PvP incentive

[Slim McSauce]

Just now, EliteDelta said:

Come on, we showed up with two Wasa's once. Every other time for me has been in Endymion or Indefatigable

I disagree about your point on finding PvP. Most of the fights I find vs. US are near Ayes. Our typical trips end when we get to the safe zone, at which point we head back down. Sometimes we go to Charleston, but it's less common. 

Also, you should check out the activity around free towns. La Tortue, Tumbado, and a few other ports are always highly active areas that very often provide PvP.

We tried combat marks as the only reward, it didn't work. Most people chose the PvE option.

More incentive for people to PvP would be nice, but we won't get that by removing the marks.

And we tried legends style gentlemens agreement battles outside of freeports fighting over...nothing important. Its lame.

And you miss the point, we never lacked reward incentives. If the mechanics were strong the game wouldn't NEED marks to make people want to PLAY.

And on combat marks, name one item in the old CM shop that costed more than 500 CMs? No we did not properly try combat marks as rewards. Gank style PVPers once again found that just playing the game isn't enough for them and they literally need to be payed extra to PVP or else "we won't do it ;_;"

>>>>legends

 

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, Slim Jimmerson said:

 Gank style PVPers once again found that just playing the game isn't enough for them and they literally need to be payed extra to PVP or else "we won't do it ;_;"

 

You're now arguing both sides. First you pointed out that you get frustrated if you don't get PvP marks (Only happens when you are ganking) and now you say that gankers wanted PvP marks brought back.

My advice, stop joining a battle that is already 5v1

[Slim McSauce]

Just now, EliteDelta said:

You're now arguing both sides.

Since when is being objective a bad thing?

PVP marks are 1. Frustrating to deal with 2. A bad promoter of PVP 3. Have rekt the economy

Why do gankers want PVP marks? 1. Exclusive rewards for themselves.

These things don't conflict with each other.

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, Slim Jimmerson said:

Since when is being objective a bad thing?

PVP marks are 1. Frustrating to deal with 2. A bad promoter of PVP 3. Have rekt the economy

Why do gankers want PVP marks? 1. Exclusive rewards for themselves.

These things don't conflict with each other.

How are PvP marks a bad promoter of PvP? 

You are rewarded for improving your skills, and winning fights. You are rewarded for NOT ganking. You are rewarded for choosing to fight at a disadvantage (winning a 1v2 gives a great payout). 

How is any of that bad? 

We cant reward for participation, it will get abused, and there won't be a way to track it. 

[Slim McSauce]

6 minutes ago, EliteDelta said:

How are PvP marks a bad promoter of PvP? 

Instead of PVPing being fun, enjoyable, and personally/monetarily/world buildingly rewarding enough to hold its own, we have to add ridiculous marks so people actually feel like they're achieving something when they kill another player.

So instead of the loot/capture/denial of enemy ships/resources being enough, we give you some doofus mark that you can spend in a premium shop that looks like it came right out of a mobile game. "Buy the best ships with PVP marks today! *No crafting required)

What's next? Traders marks that let you buy a million gold and TP a ship with full hold anywhere on the map?

Why do we need premium, game breaking rewards.....for basic actions in the game? Now everyone's too concerned with gay marks instead of just playing and having fun. Which you can't anymore because even if you sink an enemy ship, turns out that means nothing because it was spawned in with PVP marks, no one even took the time to acquire materials and craft it. They'll be back the next day with the same exact ship like nothing happened.

It's all "Gotta gank traders until I can buy my next bellona ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)"

Or "Ops, can't fight him! If we lose then we give them TONS of PVP marks to buy their free magic ships to come back and gank us even more with¯\_(ツ)_/¯"

What a dumb feedback loop.

[Guest]

 

31 minutes ago, Slim Jimmerson said:

Instead of PVPing being fun, enjoyable, and personally/monetarily/world buildingly rewarding enough to hold its own, we have to add ridiculous marks so people actually feel like they're achieving something when they kill another player.

People didn't go out and fight when we only had combat marks. Do you remember the leaderboards? Many days on EU we wouldn't even have 15 people on there. On global it was worse, sometimes you'd have less than 5 on the board. 

Ill admit the system isn't perfect, but having PvP marks is better than not having them. 

 

[Slim McSauce]

8 minutes ago, EliteDelta said:

Ill admit the system isn't perfect, but having PvP marks is better than not having them. 

No it's not. I'd rather not have PVP marks so we can look to better solutions than have PVP marks buying time to ignore the problems we have. Marks that have created more problems than they're worth.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Slim Jimmerson said:

No it's not. I'd rather not have PVP marks so we can look to better solutions than have PVP marks buying time to ignore the problems we have. Marks that have created more problems than they're worth.

