Server Merge Proposal

[Iroquois Confederacy]

     I have long thought about the status of the Global Server, and, I believe it is past time to merge the two servers back together. This will be met with great consternation on all fronts, however, allow me to elaborate why I think it needs to be done:

     1.  The Global server constantly struggles to maintain numbers in comparison to the European Server.
     2.  Due to the nature of moderators (unbiased individuals), they seek the best play environment, which tends to be the one with the most players. As such, the Global server suffers from a lack of moderation. (This does not seem easily solved by adding moderators to Global, as those who stay there out of stubbornness exhibit the same bias that is best avoided.)
     3.  Due to the smaller player base, and the lack of moderation, new players that join the Global server experience a lower quality of playing. There are fewer people to help teach these individuals the ropes, and the chat channels are demonstrably more toxic due to lack of moderation. Many of these individuals suffer from this, and, I would imagine, depart.
     4.  The community is constantly at odds with each other even in the goals of developing the game, because of the tribalism inherent in two different servers. People playing together can become part of the same tribe: Those who want the best for Naval Action (as opposed to the two tribes we see currently – those who want the best for the Global Server and those who want the best for the European server).

     How to accomplish this? One of the biggest complaints in the past was the dreaded “night flips.” Essentially, people would come in to a region during somebody else's downtime, and take a port, no defense in sight. We actually had a solution once – players could set the port defense time to a two hour window.

     However, this too was seen as an issue. People would set this two hour window for a time when their opponent could not attack, as opposed to a time that they could defend. This caused issues when people did in fact attack during that time.

     Now, we have a window on the European server that is, if memory serves, six hours long. We have clans in charge of ports. This seems like something that is easily applied:

     Have the clan in charge of a port set a four or six hour window that the port can be attacked. If it is flipped during their down time, it is their own fault for setting the port at those hours. The larger window makes it more difficult to make a “defensive” port timer, when other people are unable to attack.
The code should still exist, and be easily modified for clans to set the timers, reducing development time impact.

     There is, of course, another question: What to do about players during the merge? I see four options, none, I think, are ideal:

     1.  Server wipe on both sides, so everyone starts with a clean slate.
     2.  Attempt to trawl through everyone's goods and skills and ship XP to create redeemables for these things. (I believe the development time to implement this, and the development time to rectify those who did not, for whatever reason, get their redeemables, makes this a bad option.)
     3.  Merge the players over, and just say, “I am sorry, but, you're going to lose your ship XP and your skill books and your ships.”
     4.  A partial wipe, where everyone's ships, ship knowledge, skill books, and physical goods (anything in storage) are removed.

     I think none of them would be met with any fanfare. I think the third option would be best, honestly, as I believe Global players are more willing to sacrifice things that can be re-earned for a single, unified server.

     The server merge will have to happen eventually regardless. Eventually, one server will not have enough population to sustain it. Why bleed players in the interim, when we can have a stronger server now, with a better environment for all?

     There are those on the European server who do not wish the Global Players to come over. Under these proposals, with protected windows in place set by clans, I can only assume those against these players coming over would rather that these individuals did not play at all. There is no place for such an attitude within this community.

     Those on the Global Server who are unwilling to sacrifice their goods for a single, unified server, I can only say – those goods will be without worth regardless, when the server has to shut down – be it months or years from now. Without people to sail against, all the skill books in the world are without value. It is best to resolve this issue sooner, rather than later.

[monk33y]

I still think all the gulf of Mexico and all of hatii to 24hr attack windows was the best idea for one server we've ever had.

[Grundgemunkey]

15 minutes ago, Intrepido said:

Whats the difference between having 2 hours for pb timers that 4?

The US based nations set the port battle timers at the midd of the europpean nights and no EU clan will dare to attack them.

The EU based nations set the port battle timers when the US are working or sleeping so no US clan could attack.

More important, giving that option just will make that even EU based nations will set the PB timers at bad hours just to piss off other EU nations. 

So the rvr will end ruined for everyone, no matter the region you are in.

