The problem of leaving battle

[Old Crusty]

We have a battle. One side runs. It doesn’t matter if it is one ship or 10. When the players can leave battle they do. What happens next is one of the biggest problems that this game has in my opinion.

When we leave battle we go to the outer world in the same spot that we entered battle. How does that make any sense at all? If you have been running from the revenge fleet for 20 minutes and left battle 800 yards ahead of them, shouldn’t your position in the OW reflect that when you leave battle? Currently a Nation can gather at where the X for the battle is and just wait. No matter how far the enemy players traveled in the battle, they will come out of battle where they entered. 

If we were placed in the outer world proportionate to where we actually left battle it would make re tagging harder and a little more realistic.

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

I agree with you but I fear there's technical limitations, inherent to all games, with that option.

But, what i'd love to have is enter port from the battle instance.

 

[William Death]

+1 

 

But I seem to recall devs saying this could be a programming issue?

At any rate, the issue of “able to outrun them in battle but not in OW” is annoying. It means that you either have to outsmart your enemy, have more patience than he does, or it’s only a matter of time before you are caught. 

 There was a time when we could choose to log out in an after battle screen, or be towed to port, but both options allowed for some exploits. It’s a tricky mechanic to get right. 

[Sir Loorkon]

How about increasing the time for staying invisible after battle?

[Old Crusty]

1 minute ago, Sir Loorkon said:

How about increasing the time for staying invisible after battle?

I think if my suggestion is to much of a programming problem then the best solution would be longer invisibility. Even 15 seconds more would make a huge difference 

[Tiedemann]

10 minutes ago, Hethwill the Harmless said:

I agree with you but I fear there's technical limitations, inherent to all games, with that option.

But, what i'd love to have is enter port from the battle instance.

You mean if you can sail over to the port in the battle instance, then we could just jump directly into port?

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

1 minute ago, Tiedemann said:

You mean if you can sail over to the port in the battle instance, then we could just jump directly into port?

Yeah. 1:1 scale time and space.

[Raf Van Boom]

Time in battle not equal to time in OW, that's one issue. This could be used to exploit entry into port battles/ports etc. Getting rid of instanced combat would solve a lot of these but it's probably not feasible, unfortunately. Or is it?

[Vernon Merrill]

27 minutes ago, Coraline Vodka said:

If that was the case we would use alts to transport items safe in battle

Man....  If someone wants to 1:1 time sail a ship from Shroud to La Tortue to keep something safe, all the power to 'em...  

They can keep it.  LOL

 

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

They can't. Instance time is 90 minutes. Once time is over they are ejected to the OW in the spot where the battle started.

Do the test, see how far you go 1:1 in 90 minutes.

A good place to do this is La Tortue. Either East or West has close ports to act as landmarks to track how far you can go.

[Galt]

55 minutes ago, Old Crusty said:

We have a battle. One side runs. It doesn’t matter if it is one ship or 10. When the players can leave battle they do. What happens next is one of the biggest problems that this game has in my opinion.

When we leave battle we go to the outer world in the same spot that we entered battle. How does that make any sense at all? If you have been running from the revenge fleet for 20 minutes and left battle 800 yards ahead of them, shouldn’t your position in the OW reflect that when you leave battle? Currently a Nation can gather at where the X for the battle is and just wait. No matter how far the enemy players traveled in the battle, they will come out of battle where they entered. 

If we were placed in the outer world proportionate to where we actually left battle it would make re tagging harder and a little more realistic.

This used to exist, traveling in battle translating to movement in the OW, but it was really annoying when you would run in battle and jump out in shallows or in land because they didn't measure well to the OW (which I totally understand and why tow exists.) I am not sure why they removed that but I also think it should be brought back. 

[Sir Malachy Karrde]

5 hours ago, Hethwill the Harmless said:

I agree with you but I fear there's technical limitations, inherent to all games, with that option.

But, what i'd love to have is enter port from the battle instance.

 

We used to have it. The gankers whined and cried and it was eventually removed. 

[Sir Malachy Karrde]

4 hours ago, Galt said:

This used to exist, traveling in battle translating to movement in the OW, but it was really annoying when you would run in battle and jump out in shallows or in land because they didn't measure well to the OW (which I totally understand and why tow exists.) I am not sure why they removed that but I also think it should be brought back. 

Yup, if you end up in shallows, just have an /unstick command that every other mmo seems to have that will move you to the closest deep water. Wham, bam, thank you, ma'am.

[Sir Malachy Karrde]

4 hours ago, Wraith said:

The problem is that people can use battle instances for risk-free port entrance and trading this way.  

