Patch 14: Part 2 experimental patch increasing realism in ship behavior

[King of Crowns]

3 minutes ago, Demsity said:

And once again admin decides to not answer any important question or concern, but to answer nonsense.

@admin You have seriously angered you player base and this is one of those times where you have to do something about it and not just ignore.

I'm a happy camper. there is just to many cry babys on forums. let the devs build the game they want to. if you don't like it don't play it. 

 

Edited December 22, 2017 by King of Crowns

[admin]

18 minutes ago, Jœrnson said:

Game will be developed for new players from now on not for the existing playerbase.Just to let you know.

What are you talking about specifically? New players care about tutorial for example and don't even know about RVR. Stop pushing your agenda by making up crazy theories. Old players are a backbone for rvr and old players must start participating in it if they want access to high end content (first rates for example)

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, King of Crowns said:

I'm a happy camper. there is just to many cry babys on forums. let the devs build the game they want to. if you don't like it don't play it. 

 

Nah, this is totally bs. Some players still have a passion for this game, which was once great, and are now expressing their displeasure. Nothing wrong about this.

[admin]

16 minutes ago, Demsity said:

And once again admin decides to not answer any important question or concern, but to answer nonsense.

@admin You have seriously angered your player base and this is one of those times where you have to do something about it and not just ignore.

We have not angered all player base. Some players are angry of course. we knew the change would be unpopular (just like the merge) so merge and making rvr important had to be done once in one quick clean cut and had to be done before the new year. Since from the new year every patch will only focus on the positive. Tutorial might come at the end of december, UI, Localization and other new amazing features.

We do want rvr to matter and we KNEW it will be unpopular but we want players to organize and fight. Old players are the most disappointed but we do want old players (who are already skilled) to take start influencing and teaching their nations to fight and win, and if they are not forced to do it they will never do it.

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, admin said:

What are you talking about specifically?

I quoted your own words in my previous post which was deleted. I can't be bothered to repeat that again. You know best what you wrote about old Players and new Players.

[admin]

3 minutes ago, Jœrnson said:

I quoted your own words in my previous post which was deleted. I can't be bothered to repeat that again. You know best what you wrote about old Players and new Players.

So for example when we say we are working on the tutorial you are saying we are ignoring old players? Are you nuts?

 

 

[Demsity]

12 minutes ago, admin said:

We have not angered all player base. Some players are angry of course. But we knew the change would be unpopular (just like the merge) so merge and making rvr important had to be done once and before the new year. Since from the new year every patch will only focus on the positive. Tutorial, UI, Localization and other new amazing features.

We do want rvr to matter and we KNEW it will be unpopular but we want players to organize and fight. 

We all want the exact same thing here! Good RVR.

We are saying that we think these changes will not lead to good RVR, we have tried a system like this before and it did not work well and this new system is even worse than before!

We love this game and we are scared that the new rules regarding Victory marks will make it impossible for nations to get access to the tools necessary for RVR!

And if you want players to organize and fight, give them the proper tools to do so and not just restrict there access to vital RVR tools! Organizing is a nightmare because there are no tools in the game to do so. Correction: Little tools to do so.


Please explain in great detail how one of the smaller nations will ever win the map and get victory marks?

Edited December 22, 2017 by Demsity

[Kubrat]

So only the leading nations will be able to craft Victories and heavy rattlers now, isnt thath just entrenching their position?

I hadn't read the forums when I posted the above

Edited December 22, 2017 by Kubrat
Know better now

[RedNeckMilkMan]

6 minutes ago, admin said:

We do want rvr to matter and we KNEW it will be unpopular but we want players to organize and fight. Old players are the most disappointed but we do want old players (who are already skilled) to take start influencing and teaching their nations to fight and win, and if they are not forced to do it they will never do it.

How will the victory marks work? Will only the top nation(s) receive them and thus be able to build 1st rates? If so, how do you expect the losing side to continue to compete in RvR being outclassed by heavier ships?

[Jim Beamreach]

23 minutes ago, King of Crowns said:

I'm a happy camper. there is just to many cry babys on forums. let the devs build the game they want to. if you don't like it don't play it. 

 

I have seen the game as a new one after every patch and gave it a try.

But now it is more like restriction parts of the game to a handfull of players in the larg nations.

I dont have a Firstrate anymore i got one H-Rattler and the US-Nation as you know is not popular by players based in EU. So only thing i can hope that the few who joint the US after merge can solve the problem.

 

14 hours ago, admin said:

We are not sure about it.
But we need to force players to rvr. Old players might not like it (and its fine) new players will come on release and will consider this a given.

You need 5 people to capture 35-40% of ports on the map. 

Its fine for you if old players dont like it this is what Joernson men. Nothing agains tutorial and features that makes the game start easier for new guys.

