff the rewards for everything else (PvP by a god bit, mission rewards by a lot) rather than nerf AI drops.

1 hour ago, Draymoor said:

So you think it makes sense for a player in a 3rd rate to drop 700 doubloons and LGVs dropping 3000? I hunted 10 AI brigs tonight and made over 10k doubloons in a couple of hours, how long to make that from PvP? What is the point of take a mission to sink 10 5th rates for 500 doubloons if you can regularly get 1500 from 1 AI brig?

You got extremely lucky, are exaggerating, or are mistaken. I would prefer to believe that you got lucky. Either way, if you were making the argument that PvP rewards probably need a buff, I'd agree with you. The downsides of having plentiful doubloons are few, and the problems that come with not having enough are crippling.

[Sir Texas Sir]

Ok going test this out.  RNG hates me so going to see if even I get DOubloons from trade ships now....lol   Some one hold my beer.

[Archaos]

What people seem to forget is that if traders did not give the chance of a jackpot drop of doubloons then people would stop hunting them as there is only a little profit to be gained from the 4 or 5 trade goods they carry, and if people stop hunting them then there is less player traffic in OW for hunters to hunt that want PvP.

To get the PvE'ers out of the safe zones you have to make the rewards attractive enough that it is worth the risk. That PvE'er can then go capture that jackpot AI trader and the PvP'er can get him on the way back to port.

I still believe people exaggerate the chances of a jackpot drop from AI traders, yes some may drop thousands of doubloons but they are few and far between in my experience and I have not found them to be a reliable source of doubloons. Most of my doubloons have come from patrol zone battles as it is very easy to hit the 20k damage to net 2k doubloons. 

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

4 hours ago, Draymoor said:

Newcomers aren't fighting AI 3 to 1 or even 2 to 1. Those missions aren't for newcomers and they also have useless rewards in 90% of cases. 

I don't know man...

Seems like a good deal for a newcomer...

Oh yeah... has to sail...  

[Custard]

I am having a vastly different experience than the OP

Traders are giving me trade goods and some building resources no Dubs however I feel I am about to drown in Dubs from OW AI ships 5th rates mostly but some SOLs

 

Too funny

[z4ys]

I always had more dbs than reals so sad...

[La bouche]

2 hours ago, Hethwill the Red Duke said:

I don't know man...

Seems like a good deal for a newcomer...

Oh yeah... has to sail...  

Usually you get good stuff on that chests, specially the new refits like muskets....

[Sir Max Magic]

13 hours ago, greybuscat said:

Are you talking about the patch that just dropped, or how it's been recently? Last night I captured 5 AI traders and got 1400 in one and vendor trash in the other four. This is consistent with my experiences in the past week or so, sinking dozens and dozens of trader snows, trader brigs, and LGVs. Unless something changed in the last couple of hours, 3000 doubloons in an LGV is an outlier. I know some players have seen payouts like that (looking at you, Vodka! *shakes fist*), but I have been testing this stuff pretty extensively (as in charting my results, not just estimating), and I'm yet to see anything over 2200.

Now, 1400/5 averages out to 280 each, which isn't some huge amount. Since AI ships tend to show up in clusters, with long stretches of open ocean in between, enough doubloons for 3 1/2 Navy Hull mods in exchange for an hour of sailing about, boarding, dodging enemy players in buffed out Essex's cruising in their safe zones that are in front of my port for some reason, etc, doesn't seem out of balance to me.

Sure it's not hard, but it isn't risk free, and it's still time-consuming.

I'd have to do this for a couple of hours to pay for one 3rd rate lineship, and even longer to get a good PB ship. And that's just for the doubloons for the ship! Admiralty mods cost more, rare mods require even more work, etc. What's wrong with this, exactly? What's being "thrown out of balance?"

If you want "kill" missions buffed, since they're even more of a slog, I'm all for that. I would just rather they buff the rewards for everything else (PvP by a god bit, mission rewards by a lot) rather than nerf AI drops.

You got extremely lucky, are exaggerating, or are mistaken. I would prefer to believe that you got lucky. Either way, if you were making the argument that PvP rewards probably need a buff, I'd agree with you. The downsides of having plentiful doubloons are few, and the problems that come with not having enough are crippling.

