"Go to bed" log off

[Liq]

10 minutes ago, the Kidd said:

they cant join because it's limited to 25 Players or 3 minutes. why they should not getting the possibility to get a fight after you coming out the battle and are exactly at this position where you are waiting for him...

Because for that exact reason. They were not within 3 minutes range, thus realistically not in range (OW - instance difference).

When a MMo uses another instance (with way lower travelling speed than OW) to have its battles in, special rules are needed

[Riparian]

At least give the TP or Log off option for the defender in the battle. That way you only need to fight one attack or revenge fleet.

This option can also have a ”cost” to it. Maybe it uses your tow (if available), cost few pvp marks or need to empty your hold.

[Percival Merewether]

I see the problem in every scenario you bring up, but I’d suggest a different solution to the problems:

10 minutes ago, the Kidd said:

I am probably the faster ship... i tag /or get defensive taged.. so prob i am not able to hold him in battle.. how should it been possible for him to get away if i am faster.

I have had the above happen to me and it is a problem.. I propose permanent control for all ships, not just those with bow chasers. Increase the radius of control to be slightly larger than the tag circle.

10 minutes ago, the Kidd said:

Other example, long battles are during on... other guys are waiting outside because they cant join because it's limited to 25 Players or 3 minutes. why they should not getting the possibility to get a fight after you coming out the battle and are exactly at this position where you are waiting for him...

This is an engine limitation, but in my opinion fair enough - if you insist though, perhaps adding a joining lobby to the battle so that when one of your teammates dies they can call more players in in groups of five. It is of course only possible to enter the join lobby for the first 3 minutes.

11 minutes ago, the Kidd said:

my solution to weak this or getting better chances to get away are: get away the F11 Coords and make the position youve got inside to the position where you leave the battle

We definately need to get rid of F11 coordinates, leaving battle in the same position as in battle could be an option, but then we need more time to sail away. We also need to make sure the dead player is kicked out of the battle instance prevent him from seeing where you’re heading. But remember that the topic is about going to bed, we still need to be able to logout.

[Tac]

21 minutes ago, the Kidd said:

if you think you have to sail with 25 people to an hotspot where 45 Frenchs are waiting for you it is for sure that you get 2 or more battles.... if you want to win both you Need at least 3 hours... if you dont have the time for it just surrender or sail alone away after battle, so some of the guys follow you and kill you finaly -> then youre home -> and your mates have to fight some guys less because they followed you

What are you talking about? I said we went expecting that , we did win the first two battles of about 3 hours all told then we had to have a 3rd big battle and I also said ships were outside that battle which would of meant a fourth.

So il ask you again are you content to keep battling for 4- 6 hours into the night possibly even longer?

its an easy yes or no answer?

[Tac]

12 minutes ago, rediii said:

expect to die with such a bad plan. Thats all.

You only won battles due to engine limitation of 25vs25

Bad plan?Do you know what the plan was?

i have no idea what  25 v25 mechanics has to do with this thread tbh?

[the Kidd]

27 minutes ago, rediii said:

Instead of battleresult screen etc. I would suggest to put a multiplier + cooldowntimer.

 

Example: I get tagged and escape. I get a timer of 10 min (explained later) and a timer where I cant get tagged for x amount of time. I escape again, the timer is now trippled. (1,5 minutes?) If I get tagged again within 10 min (the above mentioned cooldown) the timer increases to 5 minutes allowing you to log off

Something like that is an idea... but definetly not login off after every battle to escape... also no teleports...

 

 

24 minutes ago, rediii said:

expect to die with such a bad plan. Thats all.

You only won battles due to engine limitation of 25vs25

nothing more to add

Edited April 27, 2018 by the Kidd

[the Kidd]

39 minutes ago, Percival Merewether said:

I have had the above happen to me and it is a problem.. I propose permanent control for all ships, not just those with bow chasers. Increase the radius of control to be slightly larger than the tag circle.

 

So you will never have a chance to leave a battle if only 1 boat is in battle that are faster then you...

