Hostility for killing OW AI

[Gott365]

Since I didn´t get an answer yet although asking several times: Is it a bug that killing AI fleets in OW without hostility missions count towards hostility for ports or is that intended?

And if it is intended, then why the hell would you do that?

Edited November 1, 2018 by Gott365

[Slim McSauce]

It's a carry over of the old system, which was indeed hitting OW fleets to raise hostility before the missions were introduced. It is intended albeit useless.

[Galt]

11 minutes ago, Gott365 said:

Since I didn´t get an answer yet although asking several times: Is it a bug that killing AI fleets in OW without hostility missions count towards hostility for ports or is that intended?

And if it is intended, then why the hell would you do that?

This is intended. The advantage being that people can't jump in on your fight, the disadvantage being that it's random. If you can find a fleet worth more than your hostility, I would think that is the best way to get hostility. To my knowledge, a 1st rate is a 1st rate. 

[admin]

4 minutes ago, Galt said:

This is intended. The advantage being that people can't jump in on your fight, the disadvantage being that it's random. If you can find a fleet worth more than your hostility, I would think that is the best way to get hostility. To my knowledge, a 1st rate is a 1st rate. 

I am stealing this  

 

[admin]

18 minutes ago, Gott365 said:

Since I didn´t get an answer yet although asking several times: Is it a bug that killing AI fleets in OW without hostility missions count towards hostility for ports or is that intended?

And if it is intended, then why the hell would you do that?

Hey.. 
Why do you use a hell word in a simple question?

[Gott365]

1. I´m sorry, it was a long day

2. Why would you change a proper system (aka hostility missions), with easy to plan and easy to counter mechanics, into something RNG-based, which in the worst case is impossible to counter?

Don´t you see a problem there when you have 10+ 1st rate fleets sailing  infront of a 2k BR port of a different nation?

[Galt]

20 minutes ago, Banished Privateer said:

Remind us of the rules... It's very old mechanic.

The attacker needs to kill X/any nation

The defender needs to kill X/any nation

I'm pretty sure you have to sink the ships of the nation that owns the port (which should be easier with this new AI update,) and to reduce the hostility the defenders can sink anything (which would likely be harder with the new AI update.) I might be wrong here. 

[Galt]

21 minutes ago, Gott365 said:

1. I´m sorry, it was a long day

2. Why would you change a proper system (aka hostility missions), with easy to plan and easy to counter mechanics, into something RNG-based, which in the worst case is impossible to counter?

Don´t you see a problem there when you have 10+ 1st rate fleets sailing  infront of a 2k BR port of a different nation?

Also, no. No one is saying that you can't use regular hostility missions. This is how it has always been. Literally nothing about hostility has changed. 

[Angus MacDuff]

Since ports are now surrounded by own-nation AI, that's probably exactly what happened.  I expect we'll see a lot of that when players are hunting the big AI fleets.

[admin]

29 minutes ago, Gott365 said:

1. I´m sorry, it was a long day

2. Why would you change a proper system (aka hostility missions), with easy to plan and easy to counter mechanics, into something RNG-based, which in the worst case is impossible to counter?

Don´t you see a problem there when you have 10+ 1st rate fleets sailing  infront of a 2k BR port of a different nation?

We have not changed anything. Because of One Nation - One Flag  - you now see better concentrations of national NPC around National ports. NPCs always provided hostility. PVP kills also provided hostility. 

 

[Gott365]

1 minute ago, Galt said:

Literally nothing about hostility has changed. 

Consider this again:

Hostility missions were open (for the length of the battle or at least 30mins afaik) => OW battles are closed after 3 minutes.

Hostility missions could be done by a group of 10 ppl max => OW battles can be done by 25 ppl max. plus before it was a battle 10 vs 20 at best for the defender; the advantage of numbers surely made defending easier.

Before you could at least see your harbour is being attacked and take countermeasure.

Now you might not even notice until you have a PB pop up.

Please don´t tell me nothing has changed; this might screw over the whole RvR big time.

[Gott365]

Just now, admin said:

We have not changed anything. Because of One Nation - One Flag  - you now see better concentrations of national NPC around National ports. 

Are you telling me killing OW fleets gave you hostility progress before patch 27? I don´t think so, or at least it never worked for me.

[Galt]

3 minutes ago, Angus MacDuff said:

Since ports are now surrounded by own-nation AI, that's probably exactly what happened.  I expect we'll see a lot of that when players are hunting the big AI fleets.

It'll be easier, sure; but presumably this will be happening during the defenders prime time (assuming a timer) so it shouldn't be an issue to get some guys out there to find their fleet. it may take a while but the longer the attackers waste, the less likely they are to get the port for a good time. And if they are attacking a port without a timer, I think it's safe to say that the defenders probably wouldn't be out there to stop them regardless. I don't imagine much will change although a change of pace will be nice. 10 players v 10 AI; players win every time. 10 players v 25 AI; much more interesting. Even though you can't really counter that, there are either going to be few of them after or they will badly need repairs. 

[TheHaney]

2 minutes ago, Gott365 said:

Before you could at least see your harbour is being attacked and take countermeasure.

Now you might not even notice until you have a PB pop up.

Please don´t tell me nothing has changed; this might screw over the whole RvR big time.

Good.