 

You are worried about toxicity, but that change you are proposing will make the sea less salty than global chat and national news forum.

 

while i agree...we have tested  one server 24hr port battles .. we have tested split server limited port battles  .... why not test a hybrid

i would hope that a hybrid will enable players from around the world to play for any nation they choose ... it would be great to see traditional eu player only nations  such as spain and france have players in US / asian time zones playing for them ...

the US has more spanish speaking residents than spain does

Edited November 16, 2017 by Grundgemunkey

[Liq]

So EU based clans would set the timers to something like 17.00 - 23.00 current server time (and NA based clans vice versa). Wouldnt change much i think.

Unless we get a distribution of both time zones players to all nations I dont see any solution work.

Edited November 16, 2017 by Liq

[Iroquois Confederacy]

Largely, what I am reading is that some players are unable to simply play the game and not be schmucks.  If times had to be hard coded for factions, that would resolve the issue.  However, this idea of "throw up our hands and never solve the server split" smacks of simple hatred between communities.  This is toxic to the game's longevity.

The servers have to merge.  Tomorrow, a year from now.  It is better to merge them when we can leverage the player numbers into a growing server, instead of merging them as a last ditch effort to shore up faltering player numbers as both servers steadily atrophy.

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

7 minutes ago, rediii said:

which would take longer than a day. 

Interesting approach... hmmm...

( looks back to Leonard Nimoy station in ED... )

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

I am over with timers and linear hostility  I made my peace. So no, I do not agree with you. Those factors do not exist anymore in the way I look to a future merged conquest.

Carry on Captain. One of these days a solution will be found.

 

[Grundgemunkey]

 

one server map split into 3 port battle time zones .... each nation has capital in  each timezone ... each time zone has  same resources allocated

benefits we all get to play same server .. if you only want to play one time zone it condenses map so sailing times reduced will increase pvp and rvr opprortunities

if you want to play at different times during week or at a weekend you can

obviously this is a crude map and will need to be refined so similiar amounts of ports in each time zone

players can still use whole of map for trading pvp or pve .. timezones only affect rvr

Edited November 16, 2017 by Grundgemunkey

[z4ys]

I would say every clan has to set a pb window in this window the hole clan is allowed attack or defend ports. This way setting timers to off times would exclude the clan form participating in RvR. Clans with overlapping windows can attack each other. You can only change pb window once in a month (4 example).

To avoid that one clan sets ridiculous pb times to avoid pb capture only clan alliances between overlapping pb windows are allowed.

Hostility can gained 24/7 - pb is  placedlike now but regarding the overlapping pb window.

Edited November 16, 2017 by z4ys

[Christendom]

Somehow the lord protector system with timers managed to kinda work and the server populations were the highest they had been....ever.  Yea the flag system was abused and it sucked, but the timers managed the populations well enough. 

A couple facts need to really be expressed within the community.  You're not going to be on for every single attack/battle that happens in the game and the map is big enough for everyone.

What needs to be done?  Merge the servers and bring back a 4-6 hour time window.  Split the map up into a couple different time zone regions that make those clusters of ports unlock at those times.  for example US timers will be US prime time, GB/Spain area will be western EU time, Further down the antilles will be more of eastern EU time (only an example).  If clan A from the US wants to sail down to Puerto Rico and take Swede port from Clan B, they have to do it at clan b's time.  If Clan A wins they keep the port, but since it is in a different region their port maintenance will be X amount higher if they want to keep that port and change it to US time.  Taking ports a long distance from your capital should be expensive IMO.  Make Haiti and parts of the gulf 24hr battle timers that do not have increased maintenance.  Boom, game solved.

I'd also like to assuage your fears rediii that a combined GB/US clan will resurface and displace you and HRE as kings of the server.  It won't.  Most of the americans quit a long time ago with our exile to Oz (global) and the ones that do remain on global.....maybe you'll just have to entice some to join your clan.       

Anyway, the map is big enough to fit everyone into it.  People just need to be more flexible.  It's a game, ports don't matter.  Stop being jerks

[z4ys]

1 minute ago, Grundgemunkey said:

 

Why we have this huge awesome map when we break it down to this tiny pieces? Its not an option for me.