Edited December 22, 2017 by Lucius Esox

[King of Crowns]

1 minute ago, Intrepido said:

The problem here is that participating not give them access to first rates, they need to make their nation to be in the top 3 against another 10 nations. Some of them with first rates ready to smash their inferior fleet of second rates.

first rates are still obtainable. through cash and epic events. even if you don't get the victory marks. you can buy them or trade them. so it makes no difference. stop crying about a problem that doesn't exsist. every one has 4 1st rates ready to go. it would take 2 months for all those 1st rates to be sunk and there to actually be a need for victory marks. 

[Kubrat]

1 minute ago, King of Crowns said:

first rates are still obtainable. through cash and epic events. even if you don't get the victory marks. you can buy them or trade them. so it makes no difference. stop crying about a problem that doesn't exsist. every one has 4 1st rates ready to go. it would take 2 months for all those 1st rates to be sunk and there to actually be a need for victory marks.

For people who are max rank today your words might be true (Doesn't apply to me BTW) - I have one Vic and one H Ratt), but it does not apply to people still leveling.  This might work out OK, with the BR limits as they are, maybe a group of lower rates can overpower the higher but fewer BRS. I agree with you that we should give this a go.  It is alpha, we should expect to be experimented on. 

[admin]

15 minutes ago, Lucius Esox said:

 

 

Its fine for you if old players dont like it this is what Joernson men. Nothing agains tutorial and features that makes the game start easier for new guys.

This is probably a translation problem not a statement problem. By saying we are ok with players not liking some changes we are not ignoring them.

We know players who had very easy access to first rates will not like the attempt to make RVR matter a lot more on the PVP server (port battles are exciting part of the game). But it does not mean we don't understand this. We want to make RVR matter more and hardcore players (competition driven) may see the benefits through the initial rage. 

We suggest to wait for the final patch notes as forum discussions might not give the full picture of the changes. 

[Anolytic]

4 minutes ago, admin said:

We do want rvr to matter and we KNEW it will be unpopular but we want players to organize and fight. Old players are the most disappointed but we do want old players (who are already skilled) to take start influencing and teaching their nations to fight and win, and if they are not forced to do it they will never do it.

I'm sorry, but this simply is not how you should make RvR important or how any of this works. You are taking the dynamism out of an open sandbox and forcing players into a specific pattern. This is not how you motivate players to RvR, this is how you motivate nations to roflstomp each other and to destroy each others' gameplay in order to preserve their own.

However you go about it, if you want to use Victory Marks to motivate RvR, then you need to make sure that enough of them are handed out that those who risk their ships get more than enough of them back to replace the ships that they lost. Otherwise risking ships is discouraged and only those that know already that they have an advantage and a greater chance to win will be willing to risk their ships, again giving them an even bigger advantage and guaranteeing them the win. There is no way of climbing that ladder. And if the loosing teams do not get Victory marks, then once they have risked and lost all of their ships and cannot replace them anymore, they will stop playing. They will have tried and failed and the game punishes them for being brave and take risk, and forces them to stop.

[Demsity]

2 minutes ago, King of Crowns said:

first rates are still obtainable. through cash and epic events. even if you don't get the victory marks. you can buy them or trade them. so it makes no difference. stop crying about a problem that doesn't exsist. every one has 4 1st rates ready to go. it would take 2 months for all those 1st rates to be sunk and there to actually be a need for victory marks. 

Wow, I have never seen someone contradict himself so fast!

We are thinking about the future of this game so in 2 months this will be a problem (as you claimed)
 

[Sir William Hargood]

In my opinion the Devs are heading in the right direction. I would even go one step further and limit the amount of 1st rates any one player can have at any given time (only 1?) and extend the time it takes to replace a lost 1st rate. In this way one effectively controls amount of 1st rates in game and ensures more historically relevant fleet compositions in RVR. Nerf the Wasa or make it a 3rd rate. Make mostly 3rd rates the meta for Port Battles.

Personally I would bin a fair amount of the mods too, rather making them skills that need to be learnt and maintained through constant training and practice to compensate for experienced crew losses in battle.

[King of Crowns]

18 minutes ago, RedNeckMilkMan said:

How will the victory marks work? Will only the top nation(s) receive them and thus be able to build 1st rates? If so, how do you expect the losing side to continue to compete in RvR being outclassed by heavier ships?

there are many ways to get a first rate without having to craft it yourself. 