Given the fact that AI shipping travels between ports of the same flag, I'd absolutely LOVE to see a more hectic mix of ports instead of solid blocks of territory devoid of targets.

[Galt]

2 minutes ago, Gott365 said:

Consider this again:

Hostility missions were open (for the length of the battle or at least 30mins afaik) => OW battles are closed after 3 minutes.

Hostility missions could be done by a group of 10 ppl max => OW battles can be done by 25 ppl max. plus before it was a battle 10 vs 20 at best for the defender; the advantage of numbers surely made defending easier.

Before you could at least see your harbour is being attacked and take countermeasure.

Now you might not even notice until you have a PB pop up.

Please don´t tell me nothing has changed; this might screw over the whole RvR big time.

In retort, I would say that: 

1) to organize 25 people to grind hostility is going to generate some noise. Any clan worth their salt will catch wind and be prepared to counter.

2) More often then not, enemy players won't be able to make that 3 minute timer, which means you have a good number of solo ships stuck outside of a battle. That's good huntin'.

3) Even if they do flip the port, PB RoE have not changed. If you win, great. If you lose, you didn't deserve to keep the port then. This is how the game should be. 

[Galt]

2 hours ago, TheHaney said:

Good.

Given the fact that AI shipping travels between ports of the same flag, I'd absolutely LOVE to see a more hectic mix of ports instead of solid blocks of territory devoid of targets.

The more ports are changing hands, means the more people are out grinding hostility. The more people are moving goods from their crafting hub, or too a new crafting hub. More people trading in the region. More people using it to fb PvP/RvR fleets. This is good for the game. 

Edited November 1, 2018 by Galt

[RedNeckMilkMan]

1 hour ago, Gott365 said:

Are you telling me killing OW fleets gave you hostility progress before patch 27? I don´t think so, or at least it never worked for me.

Since the Hostility rework months and months ago you have been able to raise hostility 3 ways:

PVP kills

AI kills

Hostility Missions

In all three scenarios the flag on the ship must match the flag on the town for hostility to raise.

[RedNeckMilkMan]

1 hour ago, Gott365 said:

Consider this again:

Hostility missions were open (for the length of the battle or at least 30mins afaik) => OW battles are closed after 3 minutes.

Hostility missions could be done by a group of 10 ppl max => OW battles can be done by 25 ppl max. plus before it was a battle 10 vs 20 at best for the defender; the advantage of numbers surely made defending easier.

Before you could at least see your harbour is being attacked and take countermeasure.

Now you might not even notice until you have a PB pop up.

Please don´t tell me nothing has changed; this might screw over the whole RvR big time.

Before what? Flags? Killing AI has raised Hostility since before I was playing.

You have always been able to pull multiple hostility missions and coordinate them so that the defender gets no combat news warning. Which is easier to do than finding an AI fleet big enough to flip in one go.

If they do find a big enough fleet you can be sure they are low on reps/damaged from the battle, your allies and you should make easy work of them.

[Gregory Rainsborough]

1 hour ago, Gott365 said:

Are you telling me killing OW fleets gave you hostility progress before patch 27? I don´t think so, or at least it never worked for me.

They did.

[Gott365]

Alright then, can only say it never worked for me although I matched criteria...

Anyway, with the new spawns in numbers and places it should be considered to be reworked for reasons stated above.

[Ruby Rose]

56 minutes ago, RedNeckMilkMan said:

Before what? Flags? Killing AI has raised Hostility since before I was playing.

You have always been able to pull multiple hostility missions and coordinate them so that the defender gets no combat news warning. Which is easier to do than finding an AI fleet big enough to flip in one go.

If they do find a big enough fleet you can be sure they are low on reps/damaged from the battle, your allies and you should make easy work of them.

huge flaw right now is ports are only spawning their own nations fleets closes nation capitals to those ports would be farming ai in that area and inadvertently raising hostility in the process. its alot less to do about missions and more to do with just the pve grind now.

[Gregory Rainsborough]

All the more reason for people to put timers on and challenge those grinding.

[Galt]

36 minutes ago, Ruby Rose said:

huge flaw right now is ports are only spawning their own nations fleets closes nation capitals to those ports would be farming ai in that area and inadvertently raising hostility in the process. its alot less to do about missions and more to do with just the pve grind now.

so they schedule a pb that they don't plan to fight, you have an influx of enemy PvErs in your waters (i.e. out of the rookie zones,) and they will likely build an outpost in the area for grinding. I fail to see the downside here. 

Also I think you are really underestimating the amount of work it takes for one or two people to flip a port. I flipped Kingstown on the global server back when hostility missions always spawned 10 aggas. It took me over 6 hours in a L'Ocean. This is a non-issue.

Edited November 1, 2018 by Galt

[RedNeckMilkMan]

42 minutes ago, Ruby Rose said:

huge flaw right now is ports are only spawning their own nations fleets closes nation capitals to those ports would be farming ai in that area and inadvertently raising hostility in the process. its alot less to do about missions and more to do with just the pve grind now.

I don't see the issue. Coming from someone who has flipped many, many ports through both PVE and the Missions I am happy that the Devs are making it less labor intensive.

Defend your ports or put timers on them. If you are inadvertently flipping ports you don't want to then use the mission system that just got a massive rework. Or deal with the PVP that comes your way when the port owners figure it out.