[Grundgemunkey]

1 minute ago, z4ys said:

Why we have this huge awesome map when we break it down to this tiny pieces? Its not an option for me.

its only broken down for rvr and   port battle timers

Edited November 16, 2017 by Grundgemunkey

[z4ys]

Just now, Grundgemunkey said:

its only broken down for rvr ...

yeah but people would stay in their places. At the moment you can be everywhere and always find someone no matter of time. With timezones maps nobody would be in mexican gulf when its not the right time.

[Grundgemunkey]

Just now, z4ys said:

yeah but people would stay in their places. At the moment you can be everywhere and always find someone no matter of time. With timezones maps nobody would be in mexican gulf when its not the right time.

thats like saying no one plays the game now on eu outside the current port battle window

people will still pve pvp and trade in those regions outside the port battle windows ..as they do now ...

[z4ys]

1 minute ago, Grundgemunkey said:

thats like saying no one plays the game now on eu outside the current port battle window

people will still pve pvp and trade in those regions outside the port battle windows ..as they do now ...

nobody is really playing outside the window When i go to gustavia there is nobody after 2am same will happen with timezone maps only that effect will be much stronger

Edited November 16, 2017 by z4ys

[IndianaGeoff]

8 minutes ago, Grundgemunkey said:

 

one server map split into 3 port battle time zones .... each nation has capital in  each timezone ... each time zone has  same resources allocated

benefits we all get to play same server .. if you only want to play one time zone it condenses map so sailing times reduced will increase pvp and rvr opprortunities

if you want to play at different times during week or at a weekend you can

obviously this is a crude map and will need to be refined so similiar amounts of ports in each time zone

players can still use whole of map for trading pvp or pve .. timezones only affect rvr

That one of the better solutions I have seen.

But I oppose the merge.  The game needs to go to release, be marketed and have 3 servers, one for each major time zone and each server have hundreds of players.  That is the only scenario where the game survives.  If we merge, we admit defeat for the game.
 

But what I would really like to see is enough players to support a map where your lines are drawn over the entire world.  You fight in your own area of the world.  But we need player numbers in the thousands for that.

[Grundgemunkey]

6 minutes ago, z4ys said:

nobody is really playing outside the window When i go to gustavia there is nobody after 2am same will happen with timezone maps

really there are 270 players online in eu now ... the  eu port battle time window isnt open now

if you want to play at 2 am you sail in the us time zone from your nations capital in that zone ,,, you will find someone there ... you dont see people at gustavia now at 2am because those that play at that time are on global server

Edited November 16, 2017 by Grundgemunkey

[z4ys]

4 minutes ago, Grundgemunkey said:

really there are 270 players online in eu now ... the  eu port battle time window isnt open now

if you want to play at 2 am you sail in the us time zone from your nations capital in that zone ,,, you will find someone there ... you dont see people at gustavia now at 2am because those that play at that time are on global server

Why force people to stay in a certain area. At the moment all places are valid. With timezone frames only a certain part of the map is valid.

[Grundgemunkey]

9 minutes ago, IndianaGeoff said:

That one of the better solutions I have seen.

But I oppose the merge.  The game needs to go to release, be marketed and have 3 servers, one for each major time zone and each server have hundreds of players.  That is the only scenario where the game survives.  If we merge, we admit defeat for the game.
 

But what I would really like to see is enough players to support a map where your lines are drawn over the entire world.  You fight in your own area of the world.  But we need player numbers in the thousands for that.

