Making it Easier to Nation & Server Switch.

[Christendom]

This Friday night, we had a small little nation meeting on French TS to discuss possible gentleman's agreements to how early/how late one should be able to attack and a couple of other things.  While the US is willing to negotiate, it seems like there is a little too much bad blood out there and we could not all agree to some sort of deal.  Props to @PIerrick de Badas for trying to set things up.  A pretty good idea that did come out of the meeting I think is worth suggesting here.  

There needs to be some sort of tool that will allow players to Nation and/or server switch easily and without having to delete characters and remake them.  I know that with the upcoming possible split that some Americans, myself included, are talking about swapping to other Nations to balance out the server.  It would be a much easier sell to other players if they could swap nations with their blueprints, ships, materials and keep their original character creation date.  The same goes for players on the other servers.  How many more people would be playing now if it was easier to switch servers and you can take all your stuff with you?  

To stop abuse, make this a 1 time thing and if players want to do it  again in the future they need to pay for it.  Similar to World of Warcraft's server transfer option.  If the devs wanted to charge something like 15bucks to swap nations/servers I know I'd pay it to get out of a shitty situation rather than quit the game.    

@admin made a comment the other day about the US having to change it's alliance with GB to balance things up on the server.  While I agree with him that all the US based players on one side of the alliance needs to be changed, due to alliance mechanics that he and his development team setup.....it's almost impossible to switch alliances quickly or even at all if we wanted to.  It takes a couple of weeks in this system to vote in and out of alliances and even if we could, I'm not sure we'd have the ability to get the majority of votes needed to swap.  

What is possible is getting some of the US based players to swap to other nations and serve the same purpose.  So if admin wants more US based players in the Eastern Alliance, put your money where your mouth is and make it easier for us to do so.  There are a lot of US players that have been with this game from the start and would prefer to keep their existing characters, start dates, BPs and materials.   

Make a tool that will allow players to transfer to different nations and/or servers with all of their stuff and bps.

Edited March 19, 2017 by Christendom

[Kesxex Rofux]

Sounds a good idea.

Admiralty office in starting ports could be an option. Player decides to move nation/server and goes to main town and "declare" his / her switch. Gets a ticket that he or she can redeem in new nation/server.

Thinking this a bit through:
- too many ships for a starting character in one town as all current ships would need to get back into single port - this could be solved with redeemable vouchers so the player can draw out old ships after initial setup
- BPs in theory are a simple transfer of some database attributes, same a experience and crafting skill
- Outposts and warehouse levels are converted into gold and need to be set up new
- Materials in my opinion need to be sold first, then bought again - this could be hard to move as there looks to be no redeemable voucher system in place like for ships
- Applies on next server maintenance cycle - with a daily refresh it should be manageable for server management

[Guest]

in AMA with Devs, admin said that switching nations in future will be harder  

[Aventador]

27 minutes ago, Kesxex Rofux said:

Sounds a good idea.

Admiralty office in starting ports could be an option. Player decides to move nation/server and goes to main town and "declare" his / her switch. Gets a ticket that he or she can redeem in new nation/server.

Thinking this a bit through:
- too many ships for a starting character in one town as all current ships would need to get back into single port - this could be solved with redeemable vouchers so the player can draw out old ships after initial setup
- BPs in theory are a simple transfer of some database attributes, same a experience and crafting skill
- Outposts and warehouse levels are converted into gold and need to be set up new
- Materials in my opinion need to be sold first, then bought again - this could be hard to move as there looks to be no redeemable voucher system in place like for ships
- Applies on next server maintenance cycle - with a daily refresh it should be manageable for server management

I don't think it needs to be that difficult. You can already have outposts in enemy ports and smuggle things out.. So literally all the devs would have to do is do the one time transfer that just moves you from your nation to another nation. It keeps all of your resources (ships will be wiped) in their current outpost and allows you to keep your gold and blueprints. 

[Sir Texas Sir]

The most simple way to do this is they get the mirror and  make the PvP EU server.   Than create the PvP Global server.  Take every one from PvP1 and PvP2 and have them merge into the PvP Global with their redeemable from both servers. I have chars on both servers and would prefer to Play as Pirate as I play on PvP2 as my main not PvP1.   Than the PvE server guys can pick PvP Global or PvP EU server to redeem there stuff onto too.

 

This will allow every one to pick a new nation and let us try to balance the nations better.   With this I think the alliances should all be reset along with regions owned.  Specially since the PvE content is going to change the gulf area.  We need to not be starting with what is going on PvP1 or PvP2 and should get a clean slate.   

[Christendom]

6 minutes ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

The most simple way to do this is they get the mirror and  make the PvP EU server.   Than create the PvP Global server.  Take every one from PvP1 and PvP2 and have them merge into the PvP Global with their redeemable from both servers. I have chars on both servers and would prefer to Play as Pirate as I play on PvP2 as my main not PvP1.   Than the PvE server guys can pick PvP Global or PvP EU server to redeem there stuff onto too.

