Patch 14: Part 2 experimental patch increasing realism in ship behavior

[vazco]

9 minutes ago, Seraphic Radiance said:

welcome to eve online 'Titans' ='1st rates', you only take them to capture very important ports. If you use them only for important battles, we will be ok. We need to change people mentality here, they got used to 1st rates too much .

This would be ok with me if top nations wouldn't get free "titans" raining on them from the sky. Right now experienced players already get huge advantage over new ones. They have:

• combo skill books which take new player 6 months to grind
• costly upgrades, which new players can't usually afford, which often require an alt or connections to someone with an alt
• greater PvP mark income due to those bonuses, thus better access to PvP mods

If you add to this that they have access to 1st rates just because they're in a nation which has an advantage, it's pretty much OP - considering how much advantage their experience already gives them. Don't you think that in order to get more new players, we need to give them some fighting chance?... Noone will play the game in which he's constantly destroyed by an enemy with an unfair advantage (except for experience, all those advantages feel unfair for new players).

Wipe is not a solution, as after wipe there are still going to be new players.

[Alado]

7 minutes ago, Seraphic Radiance said:

final release

lol  , this its the Queens of all excuses,  it is paintfull and overused, next time use other excuse `please, be more original

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Red Dragon 13]

2 hours ago, admin said:

together with the removal of permits for majority of vessels on both servers.

• permits will remain for first rates and second rates

 

Admin, what happens to ship permits already bought for marks and still not used?

I have Wappen, H Rattle snake and others still in my hold.

[Stepp636]

Just now, Red Dragon 13 said:

Admin, what happens to ship permits already bought for marks and still not used?

I have Wappen, H Rattle snake and others still in my hold.

you can use them ofc

[Red Dragon 13]

11 minutes ago, Stepp636 said:

you can use them ofc

Well, at least that. Thanks a lot.

[Seraphic Radiance]

8 minutes ago, vazco said:

This would be ok with me if top nations wouldn't get free "titans" raining on them from the sky. Right now experienced players already get huge advantage over new ones. They have:

• combo skill books which take new player 6 months to grind
• costly upgrades, which new players can't usually afford, which often require an alt or connections to someone with an alt
• greater PvP mark income due to those bonuses, thus better access to PvP mods

If you add to this that they have access to 1st rates just because they're in a nation which has an advantage, it's pretty much OP - considering how much advantage their experience already gives them. Don't you think that in order to get more new players, we need to give them some fighting chance?... Noone will play the game in which he's constantly destroyed by an enemy with an unfair advantage (except for experience, all those advantages feel unfair for new players).

Wipe is not a solution, as after wipe there are still going to be new players.

Exactly. Devs don't see it for some reason. This game needs battles where nations can get hurt badly. Let's say if you sunk 3 1st rates , but lost a battle it's still a big Victory because it takes weeks to acquire one if not months.

Wipe will be needed for all 1st-2nd rates, marks and maybe even skill books and mods, the rest can stay as it is. 

Edited December 22, 2017 by Seraphic Radiance

[Landsman]

1 hour ago, admin said:

what about VMs for pvp marks? I have heard you guys are active in PVP

1 Victory Mark = 50 PvP marks should be the ratio in my opinion. Seems more than reasonable when the 3 top nations get the victory marks for free on top of their PvP marks.

[Seraphic Radiance]

8 minutes ago, Landsman said:

1 Victory Mark = 50 PvP marks should be the ratio in my opinion. Seems more than reasonable when the 3 top nations get the victory marks for free on top of their PvP marks.

We do not have rational thinking here. Everyone floods this forum with their ideas and creates a mess. NA is trying to sail through this mess. Devs need to pick the brightest minds from this mess and lock them in a room and let them brainstorm and analyze every possible situation before making public appearance. The lack of resources really starts to show up here. 

Edited December 22, 2017 by Seraphic Radiance

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

19 minutes ago, Seraphic Radiance said:

Devs need to pick the brightest minds from this mess

When I am not selected I will rage and post all kind of nonsense on how things are *********  ( read in Sarcasm with extremely heavy Ironic accent )

[victor]

16 minutes ago, Hethwill said:

When I am not selected I will rage and post all kind of nonsense on how things are *********  ( read in Sarcasm with extremely heavy Ironic accent )

  Actually It is almost impossible that you will be not selected. As far as I remember you always like each and every single thing Devs propose (read it in etc. etc. ..... as you said)

Edited December 22, 2017 by victor

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

Just now, victor said:

  Actually It is almost impossible that you will be not selected. As far as I remember you always like each and every single thing Devs propose (read it in etc. etc. ..... as you said)

I like the experience the game delivers

I don't like it to be softcore but I don't rant about it. I suggest and hope it works. When it doesn't, tough luck.

No need to rant so much about changes.

