Make Pirates Pirates(yes again sorry)

[CaptVonGunn]

This includes ideas from several people and are not all mine... These are just ideas to make Pirates NOT a Nation...

 

   1) Pirates can make their home base in any Free Town or in MT...

   2) They can build resource buildings in any outpost...(some have suggested Pirates should be allowed to build Resource buildings Anywhere but at 2x the cost I think if this was done maybe 4x the cost.. organized crime isn't cheap)

   3) they can TP between any outpost.. 

 4) they can NOT have any ship larger then a 4th rate any place by MT if the captain is not there.. ie they can dock a 1st rate they captured at a Free Town..but they can not leave it there. 

  5) They do not control regions.. they Raid and hunt....

   6) They can help nations with PBs.. by joining any other nations group as extra ships for them on a battle by battle basis 

   7) They can NEVER build a Shipyard bigger then Level 2.

     

  let the commenting begin....

  

[Jones el Tuerto]

1 agree also kidd's island

2 not a bad idea, but pirates were more thieves than builders

3 I'd like to see that but some people doesn't want to have a pirate outpost ganking every day near their capital

4 Well we should be able to own the ship we steal and that's it i guess

5 totally agree

6 Love this idea 

7 not a bad idea

We should have another game mechanics we shouldn't be a nation at all just thieves sailing around the caribbean but since the game it seems likes the realistic things when it's good for some people and when it's not those realistic things don't work... well... A lot of things should change people is making post about them every day not gonna repeat all of them but we are seeing how every week every day we have less players i hope this change but we all know who have the power to change things.

 

 

[CaptVonGunn]

See I think Kidds should be removed.. The entire island is a Fantasy... 

[Sir Lancelot Holland]

6 hours ago, CaptVonGunn said:

This includes ideas from several people and are not all mine... These are just ideas to make Pirates NOT a Nation...

 

   1) Pirates can make their home base in any Free Town or in MT...

   2) They can build resource buildings in any outpost...(some have suggested Pirates should be allowed to build Resource buildings Anywhere but at 2x the cost I think if this was done maybe 4x the cost.. organized crime isn't cheap)

   3) they can TP between any outpost.. 

 4) they can NOT have any ship larger then a 4th rate any place by MT if the captain is not there.. ie they can dock a 1st rate they captured at a Free Town..but they can not leave it there. 

  5) They do not control regions.. they Raid and hunt....

   6) They can help nations with PBs.. by joining any other nations group as extra ships for them on a battle by battle basis 

   7) They can NEVER build a Shipyard bigger then Level 2.

     

  let the commenting begin....

  

1 Pirates were renowned for operating out of small bays, inlets, coves and even small ports of which Kidd's Island is a token reflection of that fact. Such places were often temporary and were moved if discovered.

2 To reflect the Pirates semi-nomadic lifestyle I think they should be able to use any port with the exception of Capital regions as a base, because they may be forced to move at short notice due to increased Naval activity perhaps the normal costs of changing ports should be removed especially if it will cost them more to set up buildings and facilities. After all what self respecting Pirate would pay 'port duties' anyway?

3 If Pirates can cheaply set up almost anywhere they would have some degree of local influence, this they currently have, you only need to see the amount of influence they hold over the US Eastern seaboard on PVP Global to understand that, Pirates lives were hard and they had an influence far greater than their numbers suggested, they do not need the additional influence provided by teleporting.   

4 They should not be able to own and operate ships above 4th rate, if they can cap one and sell it off fair play to them. They should though, I think, they be able to over crew and over gun their ships as they did, but the poorer standard of maintenance of ships should also be reflected.

5 Owning regions would be a handicap to their way of life, they depended on appearing and disappearing at will, only for brief periods did they hold any specific areas like Kingston, small areas of Haiti and Bermuda, and then only until National Navy's could spare sufficient resources from the wars that dominated the Eastern Atlantic and Mediterranean sea, rarely involving the Caribbean and Eastern seaboard of the Continental US.

6 Many Pirates originally operated under letters of marque, some were former military Captains and some would of, if permitted by reason of pardon, assist navy's in small actions then return to a life of Piracy. I do not see that this is unreasonable.

7 If they are forbidden the use of 1st through 3rd rates then there is no requirement for them to have level 3 shipyards at all, level 2 shipyards would suffice for their needs.  

[Luc]

I Quote my ein post from october or sth like that

 

i mentioned in the dev patch thread the following idea.....

 

"I would Love to See some ideas for the pirate gameplay. Something like that.

1. the Pirates are no Nation anymore and have no cities.

2. you will be known as single pirate or as member of a Clan.

