Boarding as Secondary Option

[Guest]

If Dev’s are ok with boarding as a primary attack method then don’t read on.  

But if boarding should be an end battle option or not a first strike option, then I have a suggestion to mitigate boarding from primary attack and rather than a straight out percentage cap…

“Boarding can only be trigger or engaged on the side of a ship that has no HP.”

So a player has to remove/destroy all the HP on either the port or starboard side to initiate boarding, but not structure HP. This does is two things, 1, Players will have to engage in a canon battle before boarding and 2, Tactical aspects of battles go up tenfold…

E.g. Attackers will have to continue attacking the same side while the defender is trying defending that side. If a defender realizes that their side of a ship is open for boarding and/or realizes that the attack wants to board, they then can try to defend via canon battle, keeping the exposed side away/shielded from the attacker, creating a tactical heavy game/battles if you have boarding intention.  

 

I believe canon battles should be the primary method of attack and boarding secondary and that canon battles are the game focus.

Edited October 6, 2018 by Guest

[Aster]

Boarding is a defense larger ships have vs smaller ships hugging them down, if boarding is impossible then the smaller ship can for the most part hug down a larger ship with impunity.

[Capn Rocko]

Cannon fighting is a viable option that still happens a lot and is my main focus in this patch. I do not see a need to nerf boarding more than a 1-2 knot decrease in grapple. This suggestion is very unrealistic and not needed (imo) so I cannot support it. 

[jodgi]

Devs have made a game where it is rather easy to fend off ppl coming at you with boarding as the primary attack method.

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

IF and once the code is changed so the gundeck batteries continue to fire even if the ship is being boarded, then things may change a lot. A LOT.

[Sir Malachy Karrde]

29 minutes ago, Hethwill the Harmless said:

IF and once the code is changed so the gundeck batteries continue to fire even if the ship is being boarded, then things may change a lot. A LOT.

This needs to happen. Yesterday.

[Guest]

Boarding is in a good place right now and can stay this way till the mini game is refined.

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

No. Gun decks crew would continue to fire. Game must simulate that.

Then we move on to a better system.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Aster said:

Boarding is a defense larger ships have vs smaller ships hugging them down, if boarding is impossible then the smaller ship can for the most part hug down a larger ship with impunity.

Yeah good point, good to bring up a exploit, hugging isn’t producing great canon battles either.

 

1 hour ago, Hethwill the Harmless said:

IF and once the code is changed so the gundeck batteries continue to fire even if the ship is being boarded, then things may change a lot. A LOT.

If only upper deck canons could be bought to bear down onto smaller hugging ships, objective battles, but how and without to many more rules of engagement.

Muzzle blast damage? or Muzzle blast burning crew? (from lower decks).

Its going to be good to see what dev's are going to come up with.

Edited October 6, 2018 by Guest

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

higher velocity at muzzle exit point, who cares about burning crew.

 

[Guest]

Just floating ideas.

[Thonys]

i believe blowing up is the second option

 

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Capn Rocko said:

unrealistic

Have you heard of "softening up then enemy".

[Capn Rocko]

10 hours ago, BuckleUpBones said:

“Boarding can only be trigger or engaged on the side of a ship that has no HP.”

So a player has to remove/destroy all the HP on either the port or starboard side to initiate boarding, but not structure HP. 

Unrealistic 

[Jack Jones]

On 10/6/2018 at 10:30 PM, Hethwill the Harmless said:

IF and once the code is changed so the gundeck batteries continue to fire even if the ship is being boarded, then things may change a lot. A LOT.

So if this happens then the ship which continues to fire its guns will lose the boarding action due to lack of available crew be able to repel the boarders. 

Or will it be able to fire and fight effectively ? 

To me this is very unrealistic. Men would have been employed repelling boarders not firing guns. If the top deck and officers were lost the action would cease. It was not common to fight to death. Most ships surrendered when it became clear they would lose.

Crew morale would be much more realistic than some made up mess of firing and boarding.

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

16 minutes ago, Flash Jack said:

Men would have been employed repelling boarders not firing guns.

This is where you have it wrong. Primary duty for marines ( see RN ) was to defend accesses ( stairs, etc ) to the gun decks and to protect the gun crews.

[Angus MacDuff]

32 minutes ago, Hethwill the Harmless said:

This is where you have it wrong. Primary duty for marines ( see RN ) was to defend accesses to the gun decks, to protect the gun crews. 

Marines had many duties.  Guarding the hatches to the gundecks (to stop cowards running below), manning the fighting tops and lining the guardrails to supply musket fire against a close enemy.  They were definitely one of the main boarding/anti-boarding forces. Many of the British ships used their marines on the great guns.  I read an article called ' That Matchless Victory" in "The Trafalgar Chronicles" (sorry, couldn't link it you'll have to google) which has a fantastic description of Marines' duties on RN ships.

