Patch 26. Spanish Frigate Diana, BR rebalance - Diana is a timed reward.

[Lovec1990]

1 minute ago, Jakob.Kettler said:

OK, how often was Trafalgar, Sir? 😄 Was it the only one battle?

still it points my point in age of sails it was far greater achivement to capture the ship than sinking her while in game well you know

[Slim McSauce]

a thousand replies in one month. Just goes to show how much is banking on these next updates

[Dibbler (Retired)]

23 minutes ago, Jakob.Kettler said:

OK, how often was Trafalgar, Sir? 😄 Was it the only one battle?

 

Every second monday, except bank holidays.

 

[Licinio Chiavari]

46 minutes ago, Banished Privateer said:

Is it how proper testing looks like? Le Broken got Le Boarded  

Don't ask me about the Studding Sails on Requin 🤣

Epic.

[MassimoSud]

41 minutes ago, Wraith said:

Boarding is literally rock paper scissors

finally I'm not the only one to call things by their name!

[Licinio Chiavari]

48 minutes ago, Jakob.Kettler said:

Dear Admins...

 

let me ask you a question... WHY you and your team are changing things, they are ok. And why you dont change things, they are unplayable or stupid, like mechanics of boarding, portbattles, like the real characteristics of types of ships or like the stupid pve to "level" a ship?!

After leveling a ship (in the last 3 years, yes, I did it 4x for each type of ship!!!) ... do you think NOW I need more paractise in boarding? And do you think, the crown of ship battles is boarding a ship? Please tell me... why this change, what is your point? I cant see the sense of this "hotfix" except you have a sense of humor. Please go back to the roots of a playable game with nice sailing ships please dont destroy this game with this kind of "speacial features".

Aside (lost count) boarding was probable the most usual outcome of an Age of sail naval engagement...

If you leveled 4 times all ships you should be a good veteran with plenty experience both manouvering and in boarding. So this patch should be zero issue for you.

[Licinio Chiavari]

5 minutes ago, MassimoSud said:

finally I'm not the only one to call things by their name!

If it's so noobish... Why so many scared?

Why so few able to handle properly one?

[Captiva]

3 minutes ago, MassimoSud said:

finally I'm not the only one to call things by their name!

Admin has stated that once 'Localization' is completed they will address boarding changes (and that it would be a high priority). We will have to live with the current boarding game until that time.

[troody]

sorry guys, 8 ktn for boarding....totally bullshit.......fail patch

 

now i understand why @Pit Pinsel is playing actively again, hehe

Edited September 19, 2018 by troody

[Dibbler (Retired)]

3 hours ago, admin said:

DD is still amazing - can't be boarded if you have more crew..

 

Hmm DD is now ok i guess, but no longer worth taking as a perk (like rigging specialist).

 

 

Edited September 19, 2018 by Dibbler

[MassimoSud]

2 minutes ago, Captiva said:

Admin has stated that once 'Localization' is completed they will address boarding changes (and that it would be a high priority). We will have to live with the current boarding game until that time.

Well, so why not postpone everything after the localization? Why destroy the best part of the game, replacing it with a game not yet developed correctly?

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

I think the devs want to test something. Going to pain us ( i do struggle for credible authenticity and it pains me to even play with stuff you guys find fun ) but let's make the most of it.

I know for certain it will not be a piece of cake anymore to rampage with the sloops of war.

 

[Liq]

6 minutes ago, Dibbler said:

 

Hmm DD is now is ok i guess, but no longer worth taking as a perk (like rigging specialist)

Hmm

I think i will still take it

To deny troll boardings by smaller boats while being in a bigger one (and thus allow Enemy bigger boats get closer and damage my sides while me being unable to do anything) which will now happen a lot more with that boarding at 8 kts possibility. 

Basically boarding is also some kind of "stun damage" now; precious time in which you cant do anything - cant move, cant shoot - but will get shot

Dont think i like that but will test

Edited September 19, 2018 by Liq

[Angus MacDuff]

49 minutes ago, Lovec1990 said:

Battle of Trafalgar only one ship sank in battle other 21 ships were captured in boarding actions

Not boarding actions.  Surrendered and were boarded

[William Death]

Why couldn't we just adjust the hammocks (10% across the board seems reasonable), nerf DD to 10%, and increase the re-pull timer significantly (3.5 minutes?)?

More testing needed, but it seems to me, that we'll basically have a situation now where the following happens:

• Fit out ship with marines (I almost always have marines anyways) and barricades
• Winning the gunnery fight because the enemy is in a lighter ship, but unable to keep range because unlimited sail repairs and limited chain (or he's simply so much faster that even his fir build at 60% sails is as fast as the teak/wo fighting build at 90% sails).
• Enemy closes range and sails side by side, downwind, at 11knots. Enemy slowly eases his ship into mine, bringing speed down to 8kn. Get pulled.
  • successfully defend against a boarding with minimal losses and disengage.
    • get re-pulled because NO SHIP larger than a fifth rate can raise sails from 0% and sailing focus turned off and accelerate to 8kn+ in under 50s (and even if such a feat is managed to get away, go to step 2 and repeat).
• Repeat steps till boarding is successfully won.

