Patch 27 - Trading feedback

[admin]

Captains!

Please provide feedback on trading (trading only)
Report on trade routes, what is working, what is not working for you. Do you find good opportunities or not. What became better - what became worse after the patch. What would you like to be added (in terms of trading).

ps. keep in mind that trading missions will be added after localization too (crafting, ship delivery, resource delivery, and transport of goods). 

[samba_liten]

See picture below.

So, in Gustavia there are over 800 units of cacao. So many units that the price you can sell for is 1. The price to buy 1 unit is over 12k. Why? If there is such a surplus, surely the buy and sell price would both be low?

New Bitmap Image.bmp

[SnovaZdorowa]

Is 100t/piece forever?

[Gregory Rainsborough]

Consumption and drop rates need to be increased.

Pinar del Rio for instance has barely consumed any indigo recently because the market was flooded and it'll take a while for anyone to be able to sell. The only place consumption rates seem to be fine for the time being is in capital ports, like Belize or KPR but places like Pinar have been saturated. This is with only a few people trading there.

I've come across a few people who have gone to a port and not found anything to buy. It seems very inconsistent what drops, how much and when. Ports can't sustain that many traders at the moment.

After redoing the math trading can be very profitable as admin said but this is limited because there aren't enough goods to trade.

What I would love in terms of trading is the ability to personalise ports to give a bit of variation, both to raiding and trading. If we could add types of consumption to ports (for instance, let Pinar consume French goods or certain goods) it would provide incentive for traders and opportunities for raiders who do their research. At the moment it's capital camping for the most part. It'll bring more value to distant ports in the middle of nowhere and allow ports to diversify. You could always make it like points for perks. Allow customisation of port so as to attract traders and it'll allow competition in the nation for trade goods.

Edited November 7, 2018 by Gregory Rainsborough

[admin]

2 minutes ago, SnovaZdorowa said:

Is 100t/piece forever?

 

1 minute ago, Phaserburn said:

Normally supplied trade goods have not populated in some of the ports that use to have it supplied, since patch drop.

 

Return value on trading is now significantly  lower. The lower sale values/increased buy values, along with taxes being unchanged, increase the cost of trading to where it can cost 1.3 million to fill your hold with goods. For only 300k profit. On the higher then average profit per pound goods.

You should not think of cargoes in term of old weights and numbers. 
All cargoes are now in hauls/batches of 100 tons.

So you should not compare profits to old profits per item. You should think of hauls. In indiamans. 
In indiaman the profit ranges have changed and some goods give lot more than before some goods give less profit

In addition to that
All goods now have

• rarity factor - grain is more available than diamonds
  • affect price and supply
• demand factor - diamonds are not needed daily - grain needed every day
  • affect storage in port and daily demand
• spoilage capacity - for example diamonds dont spoil - herring spoils fast
  • affects storage in ports 
     

As a result -

• if you completely fill the port with diamonds: They will store forever - but demand is low so you have to find another port to stock as this port might not buy diamonds for a while.
• but with grain its different- the storage is lower (it spoils faster) but it is needed daily and consumed a lot in every port that buys grain. 

[admin]

3 minutes ago, Gregory Rainsborough said:

Consumption and drop rates need to be increased.

Pinar del Rio for instance has barely consumed any indigo recently because the market was flooded and it'll take a while for anyone to be able to sell. 

 

thats exactly what is described in my post above. Indigo can store for long times but demand is not high. If you want daily trade short routes trade something that is could be needed daily. 

[Gregory Rainsborough]

2 minutes ago, admin said:

thats exactly what is described in my post above. Indigo can store for long times but demand is not high. If you want daily trade short routes trade something that is could be needed daily. 

Edited post a tad but yeah I get your meaning.

[Angus MacDuff]

Just have to search.  I'm not telling where the best profits are.  On a 20 Min run with a single TBrig, I can buy goods for 100K and sell for 200K (approx.).  Last night I took two Indiamen and made 500k (doubled investment).  The only issue that I have is that pre-patch, you could find trade routes on expensive goods that tripled your money (ie Parisian Furniture from La Tortue to MT)  So far I have found nothing that will triple.  I will point out to all the players who are stuck in the old style of trading in Parisian Furniture, that there are many other goods with the same prices now.  Trading is great.  I do wish that there was an in game search function for trade goods prices that was more friendly than the trader tool. 

[Angus MacDuff]

1 minute ago, RKY said:

the best return on investment: iron ingot and iron fittings are gone. I am screwed, is all I have to say.

You're right.  There is no other possible way for you to make money.  Very sad.

[Guest]

@admin have you considered an Diablo/PoE approach towards storage space in ships?

[Hawkwood]

In my opinion, every region capital port should be able to consume trading goods from smaller ports, which are in same county. I see no point hauling trading goods for hours from distant ports to the capital.

I was wondering, why the conquered ports, (previously spanish, now british), start to "produce" british trading goods, which can not be sold somewhere closer, but in enemy capitals. And everyone knows, those trips are pure gamble, nearly suicidal.

Trading routs should be shorter, and if the region capitals start consuming trading goods, which can be found in smaller ports in, or in neighbour county, it would also encourage players to leave capitals.

Basically, in my opinion, all county capitals, should be able to consume trading goods from same county, or all other counties.

[Gregory Rainsborough]

Maybe not the same county but the neighbouring one sure. Ports should always drop the same goods, irrespective of owner.