 

Edited October 12, 2018 by Angus MacDuff

[DeRuyter]

1 hour ago, Flash Jack said:

So if this happens then the ship which continues to fire its guns will lose the boarding action due to lack of available crew be able to repel the boarders. 

Or will it be able to fire and fight effectively ? 

To me this is very unrealistic. Men would have been employed repelling boarders not firing guns. If the top deck and officers were lost the action would cease. It was not common to fight to death. Most ships surrendered when it became clear they would lose.

Crew morale would be much more realistic than some made up mess of firing and boarding.

Members of gun crews were assigned secondary tasks such as fire fighter, sail trimmer or boarder. So part of each gun crew would be called away in a boarding action, more likely for an attack vs. defense. Look at this paper noting the crew duties. 

http://www.navyandmarine.org/ondeck/1800gundrill.htm

Looking at the main gun deck a high proportion of crew had boarder as a secondary duty. The spar deck or quarter deck carronades not so much as they were charged with firing grape into attacking boarders (Fire deck Guns option).  I would say that for frigates and smaller ships you would have a high proportion of the crew fending off attackers so while the guns could be worked the rate of fire should suffer. For SoL I suspect that the main battery could continue to fire without much of a problem. 

[Guest]

PvP battle, me in my tutorial Hercules vs a LeRequin pirate with 280 crew.

Straight away I started to strip his amour, as soon as he realized I was outgunning him he sail a collisions cause, got me into irons – that was my mistake – and then boarded.

All over in 4 minutes, I was petty disappointed about the duration.

Canon battle focus essential.

Suggestion has merit you know, shouldn't effect large scale battles or the realm.

 

Edited October 29, 2018 by Guest

[Capn Rocko]

If you don't want to be boarded, boarding axes are very effective. It's also good to use tactics in battle that limit the possibility of boarding (ex: use boarding prep when tacking the wind, not getting in positions that allow you to be pushed, etc.). Remember that if your enemy is boarding prepped, you will kill crew easier and they will reload cannons and repair slower. You can use their agressiveness to your advantage. 

The specific situation that you mention is more of a balance issue with the requin. The requin can turn bigger ships into the wind a little easier than it probably should. But the requin should have a hard time accomplishing the goal if you play smart. 

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

Capture, again and again, your favorite frigate model from NPC until you get a interesting one with Redoutable refit. Slab some barricades on top. Watch the horror strike the barbary pirates as they try to board you 🤣

( disclaimer: not a support, myself, of the janky mods/books stuff... so... )

[Guest]

17 hours ago, Capn Rocko said:

f you don't want to be boarded, boarding axes are very effective. It's also good to use tactics in battle that limit the possibility of boarding (ex: use boarding prep when tacking the wind, not getting in positions that allow you to be pushed, etc.). Remember that if your enemy is boarding prepped, you will kill crew easier and they will reload cannons and repair slower. You can use their agressiveness to your advantage. 

 

8 hours ago, Hethwill the Red Duke said:

Capture, again and again, your favorite frigate model from NPC until you get a interesting one with Redoutable refit. Slab some barricades on top. Watch the horror strike the barbary pirates as they try to board you 🤣

To clarify, what said isn’t for personal gain.

Idea is to force canon battles, if Dev’s think alike, however if localization has started (or soon) then the game is near release and the battle instance won’t change now, is probably why you're offering tips. 

But even then the suggestion forum is still open and many don't like boarding as it stands, no harm in being forthcoming with ideas.  

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

For sure. Not against and agree with you, boarding system is not ideal and we all know that BUT it is what it is and many will use it. I'm unorthodox in my gameplay and never meta and always trying odd things.

Think the only true boarder i did use ever was a Privateer with some 90 crew  

[Angus MacDuff]

I dislike boarding as a first option in this game when it comes to warship v warship.  With warships, we should be making some assumptions.  These are:

a. All warship crews are trained and have watch and station bills, telling the crew where to go for each eventuality, therefore all warships have full prep.

b. All warship crews are professional military, therefore morale should be high (yes, pressed men have to be trained).  Morale should erode as your ship gets damaged (perhaps 100% morale when 0% damaged).

c. All warships above 7th rates carried some form of marines as a percentage of their crew.

Boarding mods should have a very small effect on the quality of a boarding crew.  This means that if two warships with 300 crew and very little damage get into a boarding action it is an even fight. 

Boarding should only occur when both ships are stopped.  Two 500 ton ships moving at 2 knots cant be tied together (until they stop).

Warship v Merchie is a different story.  Boarding as a first option is very appropriate here. Traders should have no prep, 25% morale and no marines.  They were civilians and were not prepared or expected to withstand a warship attack.  Maybe have a "Q-Ship" perk that allows us to turn a trader into a military auxiliary (and lose cargo space).