Good job. Many historical accurates. Much enjoyable combat. Mmm, remove the best part of NA combat by encouraging the use of the worst/least skill/least polished part. /salt\

I'd weigh failfit rageboarding builds and the crap-tactic of re-pulling over and over as far, far more detrimental to the combat system than any amount of stern camping or hull hugging. The latter two, I might point out, are pretty easily countered, against all but the very best players doing it. Most players that I've fought, however, do EVERYTHING that makes it easy for me to stern camp them, or hull hug them. Can't tell you how many times I've reduced a ship's crew by half in a pass or two, all because the enemy decided to keep turning back and forth, instead of setting a close hauled or beam reach heading and forcing me off his stern. Or the Constitutions I sank by sailing my Endymion underneath their guns because they didn't know how to depress their cannons enough to hit me.

But even wishing to get rid of that, there were far better options than this (like musket fire). So why not:

Keep the hammock nerfs, keep the barricades buff. Reduce boarding speed to -3.5 -> +3.5kn, reduce the difference in speed to |4.5| kn, reduce DD to 10%, increase re-pull timer to 3.5 minutes.

Then work on the other stuff thats wrong with NA, focus on the patches we were told about a while back (UI patch, mods rebalance, PvP zone ROE, reinforcment zone ROE, etc.) then look at implementing musket fire or some other legitimate mechanic to deal with these other problems. 

I can't help but feel we're trying to address a small issue here (hull hugging and stern camping that most players *should* know how to counter), but creating bigger issues with far more devastating consequences.

 

A quick note about "historical" accuracy... "historically" (and now...and 200 years from now....) there was no way to stop a ship, weighing hundreds of tons, moving away from your own ship at any rate of speed more than a crawl with grapples and handropes. Even if we assume magic ropes that don't ever snap, there is nothing that can be tied onto that won't simply be torn off by the forces involved stopping that much momentum. Especially when sails are still set, providing power thats working counter to what the grapples are.

I think you'd be far more likely to see ships completely stop (or nearly so) via ramming, demasting, or dropped sails before a boarding happens. Or the boarding happens when both ships are close together and sailing in the same direction. Not casually passing 100 feet away from each other, or sailing 100 feet away from each other, but at different angles...

 

Lets test it before totally dismissing it out of hand (but I agree with others and I'm fairly certain its a bad change).

Short term suggestions if we are to truly test this: increase the re-pull timer to at least 2 minutes. 3+ is probably better. Decrease speed to 5kn and not 8kn.

@admin says if it doesn't work out, they'll know and revert it. My question is, how long will we need to test to know if it works? 1 week? 2? 1 month? 4 months (Wasa meta, anyone?) 6+ months (looking at you, PvP zones)....

 

[Licinio Chiavari]

10 minutes ago, Dibbler said:

 

Hmm DD is now ok i guess, but no longer worth taking as a perk (like rigging specialist).

IMO wrong. Especially now you need it being starting boarding easier.

Or you want your shiny bellona stopped by a p.frig and then catched by a bunch of other ships working your side while still stopped?

[Licinio Chiavari]

3 minutes ago, Angus MacDuff said:

Not boarding actions.  Surrendered and were boarded

And muskets fire was not part of the Battle, right?

Nelson got killed by scurvy Indeed.

[Angus MacDuff]

4 minutes ago, William Death said:

Why couldn't we just adjust the hammocks (10% across the board seems reasonable), nerf DD to 10%, and increase the re-pull timer significantly (3.5 minutes?)?

More testing needed, but it seems to me, that we'll basically have a situation now where the following happens:

• Fit out ship with marines (I almost always have marines anyways) and barricades
• Winning the gunnery fight because the enemy is in a lighter ship, but unable to keep range because unlimited sail repairs and limited chain (or he's simply so much faster that even his fir build at 60% sails is as fast as the teak/wo fighting build at 90% sails).
• Enemy closes range and sails side by side, downwind, at 11knots. Enemy slowly eases his ship into mine, bringing speed down to 8kn. Get pulled.
  • successfully defend against a boarding with minimal losses and disengage.
    • get re-pulled because NO SHIP larger than a fifth rate can raise sails from 0% and sailing focus turned off and accelerate to 8kn+ in under 50s (and even if such a feat is managed to get away, go to step 2 and repeat).
• Repeat steps till boarding is successfully won.