Because you don't have any...? 

[Slim McSauce]

Just now, EliteDelta said:

Because you don't have any...? 

Nice try, I have 52 and have yet to spend any outside of using them to trade for crafting resources.

Way to push past all the obvious issues with the marks, on the flip side I assume you love acquiring marks, and/or find there's no purpose in PVP besides getting marks. Or that you feel like PVP is a right to passage to get exclusive items/bypass the usual realistic sandbox MMO aspect of NA.

I think you defend marks even when they're such a problem because you don't want to have to craft, trade or rely on anyone to get your ships. You want to be able to get the best free rare wood ships by just doing what you like and not having to worry about logistics or economy. If we get rid of PVP marks it's no more free endless Wasas and Bellonas that you rely on. No more leverage on the people you hunt, therefore you have to play by the rules again and have to work with your nation/clan to get supplies/ships like everyone else.

If you want that so bad why don't you just capture the ships of your targets? No work involved, you can have fun all day using the ships of your enemies.

But no, you want the best of the best because YOU deserved it. YOU earned those PVP marks doing what everyone WISHED they could do.

You think anyone would craft, or do anything but PVP if they could? I sure would but I have to worry about where my next teak batch is coming, or what strategic ship building port is going to be taken by our enemies. You may not have to put in the time to have your fun at the end of the day, but most of us do and we're not gonna have marks ruining the game to satisfy you people who would more at home in Naval Action: Legends.

[Vile Executioner]

I gained 61 pvp marks yesterday, I don’t see what the whole problem is about pvp marks. Here’s what I do, I don’t join in on ts/discord. I don’t tell my friends where I’m going. I don’t ask if anyone wants to join me. I sail alone, I get a 2v1 or 1v1, I accept it even if odds are against me. I fight, manage to win, I get a massive reward. It is not hard to find pvp marks, they are everywhere. If it were a 10v1 battle, you wouldn’t get much if not any at all. The pvp mark system is based off of the one ship you killed and is split between whatever extra help you got even if it is AI or fort. Lowering the number of the squad means you share less of reward. Think of it like a bank robbery, you don’t have to compete with anyone in fight for the pvp marks, means ganks are less valuable. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve told my own nation to stay out of a battle I just created to gain more in my favor if I can complete the fight on my own. How many people does it really take to defeat one person? Just one

[Guest]

 

7 minutes ago, Slim Jimmerson said:

Nice try, I have 52 and have yet to spend any outside of using them to trade for crafting resources.

Way to push past all the obvious issues with the marks, on the flip side I assume you love acquiring marks, and/or find there's no purpose in PVP besides getting marks. Or that you feel like PVP is a right to passage to get exclusive items/bypass the usual realistic sandbox MMO aspect of NA.

I think you defend marks even when they're such a problem because you don't want to have to craft, trade or rely on anyone to get your ships. You want to be able to get the best free rare wood ships by just doing what you like and not having to worry about logistics or economy. If we get rid of PVP marks it's no more free endless Wasas and Bellonas that you rely on. No more leverage on the people you hunt, therefore you have to play by the rules again and have to work with your nation/clan to get supplies/ships like everyone else.

If you want that so bad why don't you just capture the ships of your targets? No work involved, you can have fun all day using the ships of your enemies.

But no, you want the best of the best because YOU deserved it. YOU earned those PVP marks doing what everyone WISHED they could do.

You think anyone would craft, or do anything but PVP if they could? I sure would but I have to worry about where my next teak batch is coming, or what strategic ship building port is going to be taken by our enemies. You may not have to put in the time to have your fun at the end of the day, but most of us do and we're not gonna have marks ruining the game to satisfy you people who would more at home in Naval Action: Legends.

Stop trying to push me to legends, you've said it a few times now. I have no interest in legends, and find it very dull. I like the hunt, and other experiences provided by the open world. 

Also, I have 50 crafting and typically craft my own ships. I prefer ships like the Endymion and Indefatigable for hunting, and guess what, you can't buy those with marks! 

Enjoy this crusade of yours, It doesn't look like you're making much headway though. 

Edited January 28, 2018 by Guest

[Vile Executioner]

More risk, more reward. Less risk, less reward. Any more complaints?

[Slim McSauce]

23 minutes ago, EliteDelta said:

 

Stop trying to push me to legends, you've said it a few times now. I have no interest in legends, and find it very dull. I like the hunt, and other experiences provided by the open world. 

Also, I have 50 crafting and typically craft my own ships. I prefer ships like the Endymion and Indefatigable for hunting, and guess what, you can't buy those with marks! 

