Patrol ROE spinoff

[Red Dragon 13]

8 hours ago, admin said:

Time to discuss Patrol ROE.
What is bothering you in patrols?

We plan to add limited entry events or so called OW tournaments which will not happen in the lobby but will happen in the open world in designated areas. 

• Solo patrol - battles will start 1v1 and immediately close. 
• Group (or also clan based) patrol - battles will close as soon as 6 players join the battle

Such patrols will probably feature the challenge leaderboards as well, that provide limited number of attempts, helping players with limited time to have equal chance with those who play non stop.

I don´t want to be off topic but, Admin, can you add battles between AIs that the solo player can join (on his own side if it is the case, and on either one if it is foreign AIs)?

[jodgi]

5 minutes ago, Polish Privateer said:

but I'm already at the start placed heavily against the odds.

Hm... What ship are you picturing yourself in?

I don't play all the time so I've only had one brush against a herc, and that was me in a shop frigate against herc and boarding requin.

Can a herc really sterncamp someone like you in a proper frigate? Say it ain't so...

[Old Crusty]

7 hours ago, jodgi said:

We can't care for people who get mad for getting PvP on the way to a PvP zone. Maybe he wanted guaranteed doubloons for damage but you forced him to fight for it in normal OW. This is so ok, purpose completed and not defeated.

This is griefing 

[jodgi]

21 minutes ago, Old Crusty said:

This is griefing 

You have set the bar in a place the buses don't go.

[Liq]

59 minutes ago, Old Crusty said:

This is griefing 

How? 

If you tag someone on the border of patrol zone with the intention of actually fighting - and knowing what you are gonna face, with no reinforcments joining 20 min later - that seems totally fine

However if you are just tagging for whatever reason but not fighting, then yeah thats griefing IMO

[Draymoor]

8 hours ago, jodgi said:

We can't care for people who get mad for getting PvP on the way to a PvP zone. Maybe he wanted guaranteed doubloons for damage but you forced him to fight for it in normal OW. This is so ok, purpose completed and not defeated.

Absolutely not, that kind of behavior should not be encouraged in any way. 

[Angus MacDuff]

4 hours ago, Draymoor said:

Absolutely not, that kind of behavior should not be encouraged in any way. 

What kind of behavior.  I tagged a couple of players outside of the patrol zone and fought them.  That's PVP.  If I had tagged them inside of the patrol zone, there is a very good chance I would have been ganked.  The patrol zone roe is broken and I don't care to be a victim of it.  I mostly run alone and the patrol zone is certain death for me.  

[Draymoor]

15 minutes ago, Angus MacDuff said:

What kind of behavior.  I tagged a couple of players outside of the patrol zone and fought them.  That's PVP.  If I had tagged them inside of the patrol zone, there is a very good chance I would have been ganked.  The patrol zone roe is broken and I don't care to be a victim of it.  I mostly run alone and the patrol zone is certain death for me.  

The kind of behavior that can get people to stop wanting to participate in the only half decent pvp event we have. One person doing it, doesn't matter, a lot of people mimicking that action would. 

[Old Crusty]

4 hours ago, Wraith said:

Don't bite, @Old Crusty is a PvE-oriented player who just wants to sail his cheap, first rate spam in peace. He doesn't know what he's talking about or asking for.

Look, you all want more people to WANT to leave the safe areas and go seek PvP. So here is a player that decides a good way to get his feet wet in the PvP arena is to go to the Patrol Zone so that when he loses his ship at least he will have earned some Doubloons for his effort. He is just about to enter the Patrol Zone and you tag him and sink him. He gets nothing except pissed off that when he finally decided to try PvP out you screwed him by hanging around the Patrol Zone and tagging him before he got there.

That is the very definition of griefing. Purposely preventing a player from participating in a portion of a game.

[Angus MacDuff]

31 minutes ago, Old Crusty said:

Look, you all want more people to WANT to leave the safe areas and go seek PvP. So here is a player that decides a good way to get his feet wet in the PvP arena is to go to the Patrol Zone so that when he loses his ship at least he will have earned some Doubloons for his effort. He is just about to enter the Patrol Zone and you tag him and sink him. He gets nothing except pissed off that when he finally decided to try PvP out you screwed him by hanging around the Patrol Zone and tagging him before he got there.