 

This will allow every one to pick a new nation and let us try to balance the nations better.   With this I think the alliances should all be reset along with regions owned.  Specially since the PvE content is going to change the gulf area.  We need to not be starting with what is going on PvP1 or PvP2 and should get a clean slate.   

I like the idea of resetting the alliances

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

Post-release it will be even harder as there will be no more synchronization with the account. Meaning a change is a full reset.

For now the only thing is the assets.

[admin]

The synchronization of Player account data was a feature implemented in January/February.  Despite increasing quality of life for players it was under appreciated.

Unfortunately it has to go now for the following reason
Deferred rewards - we have moved to proper reward distribution where you will receive what you earned when the battle is over (marks, loot, xp etc). Synchronization interfered with that because it could overwrite results of your next battle, destroy your already received loot. 
It also created several issues with alts, potential griefing and ban evasions, where deleting your account saved your XP allowing some negative actions to be done without long term consequences. 

We plan to announce this week when it will be implemented and rolled out to live servers. 

TLDR 
Deletion of account will delete XP just like in most traditional MMOs or online games with progressions. 

[Guest]

Even if account/character synchronization is removed, isn't it still possible to have an in-game option to switch character nation similar to the mechanic that was used for going pirate?

At the moment there's a pretty good balance of allowing yet still deterring nation swapping, I fear that a full experience and crafting level loss will remove that option entirely for most people, an option that is absolutely vital to those who suddenly feel as though they're in the 'wrong' nation.

[Snoopy]

Yeah, faction switch mechanic is very much needed. Even if (massive 'if') players use the upcoming wipe/server changes to try and balance things out this is only a one time solution. Future imbalances won't have that luxury.

[Corona Lisa]

So you are basically saying "Buy alt accounts if you ever want to switch nations."

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

I see nothing different from any other game. A new character on a new faction starts fresh.

What I would like, and if it would help people to even consider "balancing" ( they won't... ) is to have a color meter on the strength of each nation upon nation selection.

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

Er....

Aren't we ? We are given a choice, by selection ( most MMOs ) or by action&consequence ( Elite D. for example )-

Making a new character retaining everything ? Tell me a game that does it.

Elite has a complex system, pretty much like we have - 1 character, 1 story - but once you go over the Reputation getting back on the good will of a faction is really really impossible ( I can't possibly return to Federal space ever without being attacked in sight anywhere at anytime my only chance would be to create a new character )

[admin]

53 minutes ago, Aegir said:

 

At the moment there's a pretty good balance of allowing yet still deterring nation swapping, I fear that a full experience and crafting level loss will remove that option entirely for most people, an option that is absolutely vital to those who suddenly feel as though they're in the 'wrong' nation.

Crafting level loss will be irrelevant in the future. The blueprint system is getting reworked as we speak. 
Captains will have most of the blueprints unlocked - some of the blueprints will be available from the admiralty for marks of conquest/victory or by other means. 

 

Defined mechanism to switch nations can be implemented in the future. 
 

[Guest]

25 minutes ago, admin said:

Crafting level loss will be irrelevant in the future. The blueprint system is getting reworked as we speak. 
Captains will have most of the blueprints unlocked - some of the blueprints will be available from the admiralty for marks of conquest/victory or by other means. 
 

Sure, those changes makes it easier than it is now, but that doesn't mean that we can't reintroduce other losses to balance it out again. E.g. losing 1-3 ranks so that people aren't 100% effective after switching but would have to work their way up for a while.

Just doesn't seem like a good reason to make it virtually impossible for anyone to ever switch nations.

30 minutes ago, Hethwill said:

Er....

Aren't we ? We are given a choice, by selection ( most MMOs ) or by action&consequence ( Elite D. for example )-

Making a new character retaining everything ? Tell me a game that does it.

Elite has a complex system, pretty much like we have - 1 character, 1 story - but once you go over the Reputation getting back on the good will of a faction is really really impossible ( I can't possibly return to Federal space ever without being attacked in sight anywhere at anytime my only chance would be to create a new character )

While you're technically correct, new character creation is basically just used as a way to facilitate nation-switching because there aren't any other means to do so. While it might work in a more game-driven game such as Elite, NA has far more control in the hands of the players, in which case a free-flowing system similar to EVE is more applicable. I can't even picture EVE ever reaching its historical depths of war, diplomacy and intrigue if it had been launched with permanent enrollment into corps/alliances for each new character.

Edited March 20, 2017 by Guest

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

Of course. In the future, who knows

EVE is clan based, it rises above the established "lore" in which may or not have similarity with NA. I personally dislike it but cannot stop in awe in what has been done with its story driven by "too much time" spent  ( also do not forget that subscription and plex  fuels it day in day in day in ).