 

13 hours ago, Archaos said:

What people seem to forget is that if traders did not give the chance of a jackpot drop of doubloons then people would stop hunting them as there is only a little profit to be gained from the 4 or 5 trade goods they carry, and if people stop hunting them then there is less player traffic in OW for hunters to hunt that want PvP.

To get the PvE'ers out of the safe zones you have to make the rewards attractive enough that it is worth the risk. That PvE'er can then go capture that jackpot AI trader and the PvP'er can get him on the way back to port.

I still believe people exaggerate the chances of a jackpot drop from AI traders, yes some may drop thousands of doubloons but they are few and far between in my experience and I have not found them to be a reliable source of doubloons. Most of my doubloons have come from patrol zone battles as it is very easy to hit the 20k damage to net 2k doubloons. 

 

Agree 100%

OP is either exaggerating or had extreme luck !!

I am hunting myself Traders in enemy territory since 2 weeks and even the last 3 days, i found Dubs in only 1 of 4 to 5 Traders, most times around 600 - 1600 Dubs, averages out to 300 - 400 Dubs per Trader, which isnt that much given the fact that you often have to patrol for half an hour and only find 1st and 2nd rate Ships and NO Trader at all...

 

I also support the argument that people get drawn out of safety zone...because its the case for myself 😋

Edited December 18, 2018 by Sir Max Magic

[Draymoor]

12 hours ago, Hethwill the Red Duke said:

I don't know man...

Seems like a good deal for a newcomer...

Oh yeah... has to sail...  

You're picking one of out 10 missions like that where the rewards are actually good. I don't know if it's random or what, most missions like that do not give those rewards. Funny you post that probably knowing the reality. 

[Draymoor]

1 hour ago, Sir Max Magic said:

 

 

Agree 100%

OP is either exaggerating or had extreme luck !!

I am hunting myself Traders in enemy territory since 2 weeks and even the last 3 days, i found Dubs in only 1 of 4 to 5 Traders, most times around 600 - 1600 Dubs, averages out to 300 - 400 Dubs per Trader, which isnt that much given the fact that you often have to patrol for half an hour and only find 1st and 2nd rate Ships and NO Trader at all...

 

I also support the argument that people get drawn out of safety zone...because its the case for myself 😋

One person was talking about getting 24k doubloons while hunting traders in the Bahamas in one night. I got 10k from doing the same, call it whatever you want, maybe you're happy 'cause doubloons yay' but that silly mentality doesn't lead to a stable economy. Rewards in doubloons for anything requiring real effort is shit in comparison while doing the easiest task in the game rewards thousands of doubloons. A rookie player can get a first rate in one day. Quite literally. I thought of the point of patch 27 was to make 1st rates rare? I wasn't 'extremely lucky' I was testing it and doing the same thing daily for days. I went from 30k doubloons to 120k in a few days. AI warships drop rate seems decent but AI traders were by far the easiest method. 

Edited December 18, 2018 by Draymoor

[Sir Max Magic]

5 hours ago, Draymoor said:

One person was talking about getting 24k doubloons while hunting traders in the Bahamas in one night. I got 10k from doing the same, call it whatever you want, maybe you're happy 'cause doubloons yay' but that silly mentality doesn't lead to a stable economy. Rewards in doubloons for anything requiring real effort is shit in comparison while doing the easiest task in the game rewards thousands of doubloons. A rookie player can get a first rate in one day. Quite literally. I thought of the point of patch 27 was to make 1st rates rare? I wasn't 'extremely lucky' I was testing it and doing the same thing daily for days. I went from 30k doubloons to 120k in a few days. AI warships drop rate seems decent but AI traders were by far the easiest method. 

One person talks this, another person talks that, blablabla...people tends to exagerate in nearly EVERY aspect in MMOs:

- if they found a stache of 5.001 Gold, they claim in chat, they found nearly 10.000

- if they barely survived a 1on1, they claim, they had steamrolled the enemy

- blablabla

I hope, you got the point !

Take EVERYTHING what people states in MMOs with a grain of salt 😋

 

Nevertheless, even given the point, this guy was right...whats so bad about this??? He grinded a WHOLE night !!!

When people do fighting a whole night in PZ, they can easily get the same amount of Dubs, if you take into account the Dubs from destroyed player vessels, not to mention the captured ships, upgrades etc...