[Seraphic Radiance]

31 minutes ago, Hethwill said:

When I am not selected I will rage and post all kind of nonsense on how things are *********  ( read in Sarcasm with extremely heavy Ironic accent )

Rage?  No need. The time left in this one is not worth it. After all this is almost Christmas. 

P.S. Do not forget to wish your players "Happy Holidays' this year. 

http://www.xmasclock.com/

Edited December 22, 2017 by Seraphic Radiance

[Vernon Merrill]

1 hour ago, Seraphic Radiance said:

welcome to eve online 'Titans' ='1st rates', you only take them to capture very important ports. If you use them only for important battles, we will be ok. We need to change people mentality here, they got used to 1st rates too much .

This.  Devs stayed many times they want 1st rates to be “rare and special”.  But again, due to testing, many people have gotten used to having easy access to the biggest, shiniest things.   Devs are CLEARLY setting mechanics up for a post-wipe world while we rage about how it affects us in our world where already have everything.   

I think if the devs do this correctly, with the wipe and release coupled with the addition (hopefully) of a new 3rd rate (Montana), then things will be fine.  The key is to make it at least POSSIBLE for a few 3rd to POTENTIALLY take down a first.  And that requires a look at those “death-star thickness mods”...,

[maturin]

5 hours ago, Demsity said:

Lets take Prussia as an example here.

Even if all nations on the server group together and push Sweden (the current conquest leader) all the way to the bottom, Prussia would still be no where near to getting victory marks.

Lets say that GB becomes the next conquest leader and all the nations group together and push them to the bottom.

Lets say that Sweden takes some ports off GB and surpasses Prussia on the leader board again. 

Now lets say Russia is the leader...

How in the world will Prussia ever get a victory mark?

If you can explain this to me, all will be grand.

Disclaimer: No real correlation to any nations in the game and I´m not trying to be offensive to any one nation

The devs didn't create the nations of Poland and Prussia (FFS) in a naval game set in the Americas to give them an equal chance at winning the game of empires.

What next, whining that the Aztec faction doesn't get cannons?

'Extremely Hard' difficulty is supposed to mean something.

[Vanion]

Admin, I wanted to make a suggestion towards the new change making all 1st Rates require Victory Marks.  How about making the "Victory Permit" still purchasable with Combat Marks.  That way smaller nations and/or less successful PvP players are able to still play 1st Rates and be involved in Port Battles with the numbers needed to be successful.  Santi's and Oceans will still be Victory Marks as a higher lvl ship to strive for. 

Edited December 22, 2017 by Vanion

[Sir Texas Sir]

6 hours ago, King of Crowns said:

first rates are still obtainable. through cash and epic events. even if you don't get the victory marks. you can buy them or trade them. so it makes no difference. stop crying about a problem that doesn't exsist. every one has 4 1st rates ready to go. it would take 2 months for all those 1st rates to be sunk and there to actually be a need for victory marks. 

I have a bunch of captured L'oceans that I took off the US in port battles and since I mainly use the Vicory I plan to wait a bit and than redeem them and I bet you when folks are hurting for 1st rates I'll make a killing off them or just supply them to the clan/nation.   I mean in total I have prob about a dozen 1st rates between my two main char cause of that, so yah folks aren't hurting if they where smart. I never understood how in the past some folks would say, "We are all out of them."  No your not cause we see you grinding AI all the time in them, you just refuse to bring them out of the safe zones.

[Jean Ribault]

1 minute ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

I have a bunch of captured L'oceans that I took off the US in port battles and since I mainly use the Vicory I plan to wait a bit and than redeem them and I bet you when folks are hurting for 1st rates I'll make a killing off them or just supply them to the clan/nation.   I mean in total I have prob about a dozen 1st rates between my two main char cause of that, so yah folks aren't hurting if they where smart. I never understood how in the past some folks would say, "We are all out of them."  No your not cause we see you grinding AI all the time in them, you just refuse to bring them out of the safe zones.

When they announce a ship wipe next week, I'm going to PM you with a big grin smilie. 

But honestly, aren't you always saying that you prefer to sail the 4th and 5th rates?  I thought that was your preference.

[Red Dragon 13]

14 minutes ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

I have a bunch of captured L'oceans that I took off the US in port battles and since I mainly use the Vicory I plan to wait a bit and than redeem them and I bet you when folks are hurting for 1st rates I'll make a killing off them or just supply them to the clan/nation.   I mean in total I have prob about a dozen 1st rates between my two main char cause of that, so yah folks aren't hurting if they where smart. I never understood how in the past some folks would say, "We are all out of them."  No your not cause we see you grinding AI all the time in them, you just refuse to bring them out of the safe zones.