Quote

We definately need to get rid of F11 coordinates, leaving battle in the same position as in battle could be an option, but then we need more time to sail away. We also need to make sure the dead player is kicked out of the battle instance prevent him from seeing where you’re heading. But remember that the topic is about going to bed, we still need to be able to logout.

yea for sure F11 should get rid... something that highers your chance after the battle to get more distance between is also okay -> rediii's idea

But kicking out people that sunk??? Nowaaaaaay Buddy... thats after the fight the best moment ingame, you can watch the fight then thats perfect

Edited April 27, 2018 by the Kidd

[Nelsons Barrel]

Just now, the Kidd said:

So you will never have a chance to leave a battle if only 1 boat is in battle that are faster then you...

Thats already the case.

[the Kidd]

4 minutes ago, Nelsons Barrel said:

Thats already the case.

Nope. you can easily demast or kill any surprise that is in battle against "for example" your bellona.

if you get a control perk with distance like the tagg you have no chance.

 

Today this surprise have to hit you all 2 minutes that you cant leave, after he only have to stay in tag circle range which is much bigger then cannons can shoot

Edited April 27, 2018 by the Kidd

[Percival Merewether]

11 minutes ago, the Kidd said:

So you will never have a chance to leave a battle if only 1 boat is in battle that are faster then you...

You presented the problem and I presented a solution, you are running circles around yourself.. in short.. No.. If there is  a ship in the battle that is faster than you and insists on keeping you in the circle then you can't do anything, very much like real life.. You are however more than welcome to turn and fight it. Or perhaps reason with them (Can be harder for some than others).. no one wants to stay in battle if it's impossible to find a winner.

11 minutes ago, the Kidd said:

yea for sure F11 should get rid... something that highers your chance after the battle to get more distance between is also okay -> rediii's idea

But kicking out people that sunk??? Nowaaaaaay Buddy... thats after the fight the best moment ingame, you can watch the fight then thats perfect

Easy now Kid... I'm not your buddy...

I was merely making a suggestion..... I did not specifically state so, but I assumed we were talking about 1v1s in this case.. if it is a 5v2 all spectators stays in battle until the entire enemy side is killed of course.. But you should be kicked out 30 seconds after it is over - you do not need to spectate your enemy sailing around trying to loot

[Tac]

40 minutes ago, rediii said:

50 players wait there, you first battle and then next 25 come. You would be dead the first time

Allowing 2nd tag should be possible in my oppinion but 3rd is too much

 

Bad plan because you sailed hours to the targetport

But there is 25 v 25 mechanics so that’s irrelevant,as you say 2nd fine 3rd and 4th to much , my debate here isn’t the result I have no problem with the result we’re debating the time you can be made to spend getting to the result .

[Serk]

At least, with the option to tp to port after the battle, it also meant that it was usually a waste of time to stay still and wait outside of a battle. People had better things to do and would provide content somewhere else.

 

I've seen so many players waste so many hours in waiting just to revenge gank some poor fellow. All those hours could have been better used.

Edited April 27, 2018 by Serk

[VonVolks]

ah but revenge is sweet....

I think F11 removal once game is "live" will help make things a bit harder and more Age of Sail like (i.e fleets failing to find people)

[Sven Silberbart]

Revenge fleets make an area (espacially capitols) a dangerous place for an hunter. And hunting should be dangerous in such places. Revenge fleets bring the possibility for players to make an area more safe for them.

As i said...Loose all cargo in hull (and maybe cannons) when using a "go to bed"-button would be fine for me. I dont want to see the hunters come, look for a easy target and after that easy kill escape with all captured cargo, gold by using a magic hideout (logoff). It also isn't immersive in my oppinion.

[Archaos]

I would say allow log off after battle, but when you log back in you have to return to a home nation or neutral port before you can engage anyone again unless you are attacked.

[Archaos]

1 hour ago, Otto Kohl said:

Im beeing chased by some spanish retards ( 6 of them ) for 3rd hour in a row. We need some kind of solution for this kind of griefing.

Maybe some system where they cannot engage you again for so many minutes after one battle ends. It would not stop the revenge fleet waiting outside but it would stop recurring battles wearing you down till you run out of time or repairs.

