Opinions of a Newcomer - MKII

[TheHaney]

Heyo folks!

I'm officially at 66 hours of playtime after owning the game 6 days, so even though I was fairly critical in my last post (all of which I still stand by) you can see I think there's still plenty to enjoy. I had my very first REAL PVP fleet battle yesterday evening and it was interesting/funny enough I thought I'd share, keeping nations/locations anonymous. Those involved will probably be able to figure out the who-and-where. If this breaks some kind of Naval Action etiquette then, well, sue me.

So I'm doing my thing, hunting NPC's in my pretty new Indefatigable. She's a beauty of a ship, an absolute beast: lo/wo, mediums on the sides, longs on the front and carronades in the back. Wondrous for mission running. Suddenly, a call comes out over nation! Everybody get to (Port Alpha) NOW! Bring the biggest ship you have. MOVE!

"Well," I think. "I've got this shiny new frigate, it's the biggest ship I've got, let's see what we can do." So I rally up in nation chat, and the following is an ultra-condensed synopsis of the ensuing chaos:

 

Added to battlegroup!

Told by who seemed to be commanding to get to (Port Alpha) at full speed, no delay.

Explain that I have a frig with mediums. Told that's fine, get there now.

Told by a seperate person (who was also giving orders to everyone) that's NOT fine, don't come.

Told by a third person (who was also giving orders to everyone) DEFINITELY COME but stop and get longs. I decide to just go there as-is because there are no longs at my port and I didn't expect to see any en route.

 

Halfway to (Port Alpha) we are told by (Commander Alpha) to group up outside of an ongoing hostility battle but not to join.

Shortly after we are told by (Commander Beta) to belay that and group up outside of (Port Bravo) which is conveniently next to the original target, (Port Alpha).

Over the next 45 minutes, a large number of players from three nations are told repeatedly by multiple people to sail to the battle, stay at (Port Beta), sail to the battle, and so on. Much back-and-forth. Everybody is incredibly confused, sailing in veritable circles.

Eventually some level of consensus is achieved, and we all group up outside of the Hostility mission at (Port Alpha). There we sit. 20 minutes go by. The hostility mission ends, the enemy starts to pop out, and the order is given to immediately sail the other way because they're way too powerful for us even though we knew the entire time exactly what their fleet composition was.

Over the next 20 minutes a cat-and-mouse baiting game ensues, with both sides trying desperately to catch the enemy in some type of cheesy split. Both sides have massive commitment issues and neither side is willing to actually buck up, ball up and go for it.

Eventually enough buffoonery occurs and we join a relatively even battle... the following orders detailed are given by multiple people without correction or rebuke from other commanders. Commands are given in Teamspeak and in Battle chat.

Told to get in a line and sail on a heading, which happens to be directly towards an island.

Yelled at for being in the line in a frigate, taking up a valuable lineship space. I move to the clear side.

Yelled at for being on the clear side, I move to the combat side.

Yelled at for being on the combat side blocking shots, I move back into the line.

One of the lineships (who is way out in the combat side, not in line) suddenly cuts hard across the line with no warning or orders, after taking no damage. A total of 4 ships(2 3rd rates and 2 frigs), myself included, slam into him and break our bow sails despite desperate maneuvering. The next several minutes is spent trying to disengage from the cluster we are now locked in. Much screaming from the affected. The lineship never changes course, dragging all 4 of us several hundred meters outside the line. The commanders decline comment.

Having run out of room after reaching the island, many of us turn to sail alongside it. Yelled at for not maintaining a heading.

(Commander Alpha) demands immediate push towards enemy lineship that is demasted. Several of our ships break out of line and pursue. Over the next several minutes they are killed.

(Commander Beta) demands we maintain the line. We are now caught between the enemy, an island, and an island fort which promptly starts to vomit iron into our flank.

The next 15 minutes are a cacophony of conflicting orders from multiple people. More ships are destroyed. Several calls for retreat are countered with calls to push.

Eventually, (Commander Beta) demands immediate disengagement. No dissenting voices. About half the fleet turns to best point of sail for escape.

Several minutes later (Commander Alpha) demands all frigates turn back and "sacrifice themselves" to save the lineships that had ignored the first order and pushed far out of line into the enemy formation.

Half the fleet exits the battle. At this point I'm well over a kilometer away from the enemy (and the lineships that ignored the initial disengagement order). I choose to exit.

Sent PM's by several people, ranging from disgust that I left to sharing resentment about the battle.

On the way back up to friendly territory, a call comes out over nation chat - someone is being attacked! Their location is about 15 degrees off our heading to the nearest friendly port. Myself and a mate break off to assist.

Despite multiple requests, no other ship in the clans we had just assisted answers the call. The mate is killed. The enemy escapes.