Enjoy this crusade of yours, It doesn't look like you're making much headway though. 

Then tell me, why do you defend PVP marks? Look around, alt farming, denial of battle, busted economy. Why are these worth giving EXTRA reward  to PVPers when they hurt the game more than they benefit?

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Slim Jimmerson said:

Then tell me, why do you defend PVP marks? Look around, alt farming, denial of battle, busted economy. Why are these worth giving EXTRA reward  to PVPers when they hurt the game more than they benefit?

Only legitimate problem you listed is alt farming.

Denial of battle has always happened. People are afraid to lose their stuff.
Economy has also always been insane. I can't think of any time when people have said the economy was stable or working well.
 

[Slim McSauce]

2 minutes ago, EliteDelta said:

Only legitimate problem you listed is alt farming.

Denial of battle has always happened. People are afraid to lose their stuff.
Economy has also always been insane. I can't think of any time when people have said the economy was stable or working well.

MMO wise why do you think having the best ships with the best woods be available for marks? Doesn't that defeat the purpose of OW? More so than anything we've seen before?

Whats the difference between me teleporting over a indiaman full of ship materials to build a bellona and someone spawning one in with marks?

Also how to we stop the alt farming market with alts when we cannot reliably gauge who and who isn't an alt with IPs? Do we expect the devs to review all battles for patterns of abuse? What happens when the game is overrun with alters farming PVP selling them on the market? And what happens to the rest of the game when that happens? Will people craft ships or buy marks to spawn wasas/bellonas/constis. Is there a need to have an MMO at the point or can we switch the game over to a smaller, arena style map with ship/skill trees instead of economy/crafting since they're already so far undermined.

Edited January 28, 2018 by Slim Jimmerson

[Vile Executioner]

3 minutes ago, Slim Jimmerson said:

MMO wise why do you think having the best ships with the best woods be available for marks? Doesn't that defeat the purpose of OW? More so than anything we've seen before?

Whats the difference between me teleporting over a indiaman full of ship materials to build a bellona and someone spawning one in with marks?

well for the most part the only ship you cant get with materials and only pvp marks are the Hermione, wasa and lgv refit. 2 of which are irrelevant and aren't considered the "best" and the wasa is dirt cheap anyway. if cant put in the work to get 30 pvp marks, (two 5th rate kills btw) enough to get the small amount of pvp marks required to get a Bellona then I guess you deserve to build one yourself.

 

Yes, I believe the victory marks being bought by pvp marks to be used to build 1st rates are a great thing. if these are the "best ships" your thinking of then yes, if you cant sail properly to earn kills for your nation then you don't deserve to build a 1st rate by yourself without paying a great amount of gold for it

[Slim McSauce]

Just now, Vile Executioner said:

well for the most part the only ship you cant get with materials and only pvp marks are the Hermione, wasa and lgv refit. 2 of which are irrelevant and aren't considered the "best" and the wasa is dirt cheap anyway. if cant put in the work to get 30 pvp marks, (two 5th rate kills btw) enough to get the small amount of pvp marks required to get a Bellona then I guess you deserve to build one yourself.

 

Yes, I believe the victory marks being bought by pvp marks to be used to build 1st rates are a great thing. if these are the "best ships" your thinking of then yes, if you cant sail properly to earn kills for your nation then you don't deserve to build a 1st rate by yourself without paying a great amount of gold for it

Ok here it is. You view PVP as work, most everyone I know views PVP as fun.

You basically want ships to be free, only 2 kills for a free Wasa of any wood? Yeah of course.

I kindly remind you that this is still an MMO, and if you want constant, free PVP there's a game for that.

[Jean Ribault]

3 hours ago, Slim Jimmerson said:

...It's all "Gotta gank traders until I can buy my next bellona ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)"

...

 

And there ya go.  A couple days ago, I was run down by a Connie and I think it was an Indefat while on a trade run with a couple Trader Brigs.  Neither of them armed at all.  I have no idea how they caught up with me to begin with since I was doing 19 to 21 knots and they were almost at scope-only distance, and then barreled down on me like I was sailing a rock and they were on jetski's.

I don't care about the gold.  I didn't destroy it, they can have it.  But one of the players that did it, I just saw him no more than an hour earlier complaining that he couldn't find pvp.  Seriously?  That's what these people call pvp.  And that's why I don't care for it.  Why would I want to play this game with those kinds of cowards who really aren't looking for a fight.  Until I decide I'm bored with this game for good, I'll just play solo and make a few trade runs and craft a few ships.  There's no other content in the game anyway, apparently there's no development plan for such useless things.