That is the very definition of griefing. Purposely preventing a player from participating in a portion of a game.

By that definition, tagging a trader before it reaches port with a cargo is also griefing, because I prevented him from doing the trade run he wanted.  OW always has the potential for combat.  If I stop you from getting to your destination, that's Naval Action, not griefing.  

[Slim McSauce]

Just now, Angus MacDuff said:

By that definition, tagging a trader before it reaches port with a cargo is also griefing, because I prevented him from doing the trade run he wanted.  OW always has the potential for combat.  If I stop you from getting to your destination, that's Naval Action, not griefing.  

Technically speaking no, but you have to see from the perspective of every day player. If your intention is to fight in the patrol zone and you get caught outside of it, does that make you happy or angry? Are you okay with getting that combat or annoyed? Combat is combat isn't it?

We've seen a lot of salt from screening fleets shutting down PBs before they happen. Many people don't like this, many say it's part of the game. I bet you there's very big overlap of people who would say that one is okay and one is not. Moreso than who would say both are OK.

[Old Crusty]

1 minute ago, Angus MacDuff said:

By that definition, tagging a trader before it reaches port with a cargo is also griefing, because I prevented him from doing the trade run he wanted.  OW always has the potential for combat.  If I stop you from getting to your destination, that's Naval Action, not griefing.  

Yes, do not bother to address the point that you are causing people to quit the game because you prevent them from at least getting some reward FOR DOING EXACTLY WHAT YOU WANT THEM TO DO.

[Angus MacDuff]

Stop shouting.  A player is moving from one spot to another, whether it is Patrol zone, trading or going to a PB. They get tagged and destroyed, failing to accomplish their mission.  Why is what I did different from taking down a trader with all of his money invested in one load.  I would have been happy to go into the Patrol zone if it weren't broken.

[Custard]

3 hours ago, Hullabaloo 'The Thief' said:

What is the point of trading at all if there is no risk? That's boring. Patrols are the problem, not the solution. No one is playing anymore, and those that are left can only find action in (or near  ) the Patrol Zone. OW sailing and finding stuff to fight was the best part of this game, now it's dead. I liked this game cos it was hard and you got ganked, there was a fear factor, trading was risky, leaving the port was risky! You could get attacked anywhere. Now its lame. As long as you avoid the zone you're pretty much safe. This whole thread worries me. Patrol zone ROE? Why is admin even asking us about this anyway?  how hard can it be? If you have to have these shit patrols just design a mechanic that discourages wildly uneven battles already!  Stop dumbing everything down, giving up and being lazy with the game mechanics: sending us all off to some zone arbitrarily placed on the map to go fight other players who don't have anything to do either, like American Gladiator morons. Actually use some imagination and game design skills and create a game world that we can enjoy and invest in? If the Patrol Zone IS PvP and that's what this game is now being designed around then it is dead already. Design the game on the assumption that people will play it! Don't design the game in such a way as to give people something to do because people are NOT playing it! Because if you do that then people won't play it and that is exactly what we are witnessing atm.

I get where you are coming from but I would disagree with the cause

Numbers are down because the last patch made things too hard core for the average player this is caused because the average player was attacking enemy open world fleets around ports there own faction controlled now they have to do this too close to enemy controlled ports

Whilst looking for suitable targets to unlock knowledge slots on Indiaman around Tantun, since the last patch, I have lost 3 of them 

[Sir Loorkon]

50 minutes ago, Custard said:

Numbers are down because the last patch made things too hard core for the average player this is caused because the average player was attacking enemy open world fleets around ports there own faction controlled now they have to do this too close to enemy controlled ports

Your  „average“ player can still do this on the peace sever. If this is the „average“ player, why is he playing on the war server. I hope the real average player wants to do PvP on OW and not PvE in reinforcementzones. If players are the main content and your definition of an „average“ player would be right, those „average“ players are no content anyway. So it does not matter if they leave the war sever because they do not want to fight. I hope I am right.