Good job. Many historical accurates. Much enjoyable combat. Mmm, remove the best part of NA combat by encouraging the use of the worst/least skill/least polished part. /salt\

I'd weigh failfit rageboarding builds and the crap-tactic of re-pulling over and over as far, far more detrimental to the combat system than any amount of stern camping or hull hugging. The latter two, I might point out, are pretty easily countered, against all but the very best players doing it. Most players that I've fought, however, do EVERYTHING that makes it easy for me to stern camp them, or hull hug them. Can't tell you how many times I've reduced a ship's crew by half in a pass or two, all because the enemy decided to keep turning back and forth, instead of setting a close hauled or beam reach heading and forcing me off his stern. Or the Constitutions I sank by sailing my Endymion underneath their guns because they didn't know how to depress their cannons enough to hit me.

But even wishing to get rid of that, there were far better options than this (like musket fire). So why not:

Keep the hammock nerfs, keep the barricades buff. Reduce boarding speed to -3.5 -> +3.5kn, reduce the difference in speed to |4.5| kn, reduce DD to 10%, increase re-pull timer to 3.5 minutes.

Then work on the other stuff thats wrong with NA, focus on the patches we were told about a while back (UI patch, mods rebalance, PvP zone ROE, reinforcment zone ROE, etc.) then look at implementing musket fire or some other legitimate mechanic to deal with these other problems. 

I can't help but feel we're trying to address a small issue here (hull hugging and stern camping that most players *should* know how to counter), but creating bigger issues with far more devastating consequences.

 

A quick note about "historical" accuracy... "historically" (and now...and 200 years from now....) there was no way to stop a ship, weighing hundreds of tons, moving away from your own ship at any rate of speed more than a crawl with grapples and handropes. Even if we assume magic ropes that don't ever snap, there is nothing that can be tied onto that won't simply be torn off by the forces involved stopping that much momentum. Especially when sails are still set, providing power thats working counter to what the grapples are.

I think you'd be far more likely to see ships completely stop (or nearly so) via ramming, demasting, or dropped sails before a boarding happens. Or the boarding happens when both ships are close together and sailing in the same direction. Not casually passing 100 feet away from each other, or sailing 100 feet away from each other, but at different angles...

 

Lets test it before totally dismissing it out of hand (but I agree with others and I'm fairly certain its a bad change).

Short term suggestions if we are to truly test this: increase the re-pull timer to at least 2 minutes. 3+ is probably better. Decrease speed to 5kn and not 8kn.

@admin says if it doesn't work out, they'll know and revert it. My question is, how long will we need to test to know if it works? 1 week? 2? 1 month? 4 months (Wasa meta, anyone?) 6+ months (looking at you, PvP zones)....

 

This.  Well said

[Lovec1990]

5 minutes ago, Angus MacDuff said:

Not boarding actions.  Surrendered and were boarded

true but still it proves my point towing captured ship home was far more popular and rewarding than sinking captured ship 

[Licinio Chiavari]

3 minutes ago, Lovec1990 said:

true but still it proves my point towing captured ship home was far more popular and rewarding than sinking captured ship 

Right. Especially being ZERO reason to strike the colours in the game... Even when totally plain clear the ship is lost.

So a push (pull and kill) is needed to strike these damned colours.

[z4ys]

1. Game simplyfication
2. We are used to run full sails/ full speed during fights (gamey)

[Angus MacDuff]

6 minutes ago, Licinio Chiavari said:

And muskets fire was not part of the Battle, right?

Nelson got killed by scurvy Indeed.

Why would you do that?  I addressed that most ships were not taken by boarding actions but surrendered and then were boarded.  Yes there were some actual boarding actions that took ships.  Yes there were casualties from musket fire (didn't have to be during a boarding action).  Don't take a single incident and say its the norm.  You're better than that.

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

There's a way... but would we like to have Morale to be a rule and eventually "strike" ?

[Angus MacDuff]

1 minute ago, z4ys said:

1. Game simplyfication
2. We are used to run full sails/ full speed during fights (gamey)

So your point is that ships need to be stopped before boarding is initiated?  I agree completely!

[Madjohn]

At it's first stage, the game was full pvp, and only relying on captains skills and their hability to play as a team, and it was really fun. Then came pve; upgrades, skill books, woods, trims, creating all sorts of metas with updates; rng...  All those i can take caus' i still enjoyed playing the game. With this 8kn thing i don't even want to click on "sail".

Their must be boarding in that kind of game, and manage to board a ship required skills and efforts, and yes DD was definitivly removing any interest in boarding so it's good it's been nerfed. To me it's just the boarding itself i really don't like (dumb - rock paper scissors ....- and related to players ping). Would have loved to get avatars fights (i know this won't happen) or an adaptation of Ultimate General gameplay (may be?).

I know it's testing, and i really hope 8kn will be lowered (3,4kn was fine).

For all those talking about historical facts, i love to play games with historical background (EU IV, crusader king, AC series, etc...) but i play videogames for the fun, not for historical truth at all cost

@devs  : you've made the greatest game ever, please don't ruin it by making boarding the meta (i've heard reverse just builded his full boarding bellona ^^).

Sry for my bad english but i think you'll get my point.

See you soon NA