[admin]

10 minutes ago, Graf Bernadotte said:

He thinks that the loosing nations will concentrate on shallow water ports and conquer them, while they loose the rest of their deep water ports without ships to defend them. And he thinks the old players will fix the fact that new players need some feeling of success to not quit the game, even though the new game mechanic denys them the tools to be successful against nations which control all deep water ports and get all content. Not because they are the best but because they have been the best in the very beginning.

its very easy to dethrone a top nation if you attack them from multiple sides. we want to show the way by creating a strong incentive to attack.
Current status quo is making RVR stale. No reason to attack. Whats the point attacking 5 ports at the same time for example, whats the point of picking the right time to attack (coinciding with other important battles for example). There is no incentive to participate in rvr AT ALL currently. Its all american boxing. 

keep in mind that all this experimental changes concern RVR/PVP server dedicated to promoting conflict. On the PVE Only server you can cap a first rate from an NPC.

[Demsity]

4 minutes ago, admin said:

its very easy to dethrone a top nation if you attack them from multiple sides. we want to show the way by creating a strong incentive to attack.
Current status quo is making RVR stale. No reason to attack. Whats the point attacking 5 ports at the same time for example, whats the point of picking the right time to attack (coinciding with other important battles for example). There is no incentive to participate in rvr AT ALL currently. Its all american boxing. 

keep in mind that all this changes concern RVR/PVP server dedicated to promoting conflict. On the PVE Only server you can cap a first rate from an NPC.

Lets take Prussia as an example here.

Even if all nations on the server group together and push Sweden (the current conquest leader) all the way to the bottom, Prussia would still be no where near to getting victory marks.

Lets say that GB becomes the next conquest leader and all the nations group together and push them to the bottom.

Lets say that Sweden takes some ports off GB and surpasses Prussia on the leader board again. 

Now lets say Russia is the leader...

How in the world will Prussia ever get a victory mark?

If you can explain this to me, all will be grand.

Disclaimer: No real correlation to any nations in the game and I´m not trying to be offensive to any one nation

[Knuddel]

2 minutes ago, admin said:

its very easy to dethrone a top nation if you attack them from multiple sides. we want to show the way by creating a strong incentive to attack.
Current status quo is making RVR stale. No reason to attack. Whats the point attacking 5 ports at the same time for example, whats the point of picking the right time to attack (coinciding with other important battles for example). There is no incentive to participate in rvr AT ALL currently. Its all american boxing. 

I can explain it from US side: The guys tell me they wont risk there First rds any more, caurse they cannt replace it... 

And to do a real test you should at least wait until the servermerge is done. The nations have to find together again! This needs time. Monday or tuesday servermerge and one day later that **** idear with no talking about it. one weekend to group up and 2 weeks to learn fighting together would be nice. 

US claimed hostility yesterday we where about 50 guys...  So we are motivatet to get Ports, but if you are fighting against 2 or 3 diffrent nations its not easy, at least while we dont have the playerbase like the Brits. They can do 20 Portbattles at a time. We can fight ´"Just" two... How did you think it will happen that they will get less port. 

By the way: You see a lot of PVP but its just shifting habours (Last time VIctory marks) The brits and the Danmark had an allie and say first week you get the VM next week we get it... 

For you thats great you see action at the map, but that that wehere arranged fights you dont know. 

One of a former Clan leader Tell: We cannt atack the port, or we have to give another Port to to Denmark or talk to them if they cap another town this week caurse its there time to ge a VM...

 

Bevor you open new game mechaniks you have to look for Exploieds like this. 

[King of Crowns]

@admin you should shut this argument down and tell us exactly how many first rates are in the game right now. I'm sure its in the 3000s range. it would take 3 months before players/clans actually needed a 1st rate and couldn't get one. 

[Knuddel]

No what happend (dont kno when but it already has started) will be the guys say i dont wanna lose my 1rd.

[Demsity]

5 minutes ago, King of Crowns said:

@admin you should shut this argument down and tell us exactly how many first rates are in the game right now. I'm sure its in the 3000s range. it would take 3 months before players/clans actually needed a 1st rate and couldn't get one. 

And what will happen after these 3 months? All will be fine and dandy? The problem will be solved?

No, the problem will remain.

[z4ys]

29 minutes ago, Demsity said:

Lets take Prussia as an example here.

Even if all nations on the server group together and push Sweden (the current conquest leader) all the way to the bottom, Prussia would still be no where near to getting victory marks.

Lets say that GB becomes the next conquest leader and all the nations group together and push them to the bottom.

Lets say that Sweden takes some ports off GB and surpasses Prussia on the leader board again. 

Now lets say Russia is the leader...

How in the world will Prussia ever get a victory mark?

If you can explain this to me, all will be grand.

Disclaimer: No real correlation to any nations in the game and I´m not trying to be offensive to any one nation

Maybe not next round but future ;-) and Prussia don't has to be first. 3rd is enough.

[Captain Clark]

What are you dev's thinking

Victory marks (marks received for winning the map) conversion is now only available for the PVE server

total positive feedback loop how stupid is this , make the strong people stronger. only top three nations get victory points.

you keep changing the rules when you don't have a clue.