3. as a pirate you can enter in every city. But only in cities from a Nation who is friendly to you.

4. a nation is not friendly when you or your clan gain to many hostility points by hunting or capping ships from this Nation.

5. if you are hostile to a nation you can achieve a better realationship by activities against the Nations Enemy. For example if britain hates you and is at war with france and you kill French ships, your hostility Level will reduce slowly for britain.

6. pirate clans can establish a hideout. They can found in on the map by themself. Its like the clanwarehouse. You can refit and repair but you cant craft ships.

7. if a Nation find the hideout then they can attack and destroy it.

8. mortimer town will change to a free town (for the purpose nobody lost his stuff)

9. pirates can craft in every City they can enter.

10. a Nation can decide by vote to give all pirates amnesty or declare all pirates to enemys. So it is dangerous to have all your stuff in a nations City.

11. in the OW your hostile Status will be shown to a nations player so he can decide to Attack or not. But he can attack even if you are friendly.

Ps: or maybe Pirates can not craft but capping ships with Full dur!"

 

"Admin you mentioned that youre worried about that many pirate player Are happy about the actual Situation. My idea is you can split the faction into 2 and we can choose on which side we want to go ahead. the one side will remain as the so called republic of nassau and we can call them Buccaneers or something instead of pirates and the other side will continue as "real" pirates.

You can avoid the problem about the possibility of the "real" Pirates by attackin eachother and then hiding in battle by not closing this battle. If 2 outlaws choose to fight against eachother everybody should be able to join so Nobody can hide"

 

Edited July 16, 2017 by Luc

[Luc]

thanks again sven

[Archaos]

Although I do agree that pirates should get their own mechanics, I believe currently the biggest obstacle to pirate mechanics being developed is the possibility for the mechanics to be used to exploit. Just look at the number of threads in tribunal about people using pirate mechanics to get some form of advantage in RvR, and this is with only very few differences between pirates and nationals.

A lot of the ideas already expressed in this thread if you looked closely at them you would find ways that people would exploit using alts and with the current issues with the RvR and general OW game mechanics still needing to be fixed properly I think introducing pirate mechanics at the current time would complicate things further

[Jean Pual Vilvenue]

16 minutes ago, Archaos said:

Although I do agree that pirates should get their own mechanics, I believe currently the biggest obstacle to pirate mechanics being developed is the possibility for the mechanics to be used to exploit. Just look at the number of threads in tribunal about people using pirate mechanics to get some form of advantage in RvR, and this is with only very few differences between pirates and nationals.

A lot of the ideas already expressed in this thread if you looked closely at them you would find ways that people would exploit using alts and with the current issues with the RvR and general OW game mechanics still needing to be fixed properly I think introducing pirate mechanics at the current time would complicate things further

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA

[greybuscat]

I like or am neutral toward just about all of it except for #3. I get that no port captures basically takes TPing away from Pirates, and I see that as unfair compared to everyone else's starting position, but free port teleporting is easily abused when no one else can do it.

Maybe with a hefty cooldown timer. I could probably be talked into that for national port TPing, as well.

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

Pirate life can be summed up to one specific thing - availability of crew.

No Pirate ship can sail without a crew decided to go pirate.

So it all must start with a specific design for crew regarding Pirates, different from all Nations.

- the more success a captain is, the more crew will flock to his flag. Plus after making port crew leaves, new one joins.

 

[Rebrall]

10 hours ago, CaptVonGunn said:

This includes ideas from several people and are not all mine... These are just ideas to make Pirates NOT a Nation...

 

   1) Pirates can make their home base in any Free Town or in MT...

   2) They can build resource buildings in any outpost...(some have suggested Pirates should be allowed to build Resource buildings Anywhere but at 2x the cost I think if this was done maybe 4x the cost.. organized crime isn't cheap)

   3) they can TP between any outpost.. 

 4) they can NOT have any ship larger then a 4th rate any place by MT if the captain is not there.. ie they can dock a 1st rate they captured at a Free Town..but they can not leave it there. 

  5) They do not control regions.. they Raid and hunt....

   6) They can help nations with PBs.. by joining any other nations group as extra ships for them on a battle by battle basis 

   7) They can NEVER build a Shipyard bigger then Level 2.

     

  let the commenting begin....

