Upgrades and speed meta

[Captain Lust]

Currently for sale in MT on the PvP EU Server: Crooked Hull Refit 1.4 mil, Bovenwinds Refit 975k and copper plating 1.2 mil... Now tell a casual player that actually knows about the speed meta that he should get 1-2 of these and risk losing them with his ship in serious pvp ( no gank circlejerks ) for less reward than pve ( additional time that it takes to get a pvp fight without the repair and upgrade loot from bots ). But yeah nice patch... pads on the back all around... #longlivethe15knotcapspeedmeta

[Rychu Karas]

Lack of demanded resources, only RNG drop modules... this is how pvp focused NA looks like.

This is a joke... who and why designed this fakin BS?

[balticsailor]

Yeah, ever since the dev introduced the first upgrades we get this very OP upgrades/ refits/ skills and combinations. They nerv then most OP once now and then, but sofar we have yet to see reasonable balanced upgrades.

[Archaos]

This is always going to be the problem with rare and RNG drop items. Couple this with the fact that you only get the RNG drops from PvE and you get a game that is more PvE focused. The effect is twofold as it first encourages PvE to get the drops and then discourages PvP because your ship becomes to valuable to risk unless you are sure to win.

Makes me sad now that I got 2 copper plating drops in quick succession when I first started after wipe and I thought they were regular drops so I installed them on trader brigs. Havent seen one drop since .

[AlteSocken]

3 minutes ago, Archaos said:

the drops and then discourages PvP because your ship becomes to valuable to risk unless you are sure to win.

Thats the reason why I dont use any permanent upgrades at all ... just too scared

[Captain Lust]

2 minutes ago, Archaos said:

Makes me sad now that I got 2 copper plating drops in quick succession when I first started after wipe and I thought they were regular drops so I installed them on trader brigs. Havent seen one drop since .

I'm fairly sure they cut down the droprate, because i too got 3 copper platings after the wipe and then never again and i heard the same from others ( someone even told me he put it on basic cutter *cringe* ) I guess lower droprate for even more pve grind equals more fun™. Or were people too satisfied / not pissed enough?

[Archaos]

1 minute ago, Captain Lust said:

I'm fairly sure they cut down the droprate, because i too got 3 copper platings after the wipe and then never again and i heard the same from others ( someone even told me he put it on basic cutter *cringe* ) I guess lower droprate for even more pve grind equals more fun™. Or were people too satisfied / not pissed enough?

I think they put the grind in to increase the longevity of the game rather than have to develop content. Problem is people just get burned out from the PvE  grind and end up quitting. The PvE grind may be okay when you are levelling up or even to a certain extent when you are unlocking slots on a ship, but once you are max rank and have max slots unlocked the grind is just to get RNG drops and that becomes soul destroying especially with the low drop rates.

[Rychu Karas]

Guys, don't worry

UNITY 5...

quite soon, stay optimistic Q1 2018?

[Guest]

4 hours ago, Otto Kohl said:

MT market is super overpriced. I bought 40 crooked cedar past 2 days for price 26-45k each.

But i do agree that PvP rewards are still shit .

Yeah and thats like the entire supply. So if you didn't make crooked hull refits and sell them for a reasonable price..who will?

[Hodo]

And again another reasons why I have started to move away from playing this game.

The meta builds are becoming too common and everyone is getting bored or scared.   Finding decent trade ships to jump is becoming harder and harder.    And most people just sail with massive AI ships in fleet to protect them, or place the trade ship with all the goods on it and magically teleport it to safety as soon as they can in a fight.  

 

[Archaos]

6 minutes ago, Hodo said:

And again another reasons why I have started to move away from playing this game.

The meta builds are becoming too common and everyone is getting bored or scared.   Finding decent trade ships to jump is becoming harder and harder.    And most people just sail with massive AI ships in fleet to protect them, or place the trade ship with all the goods on it and magically teleport it to safety as soon as they can in a fight.  

 

The biggest problem with trade at the moment is that it is hard to find good trade routes that are not already monopolized by big clans and alts. I have tried taking delivery orders to test if they are a valid play style but there are very few worthwhile orders I can fill without going to several ports to fill the order and then I have to sail for about another hour to deliver. I use the in game and external tools to try and find where the goods are but they are out of date within minutes after maintenance.

Even if you did jump me you would probably only find a part filled hold of some low margin trade good which would probably not be worth your while hauling out of there. The cat and mouse game between traders and raiders only works if both sides can make profit, i.e. the trader has to have a reasonable chance to make good profit if he succeeds and that way he is willing to take the risk. As the profit margins fall the risk becomes too great and it becomes easier grinding PvE missions to make money, and as the traders disappear from OW the life of a raider becomes leaner.

