Licinio Chiavari Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 Looks like you missed the pain of RUBLI (and others') wasa and bellona-class star destroyers against sub par captains and ships on US coast. Something going on for a month. I do not say I cant raid (and a bit "preying in the weekend") on bit better than basic Reno (or an Endy or a Surprise): it is what I did for quite a time in global... And with Reno sitting over 5-1 KD ratio. Still the damage I can do is limited. Above mentioned meta gaming is allowed by game mechanics and should not.
Jorge Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 4 minutes ago, rediii said: You dont need vets ressources. Most kills I jave ingame apart from rvr is on my fir fir reno equiped with gazelle bowfigure and nothing else. I had 0 slots on that ship and went to 3 slots with pvp until I was forced by @Palatinose and @Havelock to grind the ladt slots in pve I think pala and havelock can agree here that you dont need expensive setups. I still remember when havelock and me got 2 crewspace frigates and mediums from the shop and won vs @Liq and @Silfarion in a 2vs2 while they sailed proper ships. That duel we had was won by me because you didnt shoot chain first. I capped this wasa from @Jorge with a Agamemnon on mediums with gazelle and basic upgrades and 3 slots (i think its 3) No fancy stuff involved somewhere. How you get better in pvp? like in every pvp game start small and die often. Every pvp player died countless times. Bahamas is a great place to train right now. There is a lot of traffic around shroud and the ships are easy to replace and you learn the basics there. Most you learn there is the same on a 1st rate In pvp you usually win if you commit less mistakes than your opponent, as long as you have a similar ability to him even if you are worse. In my battle with @rediii he won the stern and it was impossible for me to maneuver to win him the position. Blunt victory for him. In summary, the more pvp you do and the better the players you face the better you will be ... 2
Hethwill, the Red Duke Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 The example given above, rubli vs enemies was never in a 3 v 12 fight, numbers as an example. They were always in several 3v2 fights in the same instance, globally 3v2, but pretty much 6 different engagements. They always had superiority at a given point. Many saw the streams. One thing I like in other games is the "replay" function to re-watch battles and see how bad I played any given situation. Video recording serves the same function with some limitations, but it is a great tool.
Licinio Chiavari Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 (edited) 13 minutes ago, rediii said: I did/do the same and the thing is not about upgrades ut about teamplay and focusdamage and inability of others. Not mods It's a mod problem if a group of light built 5th rates cant catch them. I and others' pursued Privateer for EIGHT HOURS a night then we had to give up Edited January 26, 2018 by Licinio Chiavari Typo
blubasso Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 1 minute ago, Licinio Chiavari said: It's a mod problem if a group of light built 5th rates cant catch them. I and others' purues Private for EIGHT HOURS a night then we had to give up Sorry but you have to understand when you cannot win a battle, and not at the reach of 8th hour... You can play as you wish, that’s not the point, but sometimes you should write on chat: “Ok, catch you some other time. GG”. My humble opinion, eh? 1
AeRoTR Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 That is what I thought, punch in my face, when I realised "copper plating" is in FACT BUFFED ! Gazele 2 --> 1 (%50 nerfed) Navy Hull Refit 3 --> 2,5 (%16 nerfed) Copper Plating 3,5 --> 3 (%14 nerfed) So Copper Plating is in fact buffed, others get actually nerfed, most accessible Gazelle getting the biggest hit. Thanks for making Elite, GREAT AGAIN ... 2
Licinio Chiavari Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 9 minutes ago, blubasso said: Sorry but you have to understand when you cannot win a battle, and not at the reach of 8th hour... You can play as you wish, that’s not the point, but sometimes you should write on chat: “Ok, catch you some other time. GG”. My humble opinion, eh? Again, missing the point. A bunch of light frigates HAVE TO BE ABLE to catch an ingermanland. As a light surp should have zero issues catching a Wasa.