  

I agree Pirates should not be a nation 

1 - they should be able to make a outpost in any major port, reason - pirates are fee agents and can align with whoever they want at a cost

2 - hmm not sure about that as they could hunt traders for mats/resources

3 - yep absolutely agree

4 - again agree with this

5 - agreed

6 - nations/clans should be able to put up anonymous contracts with offers of ships or gold, which all pirates get an in game mail describing the job and the reward

7 - cant build ships buy or steal them but cant use anything above 4th rates but get an extra slot on the ship (almost like and upgrade slot called a ship skin slot) that can make the ship built for a specific function like extra guns or speed 

 

a few others would be like 

specific perks based on hunting and raiding

can make clans but are smaller in size

have a flag slot available that they have to earn using contracts so they can fly that nations flag for a limited time (they cant be attacked - unless they attack a ship of that nation player or ai) as a reward for helping that nation again only usable for a limited time 

id like to hear a few more ideas from you all to

 

[monk33y]

Pirates in my opinion should be used as a server balancing factor.

Pirates should not be able to capture regions but instead they capture ports. 

The whole 4th rate idea is only valid while the nations don't have a surplus of bigger ships. 

Raiding should be pirate only.... 

For me the biggest feature missing for pirates is being able to presume the identity of a national in a ship captured from a national player.

Any pirate who captures any ship in pvp from a national should be able to sail that nations flag I'm open world, to equip the national flag the pirate must first be in any freeport or pirate port.

Sailing under a nationals flag would grant access to the national port, Contracts and resources buildings. (for a pirate to move goods out of the port they must use a ship with the nations flag). Being able as a pirate to sail under any nations flag opens up the game and removes the need for pirates to capture regions. 

Any non pirate can still attack a pirate using there flag, but the option is only available when the player has been clicked on (circle highlighted).

Simple system to make pirates unique 

 

[Anne Wildcat]

I  really like the idea Monkey of using the captured ships flag.  However it would probably be exploited in some way. 

[Rebrall]

44 minutes ago, monk33y said:

Pirates in my opinion should be used as a server balancing factor.

Pirates should not be able to capture regions but instead they capture ports. 

The whole 4th rate idea is only valid while the nations don't have a surplus of bigger ships. 

Raiding should be pirate only.... 

For me the biggest feature missing for pirates is being able to presume the identity of a national in a ship captured from a national player.

Any pirate who captures any ship in pvp from a national should be able to sail that nations flag I'm open world, to equip the national flag the pirate must first be in any freeport or pirate port.

Sailing under a nationals flag would grant access to the national port, Contracts and resources buildings. (for a pirate to move goods out of the port they must use a ship with the nations flag). Being able as a pirate to sail under any nations flag opens up the game and removes the need for pirates to capture regions. 

Any non pirate can still attack a pirate using there flag, but the option is only available when the player has been clicked on (circle highlighted).

Simple system to make pirates unique 

 

That flag idea is awesome 

Edited July 16, 2017 by Rebrall
Spelling

[monk33y]

I guess the easiest way to make captured flags have a lifespan. Say a captured flag is only valid for 5 server resets. More than enough time to get resources, Contracts etc and escape.

The captured flag system would mean being a famous pirate would have drawbacks. And forces players to pay attention to open world more.

Oh There are two Dutch players moving towards me fast... Oh what they are attacking me... What they are pirates.... I knew I shouldn't have sailed this victory alone for missions!!!

**edit ** The bigger the ship, the longer the flag lasts. 5th rate and below= flag until restart of server. 4th+ 3Rd rate = 3 days. 2nd+01St rate = 5 days... 

Edited July 16, 2017 by monk33y

[Luc]

1 minute ago, monk33y said:

I guess the easiest way to make captured flags have a lifespan. Say a captured flag is only valid for 5 server resets. More than enough time to get resources, Contracts etc and escape.

The captured flag system would mean being a famous pirate would have drawbacks. And forces players to pay attention to open world more.

Oh There are two Dutch players moving towards me fast... Oh what they are attacking me... What they are pirates.... I knew I shouldn't have sailed this victory alone for missions!!!

like the pirate gets known for sailing this ship under that flag under his name

[Rikard Frederiksen]

On 16/07/2017 at 0:28 PM, monk33y said:

I guess the easiest way to make captured flags have a lifespan. Say a captured flag is only valid for 5 server resets. More than enough time to get resources, Contracts etc and escape.

The captured flag system would mean being a famous pirate would have drawbacks. And forces players to pay attention to open world more.

The thoughts I personally had on the flag thing are as follows:

1. When clicked on in the Open World your rank and nation reflect those of the person who inspects your ship.
2. Possibly when you're within half-range of the circle the fact that you're a pirate is revealed OR it is revealed once you click on the 'Attack' button.
3. Upon leaving the battle instance there is a timed cooldown until you can resume being a pirate safely, i.e. once again you will show as the same nation as the person inspecting you after 5/10/15/20 minutes, or whatever.