[Hodo]

2 minutes ago, Archaos said:

The biggest problem with trade at the moment is that it is hard to find good trade routes that are not already monopolized by big clans and alts. I have tried taking delivery orders to test if they are a valid play style but there are very few worthwhile orders I can fill without going to several ports to fill the order and then I have to sail for about another hour to deliver. I use the in game and external tools to try and find where the goods are but they are out of date within minutes after maintenance.

Even if you did jump me you would probably only find a part filled hold of some low margin trade good which would probably not be worth your while hauling out of there. The cat and mouse game between traders and raiders only works if both sides can make profit, i.e. the trader has to have a reasonable chance to make good profit if he succeeds and that way he is willing to take the risk. As the profit margins fall the risk becomes too great and it becomes easier grinding PvE missions to make money, and as the traders disappear from OW the life of a raider becomes leaner.

Oh I know... My best captures were early after the wipe when people were hauling things worth something.   But now I am lucky to get anything for even the ship itself.  

[Guest]

For me copper platings always dropped when doing missions ins low level ships of class 7 or 6. Never got one in bigger ships. But that could also just be RNG ofc.

[Hodo]

Just now, Jœrnson said:

For me copper platings always dropped when doing missions ins low level ships of class 7 or 6. Never got one in bigger ships. But that could also just be RNG ofc.

I have run perhaps a few hundred 6th rate missions in a snow, and never got copper plating.  

I got my 1 copper plating from a NPC trade ships escort Privateer a few days after wipe. 

[Vernon Merrill]

As I discussed with Pagan Pete last night, the historical top-speed (or something close) should be the speed-cap with bonuses, and they should work DOWN from there...  Instead they work UP from there and its created a borked-up open world...  Hell, even in early summer of last year, ships made sense and had individual uses....  Now, why sail a Frigate when the Bellona matches its sailing profile?

 

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

That's what has been suggested by most of the less gaming more challenging historical values crowd.

Rock top historical values equal captain's knowledge and modifications made on ship.

Work down from there.

For a flat change I would reduce all present %% values to half and below.

[Batman]

Don't like the 15kn meta. if you don't have a 15kn ship, there is no reason to go out and do PvP atm. And why go out in a Surprise when you can build a Bellona or Bucentaure who can now reach the same speed but are still much more sturdier than a surprise will ever be and have a much heavier broadside.

[AlteSocken]

3 minutes ago, The Red Duke said:

For a flat change I would reduce all present %% values to half and below.

I guess a cap on how much percent can be added would do better as hot-fix.

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

3 minutes ago, AlteSocken said:

I guess a cap on how much percent can be added would do better as hot-fix.

Yes, also a good one.

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

5 minutes ago, Batman said:

Don't like the 15kn meta. if you don't have a 15kn ship, there is no reason to go out and do PvP atm. And why go out in a Surprise when you can build a Bellona or Bucentaure who can now reach the same speed but are still much more sturdier than a surprise will ever be and have a much heavier broadside.

Is that a reason or a excuse not to PvP ? Because there's a lot of build out there, not all of them speed, doing PvP. And the majority isn't in Bellonas or 4th rates.

[Wigermo]

On 2017-04-06 at 1:30 AM, admin said:

 

• Removal of current upgrade system and ship quality level
  • We were not satisfied with the fact that upgrades were worth more than ships themselves.

 

[Hodo]

33 minutes ago, Wigermo said:

 

Yep.. that worked.  LOL

[Mrdoomed]

2 hours ago, Hodo said:

And again another reasons why I have started to move away from playing this game.

The meta builds are becoming too common and everyone is getting bored or scared.   Finding decent trade ships to jump is becoming harder and harder.    And most people just sail with massive AI ships in fleet to protect them, or place the trade ship with all the goods on it and magically teleport it to safety as soon as they can in a fight.  

 

And now you sound exactly like me...oh how the wurm turns

[Hodo]

27 minutes ago, Mrdoomed said:

And now you sound exactly like me...oh how the wurm turns

I never said you were wrong... This patch had so much potential.  

[Wigermo]

Remove all speed mods or just make them influence acceleration/deceleration and counter hold weight and/or speed negatives from other mods.

 

Or cap every individual ships speed to historical or whatever you think is "balanced". But then comes the threads about no one being able to escape or chase anything.

 

Or just learn to be content pvping in ships with gazelle head+whatever you have in hold. Seems to be no middle ground here as to most people 15 knots is the only acceptable thing to go out with, but risking millions in upgrades is apparently not.