[Celtiberofrog]

Could the good old "delivery" be applied in today's new economical values ? It could be there as an expensive option but quite nice to use to avoid too long sailings.

It might as well give more dynamism on global trading activity. 

[Hawkwood]

18 minutes ago, Celtiberofrog said:

Could the good old "delivery" be applied in today's new economical values ? It could be there as an expensive option but quite nice to use to avoid too long sailings.

It might as well give more dynamism on global trading activity. 

"Delivery"? Like "deliver spanish almonds to KPR" ????

Have fun then

 

[Macjimm]

Previously I heard many players claiming that the economy was broken because it was too easy to become excessively rich.  Now I am hearing some players complain that they are unable to earn Reals fast enough.

NPCs now supply ports.  Sinking or capturing trade ships may have a huge effect on trade.  I just haven't figured out the specifics of how it works, but this  change may have created immense content.  I'm wondering where NPCs are traveling, which ports are supplying and which ones are receiving.  This single change to trade has certainly changed the atmosphere of the Open World.  

I've been slowing increasing my wealth.  Approximately half my trade is with players and half is with port shops.  

In  some ports the resources are exclusively available by player contracts.  In KPR I can buy Iron Ore, Coal, Fir Log, Stone, Live Oak, Cedar, Sabicu, W Oak and Hemp from players.  

Interesting game.

Edited November 7, 2018 by Macjimm
Grammar

[Sven Silberbart]

Dont know where are all the trading goods. Noone of my contracts for trading goods has been filled since patch. Everyone at amount 0.

If i cant get the trading goods then i cant trade. Means I stopped trading completely

[Angus MacDuff]

7 minutes ago, Sven Silberbart said:

Dont know where are all the trading goods. Noone of my contracts for trading goods has been filled since patch. Everyone at amount 0.

If i cant get the trading goods then i cant trade. Means I stopped trading completely

I don't use contracts and I make tons of reals.  You're doing it the old way and that doesn't work any more.

Edited November 7, 2018 by Angus MacDuff

[Hawkwood]

2 hours ago, Gregory Rainsborough said:

Maybe not the same county but the neighbouring one sure. Ports should always drop the same goods, irrespective of owner.

Yeah, would mean players don`t need to sail for hours, and it would attract enemies to those spots too.

[Gregory Rainsborough]

@admin if you're going down the supply and demand route then the most important thing with market saturation is to not make it 1 but reduce selling cost per item required. That would give a truly dynamic economy and actually replicate that which you alluded to in this thread.

[admin]

15 hours ago, Phaserburn said:

Admin, what is the longest amount of time a trade good should take to replenish? I get being “rare” and like that idea a lot actually! But at the same time, a week in real life is how many in game days? Shouldn’t at least some of that good come into a port after a week real life? And insane amount of time ingame?

24 hours is 75 days in game.
5 mln reals worth of profit arrives to the Caribbean daily every 24 hours. 
But instead of being spread across all ports they arrive to a lower number of ports just like @qw569 described with cocoa.

Instead of 43 small shipments - to all 43 ports. There is 1-2 big shipments into one-two of those ports.

[OjK]

4 hours ago, admin said:

Instead of 43 small shipments - to all 43 ports. There is 1-2 big shipments into one-two of those ports.

That's cool, but would be nice to have some "rumours" system.

Like when You're logging into the game, You get the message "Trading fleet is expected to arrive to Western Cuba tomorrow".

Bit indirect, so people will still have to look for it, but at least they would know in which area.

[Koltes]

Just my 2c

Below is strictly related to the player driven economy (goods that used by players and bought/sold by players). It does not relate to hauling NPC goods A to B:

1. Port taxes are way too high. At least capitals that should attract the highest population and therefore markets should have their fees lowered. They are trade hubs, lower fees attract traders;
2. To create truly competitive market we need an ability to adjust contracts without canceling them and loosing port fee that was paid for creating contact. Adjusting contract should be done for a small fee;
3. (Not sure if its already done as I haven't checked FPs yet) Free Ports should have lowest contract fees (like 0.5%) and free contract adjustment. Also Free Ports should have green zones around them (size of Reinforcement zone) where Attack button is simply disabled so no FP camping and makes it easier for traders to get in and out and makes gankers work harder too. 

[Diver1]

Hi

Trading has been significantly nerfed

Sale factor is determined by dividing the Sale price by the Purchase price

Prior to Update the profit margin was 180% a sale factor of 3 - the Taxes

It is now 80% a sale factor of 2

You buy for 200 and with tax you add 10% = 220

You sell for 400 subtract Tax of 10% = 360

360 - 220 = 140 = 80% Profit

Also the cooldown for Over sale can last a full game cycle

Prior it was 20 min.

Rgds all

Diver 

[Cmdr RideZ]

Trade is definitely suffering from taxes. Cuts traders get are not high enough in many cases.

There should be a clerk/manager that makes it possible to remotely use shops and production buildings.

[Aquillas]

Most of contracts do not work.

I know that this is due to new delivery mechanism to ports.I agree but this do not wotk at all.

Most of my prepatch trading routes are now inoperative,  either because producing port do not produce anything anymore, or because consuming ports stopped consuming. In addition (or should I write in subtraction) margins are nothing worth. 

Edited November 9, 2018 by Aquillas