Edited December 1, 2018 by Sir Loorkon

[Custard]

1 minute ago, Sir Loorkon said:

Your  „average“ player can still do this on the peace sever. If this is the „average“ player, why is he playing on the war server. I hope the real average player wants to do PvP on OW and not PvE in reinforcementzones. If players are the main content and your definition of an „average“ player should be right, those „average“ players are no content anyway. So it does not matter if they leave the game because they do not want to fight. I hope I am right.

If your right were are the players that were playing pre-patch?

Maybe you should reread some of the posts by average players, I play on the PVP server because of the risk without it I would find the game boring unfortunatley for me that risk has become too high. FTR I don't play anywhere near reinforcementzones, I wouldn't even if they actually worked

[Sir Loorkon]

3 minutes ago, Custard said:

If your right were are the players that were playing pre-patch?

Maybe you should reread some of the posts by average players, I play on the PVP server because of the risk without it I would find the game boring unfortunatley for me that risk has become too high. FTR I don't play anywhere near reinforcementzones, I wouldn't even if they actually worked

I do not care about those people leaving because they do not fight anyway. „Risk“👌! Why are the most viewers of a motorrace standing at the most dangerous curves? They want to see the risk but they do not want to drive the car. Personaly I do not need players that want to look and talk about PvP and feel a „risk“ when staying in the reinforcementzone and watch enemy players sail by. This is not television. A player should be part of the fight, not just watching it. Those watchers and runners are no content.

[Custard]

36 minutes ago, Sir Loorkon said:

I do not care about those people leaving because they do not fight anyway. „Risk“👌! Why are the most viewers of a motorrace standing at the most dangerous curves? They want to see the risk but they do not want to drive the car. Personaly I do not need players that want to look and talk about PvP and feel a „risk“ when staying in the reinforcementzone and watch enemy players sail by. This is not television. A player should be part of the fight, not just watching it. Those watchers and runners are no content.

You are not actually reading other peoples posts are you?

We have been fighting when caught in the open world whilst doing our thing risking our ships and losing them.

Removing the reinforcement zones would make zero difference to me as I DO NOT SAIL IN THEM or anywhere near one

FYI it's corners in real motorsport 🤣

Edited December 1, 2018 by Custard

[Old Crusty]

4 hours ago, Sir Loorkon said:

I  anyway. „Risk“👌! Why are the most viewers of a motorrace standing at the most dangerous curves? They want to see the risk but they do not want to drive the car. Personaly I do not need players that want to look and talk about PvP and feel a „risk“ when staying in the reinforcementzone and watch enemy players sail by. This is not television. A player should be part of the fight, not just watching it. Those watchers and runners are no content.

do not care about those people leaving because they do not fight 

You should listen to the advice and read all the posts. You are completely wrong here. We did do PvP. We participated in ALL of the game

[Sir Loorkon]

2 minutes ago, Old Crusty said:

do not care about those people leaving because they do not fight 

 You should listen to the advice and read all the posts. You are completely wrong here. We did do PvP. We participated in ALL of the game

Very good! So where is your problem? I read the posts but I do not understand the logic. You can have the butter or the money for the butter. Both is impossible. 

[Sir Loorkon]

3 hours ago, Custard said:

You are not actually reading other peoples posts are you?

We have been fighting when caught in the open world whilst doing our thing risking our ships and losing them.

Removing the reinforcement zones would make zero difference to me as I DO NOT SAIL IN THEM or anywhere near one

FYI it's corners in real motorsport 🤣

Edited 3 hours ago by Custard

When the shoe does not fit you, why do you put it on? Did you PvP or PvE when you where „cought“?

If you did PvP, its fine. But why do you conplain? I was cought and sank by 6 american french yesterday. I had a very expensive ship. It was a nice gank. Who cares? It is the warserver.

If you did PvE on some ege (sorry corner“) of the map, why do you complain? You could have done this riskfree on the peaceserver.

[Slim McSauce]

if you're hunting in the enemy reinforcement zone it's you who's doing something wrong. There's hundreds of square miles of ocean to hunt around yet you choose to go to the only place players are protected. Don't be surpised when people sit in the zone and laugh at your pathetic attempt at pvp baiting when you do that.