blubasso Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Licinio Chiavari said: Again, missing the point. A bunch of light frigates HAVE TO BE ABLE to catch an ingermanland. As a light surp should have zero issues catching a Wasa. Yes, theoretically. In Real Life for sure. But ingame apparently not and you had to deal with that.You can report the issue hoping devs listen to you, that is not sure, because they think for all players, not for real life balancing. Sadly. Edited January 26, 2018 by blubasso
admin Posted January 26, 2018 Author Posted January 26, 2018 14 minutes ago, Licinio Chiavari said: As a light surp should have zero issues catching a Wasa. Who said so - it could be true and could be not true in different circumstances? Admiralty tests report 3rd rates speed of up to 12 knots broad reach. Lively class 36 gun frigate is also reported to have speeds of up to 12 knots broad reach. Most frigates of the royal navy did not exceed 12 knots but some indeed could sail 13 14 and even 14.5 knots Based on this it could even have some troubles chasing a third rate (especially in heavy seas). In fact a 3rd rate could easily gain on any frigate at heavy seas. And vice versa. in light winds a 3d rate would be very slow, while frigate would still perform well. 5
Slim McSauce Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 Just now, admin said: Who said so? Admiralty tests report 3rd rates speed of up to 12 knots broad reach Lively class 36 gun frigate is also reported to have speeds of up to 12 knots broad reach. Based on this it could even have some troubles chasing a third rate (especially in heavy seas) But in game the Wasa/Gustav base speed is 12.3(?) making it much faster than the 3rd rate or Bellona. Almost the same speed as the Constitution which I believe was reported at 13knts and should be faster than a 3rd rate wasa/gustav. 2
admin Posted January 26, 2018 Author Posted January 26, 2018 14 minutes ago, blubasso said: Yes, theoretically. In Real Life for sure. But ingame apparently not and you had to deal with that.You can report the issue hoping devs listen to you, that is not sure, because they think for all players, not for real life balancing. Sadly. dont listen to people with misconceptions who base their knowledge on movies or other games (all of which did not even had backing force/sternway).. 3rd rates were amazing sailers in real life (74 was the most successful ship design and their number even exceeded the number of frigates at certain point). some 3rd rates sailed faster than average frigates. 3
Slim McSauce Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 Just now, admin said: dont listen to people with misconceptions who base their knowledge on movies or other games (all of which did not even had backing force/sternway).. 3rd rates were amazing sailers in real life (74 was the most successful ship design and their number even exceeded the number of frigates at certain point). some 3rd rates sailed faster than average frigates. With all due respect is that good for gameplay? What place do frigates have if 3rd rates are better in every way? 3
admin Posted January 26, 2018 Author Posted January 26, 2018 4 minutes ago, Slim Jimmerson said: But in game the Wasa/Gustav base speed is 12.3(?) making it much faster than the 3rd rate or Bellona. Almost the same speed as the Constitution which I believe was reported at 13knts and should be faster than a 3rd rate wasa/gustav. Bellona is well faster than Wasa downwind.
admin Posted January 26, 2018 Author Posted January 26, 2018 1 minute ago, Slim Jimmerson said: With all due respect is that good for gameplay? What place do frigates have if 3rd rates are better in every way? 3rd rates a better in every way unless you need to run away (especially upwind) or for maneuver combat. that makes frigates great for hunting, scouting, or stern camping.
Malachi Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 8 minutes ago, admin said: Lively class 36 gun frigate is also reported to have speeds of up to 12 knots broad reach. The Livelys were capable of 10 to 11 knots close hauled and 13 knots with the wind abaft the beam 20 minutes ago, Licinio Chiavari said: As a light surp should have zero issues catching a Wasa. Very bad example. The real Surprise was an absolute indifferent sailing ship, with 11 knots max. That smaller ships are generally faster than SoLs ingame is concession to the lack of changing wind conditions (light - heavy), as far as I can tell. 1 minute ago, Slim Jimmerson said: Almost the same speed as the Constitution which I believe was reported at 13knts and should be faster than a 3rd rate wasa/gustav. Same speed is reported for the Gustavs. And at least two 74s ran 14 knots (prolly with 24s on the lower deck, but still)
Licinio Chiavari Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 8 minutes ago, admin said: Who said so? Admiralty tests report 3rd rates speed of up to 12 knots broad reach Lively class 36 gun frigate is also reported to have speeds of up to 12 knots broad reach. Based on this it could even have some troubles chasing a third rate (especially in heavy seas) So when the patch making the live oak Constitution going at 13 kts?? Dont call in historical datas only to back your decisions or "pro domo" vestris. Wanna talk if ever a ship in 1800 was purposely firing (and hitting and destroying) at enemy's ship masts? Or real turn ratio and yard turn required time? Dont reply "battle time is not 1:1 with reality" because your guns, in proportion to turning speed, are damn fast.