Quietly amused at the entire 3-hour debacle, I resume mission running.

 

So, the end result is that I learned a lot, had a jolly good time, and I can't wait to get deeper into the game because there is very much a need for stronger leadership! I look forward to my eventual command.

Edited November 18, 2017 by TheHaney

[JobaSet]

You just learned a lesson that the people in this game refuse to learn.  Most of the people in this game don't know what they are talking about.  I would suggest that you find 5 or 6 people that play at same time and only play with them as a group.  Learn from what works and what fails.  Do what works for your group as a group. Don't attack a group of 25 with 6 is a good start.   On avg a good group is going to get destroyed about 25-30 times (all ships lost) in pvp before they instinctively knows what to do when certain things happen. (Most players can't deal with loss and don't learn from it, and/or blame others). 2nd Piece of advice I can give you is never follow commands of the guy in a basic cutter that is shadowing that fleet. IF you have 5 or 6 and they have around same br as you.  Attack them win or or not you will gain more knowledge.  I have seen well organized groups of 15 easily take out larger groups of 25 with much higher BR.  You can be the best pvp'er in this game with 5 others that are the best, it really not matter if your group is not effective at sinking ships as a group.  This game is learned from defeat not by having the best players in the game in your group.  Running is not even defeat as you learned nothing from it.  

Edited November 18, 2017 by JobaSet

[IndianaGeoff]

Big, adhoc, multiclan, multinational fights are brilliantly executed plans when you win and complete unorganized clusters when you lose.

But they are fun.

Last night had the US fighting when it should have withdrawn.  Unless the Pirates made a huge mistake, we were beat if we fought.  They did not screw up, we decided to fight and got beat.

As a person who followed orders to sacrifice at the end to help get the big ships out, I'd do it again in a heart beat.  I'll remake that ship, position a bigger ship in the area and would do it all over again.

Just have a thick skin.  Believe it or not, winning fights have about the same amount of chaos until the enemy is beat if it is a reasonably balanced fight.

Edited November 18, 2017 by IndianaGeoff

[Jarlath Morrow]

I wasn't there, but I see you were part of the battle shown here: 

 

Nice accounting of what was certainly a hectic play session. I certainly don't remember my first big engagements as well as this (but I wish I did).

Overall a well-written forum post. =)

5 hours ago, TheHaney said:

Told by who seemed to be commanding to get to (Port Alpha) at full speed, no delay.

Explain that I have a frig with mediums. Told that's fine, get there now.

Told by a seperate person (who was also giving orders to everyone) that's NOT fine, don't come.

Told by a third person (who was also giving orders to everyone) DEFINITELY COME but stop and get longs.

I can definitely relate to this part.

5 hours ago, TheHaney said:

So, the end result is that I learned a lot, had a jolly good time, and I can't wait to get deeper into the game because there is very much a need for stronger leadership! I look forward to my eventual command.

Honestly, you have a good attitude!

 

[TheHaney]

1 hour ago, Jarlath Morrow said:

Nice accounting of what was certainly a hectic play session. I certainly don't remember my first big engagements as well as this (but I wish I did).

Thanks

Back in the day I was a FleetOps combat instructor for EVE University in EVE Online, so keeping track of battle events became kinda my thing. Thankfully these are much smaller-scale battles, but what I find fascinating about this game is how during an engagement you can make a mistake and have time to think "wow, this is going to go horribly wrong in 30 seconds." Really gives an opportunity for on-the-fly learning when there's no possibility for insta-gibbing. 

(And in EVE University terms, last night was a surprisingly lucid example of "always make sure one person is in charge.")

Edited November 18, 2017 by TheHaney

[Tenet]

Welcome to the game. I recommend switching Pirate right away. You will keep your sanity and enjoy the game a lot more. 

[Teutonic]

@TheHaney

Is it bad that i can tell exactly who you are talking about just based on what these folks have said in your account? 

Anyway, hope the "commanders" didn't put a sour taste to your stomach for playing this game. In situations like those if there is more than one commander I just decide not to join, not worth the headache.

Your Eve Uni experience may come in handy here! Welcome fellow eve player :).

[TheHaney]

10 hours ago, Tenet said:

Welcome to the game. I recommend switching Pirate right away. You will keep your sanity and enjoy the game a lot more. 

Maybe eventually. For now I enjoy missioning and generally boring trade routes, which my faction seems to excel in. Once I'm deeper into the game, with more successful PvP under my belt, I may consider a more active faction. It's also highly dependent on what future patches and of course Naval Action: Legends does to the population. Most recently I was playing Warframe for several hundred hours (where waiting longer than 30 seconds for a match is unheard of) so I'm still forcing myself to get used to an MMO with less than a thousand players.