[Nemockalb]

sorry my bad english

you are ready to fight, but don't have enough time to continue? really, really?

SOLUTION:

Player XXX ready to exit battle.
Player XXX pressed ESC, select "Emergency logoff from fight". Are you sure? You will be bla-bla-bla on next logon? YES.
Combat log: XXX emergency logoff, 25 km from Mortimer Town E-SE
player XXX logged off in the fight point (⚔️)

Later, player XXX return and login

Combat log: XXX anchored, 25 km from Mortimer Town E-SE for yyy minutes.

player XX ingame, but can't sail while anchor raising. (yyy minutes)
he can be tagged, anchor raised if it happen.
all anchored players from same nation, located in the fight circle, enter same fight if anyone tagged.
logged on player auto enter to fight if he is logged in the fight area (OW) against his nation
player have "no join" timer after anchor raised, but can tag

yyy - tuning feature. Enough enemies around - 1 min (for example). Enough enemies in the nearest port area - 10 min. No enemies - up to 30 min.
It's just far enough. IMHO

So, you can safe exit, but after logon all what you can - is stay and whait while you will be tagged. (an even better chance then before logoff)

Protect from abuse (save operations etc): not anchored players from same nation can't enter fight against their anchored mates.
emergency logoff from OW or from fight against npc is impossible.

Yes, your team mates can sail to area before you logon again and tag all hunters == more PVP🎌 (At that point one could add login timer).

Edited April 29, 2018 by Nemockalb

[Jean Ribault]

10 hours ago, Nemockalb said:

sorry my bad english

you are ready to fight, but don't have enough time to continue? really, really?

SOLUTION:

Player XXX ready to exit battle.
Player XXX pressed ESC, select "Emergency logoff from fight". Are you sure? You will be bla-bla-bla on next logon? YES.
Combat log: XXX emergency logoff, 25 km from Mortimer Town E-SE
player XXX logged off in the fight point (⚔️)

Later, player XXX return and login

Combat log: XXX anchored, 25 km from Mortimer Town E-SE for yyy minutes.

player XX ingame, but can't sail while anchor raising. (yyy minutes)
he can be tagged, anchor raised if it happen.
all anchored players from same nation, located in the fight circle, enter same fight if anyone tagged.
logged on player auto enter to fight if he is logged in the fight area (OW) against his nation
player have "no join" timer after anchor raised, but can tag

yyy - tuning feature. Enough enemies around - 1 min (for example). Enough enemies in the nearest port area - 10 min. No enemies - up to 30 min.
It's just far enough. IMHO

So, you can safe exit, but after logon all what you can - is stay and whait while you will be tagged. (an even better chance then before logoff)

Protect from abuse (save operations etc): not anchored players from same nation can't enter fight against their anchored mates.
emergency logoff from OW or from fight against npc is impossible.

Yes, your team mates can sail to area before you logon again and tag all hunters == more PVP🎌 (At that point one could add login timer).

 

Comment here is only on the initiating mechanic you suggest, not the rest of it.  So what you say is you get the dialogue "Emergency logoff from fight".  IMO that's no good, and it must say "Emergency logoff after fight".  Why?  Because you shouldn't be allowed to have a get out of jail free card, and that is also not fair to the person(s) you are fighting.  It could be used as soon as you guess you might lose the battle, thus giving you a chance to save that ship.  Instead you should lose that ship, or fight it out in case you can salvage it, then you get the emergency logoff if you survived.

Because the other factor here is....if you don't have time for 1 single fight before you go to bed, then you shouldn't be logging on (if you fight once and survive you are eligible for that mechanic).  But if you do log on, then you should simply acknowledge you might lose your ship.  Personal responsibility, not a bailout.  Just my opinion.  The rest of your mechanic might work okay with some tuning.

Edited April 29, 2018 by Jean Ribault

[Liq]

28 minutes ago, Jean Ribault said:

IMO that's no good, and it must say "Emergency logoff after fight".  Why?  Because you shouldn't be allowed to have a get out of jail free card, and that is also not fair to the person(s) you are fighting

Why does it need to be fair? It's an MMO, we got the two dimensions, OW and Battle instances. Why do so many feel like they MUST be able to take revenge, even if they sailed across half the map and thus should have never even been able to get to the fight?