Just make 1st rates incapable of tagging AI and doing missions

Edited December 22, 2017 by Red Dragon 13

[Slim McSauce]

Just now, Red Dragon 13 said:

Just make 1st rates incapable of tagging AI

They pretty much are with how slow they sail, but people can still do missions in safezone for millions and millions of gold. If you want to PVE and make tons of money in your 1st rate, it should be in an epic event type mission.

[Demsity]

13 minutes ago, maturin said:

The devs didn't create the nations of Poland and Prussia (FFS) in a naval game set in the Americas to give them an equal chance at winning the game of empires.

What next, whining that the Aztec faction doesn't get cannons?

'Extremely Hard' difficulty is supposed to mean something.

As this is no longer such a big problem it dosent matter.

And it wasn't about prussia, poland or russia. It was about small nations not having a chance...

[victor]

Just now, Slim Jimmerson said:

They pretty much are with how slow they sail, but people can still do missions in safezone for millions and millions of gold. If you want to PVE and make tons of money in your 1st rate, it should be in an epic event type mission.

And of course it's you PVP players that are the only ones entitled to dictate how and where PVE player shall have their endgame content in top tier ships.

Why don't just play your game as you like and let other play theirs as they like?

It's really so difficult?

[vazco]

30 minutes ago, maturin said:

The devs didn't create the nations of Poland and Prussia (FFS) in a naval game set in the Americas to give them an equal chance at winning the game of empires.

What next, whining that the Aztec faction doesn't get cannons?

'Extremely Hard' difficulty is supposed to mean something.

What does it have to do with anything? It's not about new nations, it's about new players and nations with smaller number of players having a chance to participate in RvR and to be able to train new people. It's not only new nations. Out of politeness, I won't mention that US, Spain and Dutch have the same problem.

 

Edited: I can see Demsity beat me to the answer.

Edited December 22, 2017 by vazco

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

Well spoken. Everyone has their own style. The collection of all makes up the world.

But same rules should apply equally, especially when they share the same Caribbean world, meaning the player choices are not mechanics hence shouldn't be ruled differently.

Had a few "contractors" along the time that all they did was trading and crafting. All good, they like the "truck simulator" scene. Best out of it was that they would keep all the resources I raided in exchange for ready ships ( they would keep the overflow ). Good symbiotic play, but they didn't have "pve only flag" to protect them from pvp in a common server.

 

[GrubbyZebra]

6 hours ago, admin said:

This is probably a translation problem not a statement problem. By saying we are ok with players not liking some changes we are not ignoring them.

We know players who had very easy access to first rates will not like the attempt to make RVR matter a lot more on the PVP server (port battles are exciting part of the game). But it does not mean we don't understand this. We want to make RVR matter more and hardcore players (competition driven) may see the benefits through the initial rage. 

We suggest to wait for the final patch notes as forum discussions might not give the full picture of the changes. 

Implement a BR restriction to the player's dock if you want to limit 1st rates (which I think is a desirable goal). The victory mark implementation though unequally penalizes players in small nations and will likely only lead to a greater disparity of strength and capability.

[Sir Texas Sir]

On 12/7/2017 at 4:29 AM, admin said:

Update was deployed today 22 Dec.

• Labor hours contracts can now be bought for combat marks
• Victory marks can be bought for PvP marks to promote both RVR and PVP activites
• Prices for ship notes for PvP marks updated and generally lowered.
• Wasa and L' Hermione have been moved to PVP rewards and prices were updated
• Ability to acquire wasa on a pve server will be added next week together with the removal of permits for majority of vessels on both servers.
  • permits will remain for first rates and second rates
• Distribution of victory marks changed
  • victory marks will be given to top 3 positions on the conquest weekly leaderboard
    • 3 marks for first place
    • 2 marks for second place
    • 1 marks for third place
  • victory marks will only be given to the players who:
    • Have at least one lord protector status in at least one port by the end of the round - bringing his nation a control point or,
    • Participated in a successful port battle during the conquest round (even if the port was lost later on) - bringing his nation a battle point

With the PvP conversion I'm liking this more, but folks will have to remember they actually have to get into the PB's and fight if they want the marks.  This makes it even more clan based system.  Also all this finally is giving the PvP guys something they can use to trade with the PvE guys.  You want a 1st rate and don't do RvR than trade me this VM for that copper plating or book of one of the rings or something.  It finally gives us something to barter with. 

Though I think l'Hermione is such a nice all arounded ship it should prob stay for CM cause it's not better than other ships in it's class it's just like a jack of all traders.  Than toss in the 3rd rate as the top tier CM ship and we will see more of them used since it's so rarely use cause of so many other better ships.

@admin Question about old permits for ships that might not have them after the next patches when they are removed.  Can you have an exchange system so folks can exchange old permits for VM's or CM's that they spent to buy them. I have a lot of permits i have bought and stored up of all the ships and it would suck to loose all those CM's or VM's for what I spent on them.