I would imagine apart from the reallocation of resources its an easy fix for devs they only have to allocate at port battle window for each port

[Grundgemunkey]

4 minutes ago, z4ys said:

Why force people to stay in a certain area. At the moment all places are valid. With timezone frames only a certain part of the map is valid.

i dont think you understand the concept .... you can sail anywhere on the map at any time ... you can only RVR in those zones at those times .... on eu we are restricted to 1700- 2200 anyway

so whats the difference ?

if you are able to play say from 2200  - 0200 you can in effect rvr in 2 time zones  not just a 2 hour window

having capitals for each nation in each time zone ,, will allow players to play for different nations ... ie US nation may get eu olayers playing for them in eu time

and spain may have us players playing for them in us timezone

Edited November 16, 2017 by Grundgemunkey

[Christendom]

13 minutes ago, rediii said:

Your argument that US players will not take hostage the EU server is invalid too btw. or are you thinking US population will not grow again? Pretty negative oppinion you have  there.

Some will come back, but not in the numbers you think we will.  Unfortunately I think the bridge is burned with most US players, especially on global (pvp2).  They've been neglected for too long I think.  I know some won't ever touch the game again after having their clans basically split up by the EU/Global thing.  Or clans could just adopt REDS method and invite everyone to join.  We've got about 5-6 different languages going on in the clan (+whatever language Furq speaks...).  It works.    

I personally liked the flag system, so I'd be ok with it.  Point I'm trying to make is the map is large enough for the entire population of the game.  There's ways to make it work.  

[z4ys]

4 minutes ago, Grundgemunkey said:

i dont think you understand the concept .... you can sail anywhere on the map at any time ... you can only RVR in those zones at those times .... on eu we are restricted to 1700- 2200 anyway

so whats the difference ?

I think you dont get me. People stay there where they have their ports. So you will focus all players to certain areas. so only parts of the map are valid at a certain time. It would be the same if we make 3 different servers with just a part of the map. You do nothing else as to force people to a certain area on a certain time. Thats wrong and against the concept of the awesome huge map where regarding of time everything can happen.

Edited November 16, 2017 by z4ys

[George Washington]

8 minutes ago, Christendom said:

Some will come back, but not in the numbers you think we will.  Unfortunately I think the bridge is burned with most US players, especially on global (pvp2).  They've been neglected for too long I think.  I know some won't ever touch the game again after having their clans basically split up by the EU/Global thing.  Or clans could just adopt REDS method and invite everyone to join.  We've got about 5-6 different languages going on in the clan (+whatever language Furq speaks...).  It works.    

I personally liked the flag system, so I'd be ok with it.  Point I'm trying to make is the map is large enough for the entire population of the game.  There's ways to make it work.  

Devs did not even mention a word about server merge or any plans to develop a system that would work for both time zones. Numbers dropped again and I do not have many hopes for any bright future here. I do agree that many who left will never come back again. Honestly there is nothing new here anyway. I tested many features and 90% of them out of balance. For example marks and mods. We have tons of unfinished work here and it's not moving anywhere. 

They will release half broken product with last wave of players leaving couple months after release. 

Edited November 16, 2017 by George Washington

[Grundgemunkey]

4 minutes ago, z4ys said:

I think you dont get me. People stay there where they have their ports. So you will focus all players to certain areas. so only parts of the map are valid to a certain time. It would be the same if we make 3 different servers with just a part of the map. You do nothing else as to force people to a certain area on a certain time. Thats wrong and against the concept of the awesome huge map where regarding of time everything can happen.

forget the current and traditional home waters of nations we currently have ... each nation will have a uncappable  capital in each time zone

if you just slice the map up with currently owned ports yeah it wont work

Edited November 16, 2017 by Grundgemunkey

[Vernon Merrill]

10 minutes ago, Grundgemunkey said:

really there are 270 players online in eu now ... the  eu port battle time window isnt open now

if you want to play at 2 am you sail in the us time zone from your nations capital in that zone ,,, you will find someone there ... you dont see people at gustavia now at 2am because those that play at that time are on global server

My playtime is usually 7-10 PM EST US.  I watch the EU server numbers drop from 500 to ~90 during that time....   

Yesterday I sailed from Aves to Fort Royal, up to Gustavia, over to Christianstad and back to Aves.  

I saw ONE French Indiaman that was just outside his huge "Safety Zone".  He immediately turned and ran back into the zone away from my Prince...lol

THAT was MY gaming experience.  

God forbid you guys cant be on for EVERY port battle.