PvP in an MMO is never fair (or rarely). The need to take revenge is arcadey.

3 min join timer = ships in range can join a battle. The difference between distance covered in OW and Battle in 3 minutes is insane.

Besides, I think with current reinforcment zones (and their forever open battles), the revenge fleet got transformed into instant-support. Inside the reinforcment zones around capitals it might be somewhat acceptable that you can join a fight 50 minutes into it. Imagine the distance you can cover during it!  But anywhere else on the map, the general rule should be: You get what you see. Thus the 3 minute join timer.

[Jean Ribault]

10 minutes ago, Liq said:

Why does it need to be fair? ...

 

You are twisting my words into something I did not say.  I did not say the fight needs to be fair.  It's the fact that you enter a battle and then decide oh I might lose this battle so I'll pull the ole' exit now trick.  THAT is the unfair part.  And yes, that part does have to be fair.  If you are now in a battle then you are now in a battle.  Suck it up buttercup.  Otherwise, let's also just pull the 2-minute wait timer for logging off in the OW, that way I can exit the game as soon as someone sees me in the OW and avoid this altogether.  It's the same effect.

[Jean Ribault]

1 minute ago, Jean Ribault said:

 

Otherwise, let's also just pull the 2-minute wait timer for logging off in the OW, that way I can exit the game as soon as someone sees me in the OW and avoid this altogether...

Oh and to quote myself as a follow-up, all OW hunters can read that line and comment on just how fun the game will be for them.

[Liq]

20 minutes ago, Jean Ribault said:

 

You are twisting my words into something I did not say.  I did not say the fight needs to be fair.  It's the fact that you enter a battle and then decide oh I might lose this battle so I'll pull the ole' exit now trick.  THAT is the unfair part.  And yes, that part does have to be fair.  If you are now in a battle then you are now in a battle.  Suck it up buttercup.  Otherwise, let's also just pull the 2-minute wait timer for logging off in the OW, that way I can exit the game as soon as someone sees me in the OW and avoid this altogether.  It's the same effect.

Agree with that, if you are in a battle you are in a battle, but clearly if you're faster (say fir), and manage to get away, well, you got away, right? The only fair consequence then would be to actually get away (in terms of a speedboost and invisibility in OW after leaving battle) ; not get surrounded by a fleet of 10+ ships camping your battle position, profiting from an *unfair* Speedboost from open world..?

Why only let the ones camping a battle to take revenge profit from the OW speed boost compared to battle? Don't think that's *fair*.

Edited April 29, 2018 by Liq

[Jean Ribault]

32 minutes ago, Liq said:

Agree with that, if you are in a battle you are in a battle, but clearly if you're faster (say fir), and manage to get away, well, you got away, right? The only fair consequence then would be to actually get away (in terms of a speedboost and invisibility in OW after leaving battle) ; not get surrounded by a fleet of 10+ ships camping your battle position, profiting from an *unfair* Speedboost from open world..?

Why only let the ones camping a battle to take revenge profit from the OW speed boost compared to battle? Don't think that's *fair*.

Yes we are on the same page with that.  That's the part that could be addressed. 

 

3 minutes ago, Otto Kohl said:

6h is also ok. @admin please look into this.

 

Seriously, you get that amount of sleep?  6 hours would be a luxury! 

[VonVolks]

It's good this topic is seeing a lot of discussion as reminding people its a game for people with RL is good.

At @Otto Kohl says being repeatedly dragged into fights for 3 hours with no means of exiting the game without being killed is pretty shitty....

I double down on not wanting to be able to LEAVE a fight instance thats ongoing, but only to be able to log off safely AFTER  battle is either won or you have escaped.

ALSO this situation should be RARE so you can make the "cost" for using it VERY High. Even a 24 hour log off block or whatever. Most people should only have to use it very rarely if caught in a ridiculous situation of re-tags etc.... OR to stop PVPrs using it as a regular escape clause, maybe limiting its use to once every 14 days or something?

Edited April 30, 2018 by VonVolks