And I think the problem the dev's were referring to is the inability (which is silly) to incorporate "shallows" into battle instances, and the potential for spawning out of battle into a shallow zone in a deep water ship and boom, you're stuck.

Please don't think I'm defending the way things works, I'd love to see proper bathymetry in both OW and battles, where you have a 1:1 relationship.  And honestly, I think exiting the battle where you ended up in battle isn't a terrible solution. If people want to do 1:1 sails to protect goods.. fine, that's.. boring and fine.  Would I rather have no battle instances at all and just have time compression when out of view of other ships?  YES. But we live in a world with limited computing resources so must make certain concessions.

I'd say make teleport to port only activate if you are the defender in the battle. Attackers should not get the option. Also make it limited use, like once every 3 hours or something 

[Farrago]

60 seconds invisibility and hyperspeed that begins when sails go up or 120 seconds whichever comes first. No logging out but you have time to run and pee. After the invisibility, you have 120 more seconds when you can not tag or be tagged. If you've put enough distance between yourself and the enemy or hidden well enough, you'll have time to log out. If they can still get you, there's too many, it's too good of a trap, and you're screwed. 

[Capn Rocko]

On 9/20/2018 at 9:56 AM, Coraline Vodka said:

If that was the case we would use alts to transport items safe in battle

The amount of time it would take to do this would not be worth it. It takes almost the full 1.5 hours to get through the channel of La Tortue in the battle instance. That's like 20 seconds of OW time to cover the same distance. Not to mention there's the 3 minute window that your instance might get jumped by a faster ship. 

The problem is see with the OP's suggestion is that the distance between ships at the end of battle (where a player's ship gets outside of bow chaser range and can exit battle) is only like 2 inches of separation in OW. You would still be right next to the enemy player when you leave battle and all the enemy would have to do is tell the waiting gank fleet the ending location of the battle instead of the starting location. It's almost harder now to coordinate a revenge fleet than it would be with this change. 

While I don't think this is a bad idea, I am skeptical whether it will be as effective as the supporters think it will be. 

[Sir Malachy Karrde]

On 9/20/2018 at 9:58 AM, William Death said:

+1 

 

But I seem to recall devs saying this could be a programming issue?

At any rate, the issue of “able to outrun them in battle but not in OW” is annoying. It means that you either have to outsmart your enemy, have more patience than he does, or it’s only a matter of time before you are caught. 

 There was a time when we could choose to log out in an after battle screen, or be towed to port, but both options allowed for some exploits. It’s a tricky mechanic to get right. 

I personally would rather deal with the exploits than the retag griefing that goes on these days. 

[Sir Malachy Karrde]

57 minutes ago, Capn Rocko said:

The amount of time it would take to do this would not be worth it. It takes almost the full 1.5 hours to get through the channel of La Tortue in the battle instance. That's like 20 seconds of OW time to cover the same distance. Not to mention there's the 3 minute window that your instance might get jumped by a faster ship. 

The problem is see with the OP's suggestion is that the distance between ships at the end of battle (where a player's ship gets outside of bow chaser range and can exit battle) is only like 2 inches of separation in OW. You would still be right next to the enemy player when you leave battle and all the enemy would have to do is tell the waiting gank fleet the ending location of the battle instead of the starting location. It's almost harder now to coordinate a revenge fleet than it would be with this change. 

While I don't think this is a bad idea, I am skeptical whether it will be as effective as the supporters think it will be. 

Not true. I was in a battle that started 21k from La Mona. It ended right at the La Mona docks. Only about 40 minutes of sailing. 

And to my knowledge, f11 doesn't give an OS coordinate in a Battle.

Edited September 24, 2018 by Sir Malachy Karrde

[Capn Rocko]

17 minutes ago, Sir Malachy Karrde said:

Not true. I was in a battle that started 21k from La Mona. It ended right at the La Mona docks. Only about 40 minutes of sailing. 

Screenshots or it didn't happen 😀

Edited September 24, 2018 by Capn Rocko

[Capn Rocko]

1 hour ago, Sir Malachy Karrde said:

And to my knowledge, f11 doesn't give an OS coordinate in a Battle.

If you sail 45 minutes in 1 direction then hit F11, the coordinates will be at that exact location (not battle starting position). 

Edited September 24, 2018 by Capn Rocko

[Sir Malachy Karrde]

10 minutes ago, Capn Rocko said:

If you sail 45 minutes in 1 direction then hit F11, the coordinates will be at that exact location (not battle starting position). 

They didn't use to correspond with OS coordinates though last I tried.... that was a long time ago though. 

Edited September 24, 2018 by Sir Malachy Karrde