 

[Sir Texas Sir]

I brought up a Privateer/Pirate mechanic that would be a great way to handle Nation changing in the future, but part of it needs to have a reputation system in game to work.  Say I'm Spanish and I want to switch to US.   I would pretty much like the old pirate system attack a Spanish ship and go outlaw/Pirate.    To be able to become US though I would need to get a contract as a privateer for that nation.  While still basically a Pirate/Outlaw now I'm working for the US. I can only join there fights and none of there alliances while a privateer and I can not build anything in those regions owned by US but I can use there ports for trade.   Once i get enough reputation while fighting with the US I get the option to become full blown US nation and my Privateer status goes away and now I'm a US National players.     Make it an in game way to switch nations but not something you can just do over night.  

Though for now I think when we do the merger we need to just let every one merge into one server and make the change.  When the PvP  Global server goes live we should be starting with a fresh map too and no alliances so every one has to vote for new ones and get there regions/ports claimed fresh.   I think pushing a bunch of us all into one server without doing this will just be asking for more trouble than we all ready have.  I know on both PvP1 and PvP2 many folks have talked about changing nations and making the servers more equal.  Give us the tools and means to do it.

[Christendom]

5 hours ago, admin said:

Crafting level loss will be irrelevant in the future. The blueprint system is getting reworked as we speak. 
Captains will have most of the blueprints unlocked - some of the blueprints will be available from the admiralty for marks of conquest/victory or by other means. 

 

Defined mechanism to switch nations can be implemented in the future. 
 

Point I'm trying to make is if there was a system currently in place I would transfer tomorrow to another nation to balance the night time players.  In your post you said the US/GB alliance needs to end to spread the players throughout the zones.  This is most likely impossible due to alliance mechanisms and voting.  

A reasonable solution to this problem would be to allow the players to move to other nations with their BPs and accumulations.  While I don't necessarily agree that's it's our responsibility to balance things, this is a decent compromise.  

Before going through the effort of splitting servers and implementing yet another conquest system give us the option to legitimately nation change so we can balance things ourselves.  Tou can go back to making content instead of constantly going in circles fixing player complaints.  This game needs more content than just RVR.

Sure maybe in a month we won't need BPs and certain ships, and I apologize for my wording here, but you don't have the greatest track record in terms of patch timing and flip flopping on issues.  I could transfer tomorrow and then have to wait months to craft the 3 ships necessary for RVR that are of course special bp drops.  

[Aventador]

@admin I don't think anyone is suggesting something permanent for changing nations easily but with all of the changes with servers and ships etc.. people want to move around and balance. 

 

[Twan]

So let me get this straight.. All of PvP2 is coming over to PVP1 (majority US), the euros are leaving and we can't balance the server out with switching nations?

Edited March 20, 2017 by Twan

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

Whomever wishes to play on

- server with no limitations

- server with Conquest limited to european timezones.

 

You cannot say that euros will play one or the other, the same way you can't say the rest of the world will play one or the other

Comes to individual and clan decision.

[Gysendorf]

12 minutes ago, Twan said:

So let me get this straight.. All of PvP2 is coming over to PVP1 (majority US), the euros are leaving and we can't balance the server out with switching nations?

Yes! You only forget to mention the resulting break down of the eastern alliance on PVP1 because their real life blocks them for PB fights after midnight every working day.

What I cannot understand is why an alteration of a database entry, changing nation, isnt imlement able. Okay it is unsexy to implement and boring and you dont get merrits from your chief for such a work, but as I last programmed round about 8 years ago I would have had made a SQL-statement with a variable for the nation.  But hey I dont know about actual database managemnt systems maybe OODBMS and relational DBMS are not used anymore. Maybe I ask tomorrow one of our company database experts how this is done in graph databases or what actual is stoa.

[Teutonic]

On 3/20/2017 at 5:33 AM, admin said:

The synchronization of Player account data was a feature implemented in January/February.  Despite increasing quality of life for players it was under appreciated.

Unfortunately it has to go now for the following reason
Deferred rewards - we have moved to proper reward distribution where you will receive what you earned when the battle is over (marks, loot, xp etc). Synchronization interfered with that because it could overwrite results of your next battle, destroy your already received loot. 
It also created several issues with alts, potential griefing and ban evasions, where deleting your account saved your XP allowing some negative actions to be done without long term consequences. 

We plan to announce this week when it will be implemented and rolled out to live servers. 

TLDR 
Deletion of account will delete XP just like in most traditional MMOs or online games with progressions. 

I don't know if it has been asked already on this thread, and if so please someone enlighten me.

When the servers merge, which ever server merges into the other - do we need to setup a character in the nation we want to be in before this all happens? or can we set it up after? Or can we even create an account once the merge happens?

[admin]

1 minute ago, Teutonic said:

I don't know if it has been asked already on this thread, and if so please someone enlighten me.

When the servers merge, which ever server merges into the other - do we need to setup a character in the nation we want to be in before this all happens? or can we set it up after? Or can we even create an account once the merge happens?

it will be done the same way when pvp eu 3 mirror was created. We will provide specifics shortly.
 

[Teutonic]

Just now, admin said:

it will be done the same way when pvp eu 3 mirror was created. We will provide specifics shortly.
 

Ok thank you. I have a lot of friends that have decided to come back and play the game after this coming patch. They just want to know what they have to prepare for in order to start off on the right foot.