Dont know whether this raiding affects the economy of the enemy nation in a negative way, getting no more PVE Traders to the ports...???

If this would be the case, Trader hunting would have an even greater positive impact on PVP, because then a nation would begin to defend their Traders^^

 

But i agree in one point:

Traders should be escorted by 1 to 2 warships of different sizes from time to time the bigger the payload, the better the escorting ships !!  ...giving some variety to the fights and ofc we need AI Indiamens... 😊

Edited December 18, 2018 by Sir Max Magic

[Sento de Benimaclet]

22 hours ago, Draymoor said:

Why does every change in this game even a hot fix has to be done in extremes...? We needed some more doubloons in the economy but now you can easily get between 1500 and 4000 doubloons from 1 lousy AI trader that takes no effort to sink. While missions continue to reward 1000 doubloons for sinking multiple SOLs??? 

If they seem too much, do not take them or take half. Or share them with your clanmates who will be very needed. I do not understand why to complain about positive things as there are more doubloons in AI traders. If we want to see large ships in the PvP, welcome those extra doubloons in the IA traders.

 

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

5 hours ago, Draymoor said:

You're picking one of out 10 missions like that where the rewards are actually good. I don't know if it's random or what, most missions like that do not give those rewards. Funny you post that probably knowing the reality. 

No. I posted 1 mission found in a port. There's plenty like that, mostly 6th rates . not designated ships.

Look, you can look with whatever mindset you want to the picture, truth is missions like that are out there.

That is the only reason I posted it. To show the possibilities, not the absolute certainties.

Sail and you shall find. Whine and you shall grow salty.

It is not intended for salty vets. It is intended for a new captains that may pass and read the words.

[Baptiste Gallouédec]

From my understanding, sinking ai traders out of a port will have a real time impact over the economy of this port-> if that is the case it will incitate players to patrol looking for those ai trader Hunters. Even more if hostility is somewhat tied to the income of the ports.

If that s coming, putting good amount of dbl in ai traders will participate in the success  of the operation:

- ppl will pve solo vs ai traders out of ennemi ports: get dbl to bring back in hold

- ppl will hunt those pvers either by joining battle or chasing them in ow : get dbl from the pvers hold + rewards 

= pvp generated + better pb initiating system

Edited December 18, 2018 by Baptiste Gallouédec

[Marquês do Bonfim]

Merchant ships are suppose to have more loot than a frigate or a SOL, that's just perfectly correct and should be like that in my opinion. The missions only reward you because otherwise it wouldn't make sense to do them in the first place, but if you wanna farm doubloons, hunt merchant ships and it will be way more rewarding because they are always carrying resources and doubloons, that is just how it works, mate.

Atleast in my own opinion tho.

[Sea Archer]

It seems to be getting worse. Today I capped an LGV with 3400 doubloons.

Many traders just carry doubloons and nothing else. I hope that will be fixed the next days.

Make traders carrying resources and trade goods or even a cargo of long guns. Maybe in addition up to 100 doubloons, but not more.

[AeRoTR]

31 minutes ago, Sea Archer said:

It seems to be getting worse. Today I capped an LGV with 3400 doubloons.

Many traders just carry doubloons and nothing else. I hope that will be fixed the next days.

Make traders carrying resources and trade goods or even a cargo of long guns. Maybe in addition up to 100 doubloons, but not more.

That is your luck.

I attacked many traders, most carried trade goods and rare woods, only few carried dubloons.

[Sea Archer]

1 hour ago, AeRoTR said:

That is your luck.

I attacked many traders, most carried trade goods and rare woods, only few carried dubloons.

If it is luck or not, there is not much sense in doing missions as long as it is possible to get a higher income from traders. 

In my opinion missions and sinking or capping warships should be the major supply of doubloons, not traders.

Capping traders should give you the mats to build ships for the battles, that may result in doubloons. 

[AeRoTR]

@Sea Archer totaly agree with you, mission rewards should be buffed like 5x or 10x times. Funny mission "go sink a 3rd rate in your 5th rate, I will give you 70 dubloons" lol

[SS Minnow]

Looks like the AI trader (class 8) loot ranges from 600 to 7000 doubloons.  Here's the doubloons loot summary for all RNG.

 

DoubloonsLoot1.pdf