Malachi Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 1 minute ago, Licinio Chiavari said: Wanna talk if ever a ship in 1800 was purposely firing (and hitting and destroying) at enemy's ship masts? You have absolutely no idea what you´re talking about, right?
Guest Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 9 minutes ago, Slim Jimmerson said: But in game the Wasa/Gustav base speed is 12.3(?) making it much faster than the 3rd rate or Bellona. Almost the same speed as the Constitution which I believe was reported at 13knts and should be faster than a 3rd rate wasa/gustav. Wasa is 12.0, Bellona is 12.23 conni is 12.39 Most frigates average speeds of 12.6 - 13.1
admin Posted January 26, 2018 Author Posted January 26, 2018 1 minute ago, Licinio Chiavari said: Wanna talk if ever a ship in 1800 was purposely firing (and hitting and destroying) at enemy's ship masts? lol - sorry mate, please do not dig deeper. first - there was even a reward in the royal navy (on some ships) for deliberately shooting at masts and destroyeing them it was 1 gold guinea second masts were destroyed - sometimes occasionally sometimes on purpose - in fact victory yards were destroyed at trafalgar - by deliberate french fire into masts 5
Slim McSauce Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 (edited) 7 minutes ago, admin said: 3rd rates a better in every way unless you need to run away (especially upwind) or for maneuver combat. that makes frigates great for hunting, scouting, or stern camping. Bellona should be the same speed as the wasa, since it's the downwind sailing to the Wasas upwind. From experience I can tell you that Wasas running away are a mainstay of this game. I don't mind 3rd rates being the optimal middleground, but they should only work that way in optimal conditions, whether that be an introduction of light-heavy winds or even lowering base speeds of the wasa/bello but increasing their sail force and decreasing accel, perhaps creating a sort of "heavy" sail affect that relies on keeping your speed up, sails intact to avoid bleeding speed like a heavy boom and zoomer FW190 in a flight combat sim. Because right now all roles are filled affectively by the Wasa/Bello 100% of the time. It's making PVP a bit stale. Edited January 26, 2018 by Slim Jimmerson 2
Licinio Chiavari Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 4 minutes ago, Malachi said: The Livelys were capable of 10 to 11 knots close hauled and 13 knots with the wind abaft the beam Very bad example. The real Surprise was an absolute indifferent sailing ship, with 11 knots max. That smaller ships are generally faster than SoLs ingame is concession to the lack of changing wind conditions (light - heavy), as far as I can tell. Same speed is reported for the Gustavs. And at least two 74s ran 14 knots (prolly with 24s on the lower deck, but still) Do you ever sailed a modern sailing Boat? Do you ever sailed (as a seaman) on a Square rigged ship? For example: define close haul for a 74 guns or a frigate. Moreover: I was using game description/mechanics/roles calling the surp example. That a longer 74 could be faster than a shorter corvette at broad reach and good wind has a simple reason: critical speed... That's function of (aside hull shape) length. The longer you are, the higher the max possible speed. 1 minute ago, Malachi said: You have absolutely no idea what you´re talking about, right? No. Enlight me.
Licinio Chiavari Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 6 minutes ago, admin said: lol - sorry mate, please do not dig deeper. first - there was even a reward in the royal navy (on some ships) for deliberately shooting at masts and destroyeing them it was 1 gold guinea second masts were destroyed - sometimes occasionally sometimes on purpose - in fact victory yards were destroyed at trafalgar - by deliberate french fire into masts Ships relative speed? Distance?
HachiRoku Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 6 minutes ago, admin said: deliberately shooting at masts and destroyeing them hmm speaking of yards. Could destroying yards ever become a thing? 3
admin Posted January 26, 2018 Author Posted January 26, 2018 9 minutes ago, HachiRoku said: hmm speaking of yards. Could destroying yards ever become a thing? no - in 5 years maybe 4
Odol Posted January 26, 2018 Posted January 26, 2018 3 minutes ago, Licinio Chiavari said: Ships relative speed? Distance? The Victory was headed nearly directly at the French line at that point and I think was at battle sails running probably 6-7kn. The French were most likely doing about the same in a crossing pattern. So not a difficult shot, and if I recall one of the masts of the Victory actually fell on collision with a French ship.
Recommended Posts