For the first, it is exactly as it sounds. If a Spanish player clicks on you, then your nation to them is Spanish, your rank gets converted into the Spanish rank and to all intent and purpose you are a Spanish ship. Thus, if a British & a Dutch player both click on you at the same time, you appear as the respective nation and rank to each of them - I know this doesn't reflect just having one flag raised, but it reflects your captain's attempt to pass the ship off as an innocent vessel. As your notoriety grows across the server and your name becomes easily recognisable amongst people, the harder your life as a pirate will be as people won't be fooled by the flag system. Just when you think you're going to get past those 5th Rates, bang they hit 'Attack' and you're having to run for your life like a pirate should.

The alternative is that your flag reflects the region you're sailing in. So if you're sailing in French waters you'd show up as a French ship, or if you're in American waters you'll be displayed as being American with the relevant rank for a Yank captain. I prefer the first option as it shows specifically hunting that ship and its nation, but this alternative might make more sense as you are purposefully sailing in that nation's waters. Maybe this could be what happens when another pirate clicks on your ship, you show the nation & rank of the region you're in. I don't think pirates should be able to advertise to each other that they're pirates unless they're at Mortimer Town (which probably should remain as a single pirate port/haven).

Of course when disguised you can enter any port as usual and do what you want to do in that port, but once again the better known you are the riskier it becomes as people will just get into range as you sail in, hit attack and then you're revealed as a pirate and have to leg it.

What I would hope such mechanics would achieve is an organic use of smaller ships, of 6th & 7th Rates as people realise that they'll be better for hunting than taking out a big ship. So leave them with access to 4th, even 3rd Rates if they can crew them, but dam'me, you'd be mad to go hunting in one!

EDIT: As an extension of this, and the ideas below, these 'pirates' can be invited into groups with nationals. There are holes in this, I recognise, but bear with me. This is to i.) help maintain the illusion if they're unwittingly invited so that they can continue to pretend to be under that flag and effectively act as the same nation once in that group (like joining a battle as a national in the group would normally), and ii.) to allow pirates to be hired.

Hiring a pirate privateer...

Captain Jim, known as a scourge of French waters, is approached in-game (Global, whisper) or out of game (if possible) by Swedish players who want to hire him. Captain Jim accepts and puts an item into his hold: a Letter of Marque. He sails to a rendezvous with the group who wish to hire him and they invite him into that group. The Letter is automatically activated by Captain Jim accepting the group invite and all of their income from battle is increased to 200% to represent Captain Jim being rewarded for his assistance. Then when Captain Jim wishes to he can leave the group, or the group leader can kick them out.

As well as the Letter allowing ol' Captain Jim to gain an income by being hired by nationals, the activated Letter ensures the owner cannot be attacked by the hiring nation for a set period of time (in my mind I've plumped for either a real-time estimate of 3 or 6 hours) and vice-versa. This prevents national players using it as a ruse to just destroy a pirate's ship. I'm not sure whether the Letter should be a free item or paid for through marks, with a maximum limit of one at any one time, and perhaps with a cooldown.

Other things I would suggest, and either have been suggested in the past or in this thread (treat them as backing for other peoples ideas), for pirates are the following:

• No nation chat whatsoever, nothing to tie pirates as a 'nation'.
• No in-game 'clan' mechanics - can't form them, can't join them, can't do anything like that. If you want to sail together, organise it outside the game.
• I like the idea of crew attrition when you dock at port - crew leave the ship so you need new crew to join.
• I've always liked the idea of using Free Ports as Pirate bases, and should be the only players able to use them as an outpost, build a shipyard and stock their materials/plunder there there.
• I would allow Pirate players to be able to craft up to 6th Rates, but not higher - the larger Rate ships should have to be captured from players.
• I would allow Pirate players to capture NPC ships up to 6th Rates
• I would allow Pirate players to only have one (1) ship at any time. You have your ship, you sail your ship, you lose it then you need to replace it.
• I wouldn't allow Pirate as a starting choice, but something that can become a choice at a certain rank. You sail for a nation as a learning experience and if you want to be mad and go do pirate-y stuff then the option becomes available through attacking your own nation's shipping at a set rank (first attack you get a notification warning you that doing it again will result in your being seen as a pirate by your nation).
• Of course I am on board with the not being able to capture ports or regions but raid them narrative.
• Oh yes, a choice of flags of the most famous pirates would be nice. Especially that Ned Lowe's flag...

Edited July 17, 2017 by Rikard Frederiksen