Fredericksburg

[ari56]

I have played Fredericksburg twice. One before the last implementation of the going back to the middle and bottom of the map. I think it would be great instead of that to just make the whole map visible like you guys did with shiloh. Not sure if that is possible? If it is it would open it up for the AI to do more than just throw brigade after brigade. I understand the realism and what happened at Fredericksburg but the replay value would be better if it was opened up full map. 

[Col_Kelly]

They tried that at first but then realized there were too many performance issues because Fredericksburg involves much more units than battles like Antietam or Shiloh. Wasn't an easy choice but had to be made otherwise a very large majority of players would experience a lot of stutters there.

[Nox165]

12 hours ago, Col_Kelly said:

They tried that at first but then realized there were too many performance issues because Fredericksburg involves much more units than battles like Antietam or Shiloh. Wasn't an easy choice but had to be made otherwise a very large majority of players would experience a lot of stutters there.

Didn't they say there some kind of change happening with fburg?, Imo, I would open beta the full map frederickburg to see how many people acutally have trouble with it.

Edited January 31, 2017 by Nox165

[GeneralPITA]

4 minutes ago, Nox165 said:

Didnt they say there some kind of change happening with fburg?

No, that was me running my mouth. I spoke prematurely. Your average consumer PC can't handle more than ~150-200k troops on the field without freezes, so fburg will remain in phases. An unfortunate compromise to appeal to the base. 

You'll be able to flank fortifications in the next patch. This will change fburg obviously. 

[Nox165]

Just now, GeneralPITA said:

No, that was me running my mouth. I spoke prematurely. Your average consumer PC can't handle more than ~150k troops on the field without freezes, so fburg will remain in phases. An unfortunate compromise to expand the base. 

You'll be able to flank fortifications in the next patch. This will change fburg obviously. 

I wonder about that, its a shame. I think then if you cant make the full battle then at the very least it would be best to redesign the battle to deal with the issues that come up with the phase system. Ie random units showing up when the map changes over.

[GeneralPITA]

6 minutes ago, Nox165 said:

I wonder about that, its a shame. I think then if you cant make the full battle then at the very least it would be best to redesign the battle to deal with the issues that come up with the phase system. Ie random units showing up when the map changes over.

Random? There's some overlap between the right edge of Marye's Heights phase and left edge of Prospect Hill phase. You can move units between phases at will. 

 

[Nox165]

Just now, GeneralPITA said:

Random? There's some overlap between the right edge of Marye's Heights phase and left edge of Prospect Hill phase. You can move units between phases at will. Yeah I have been getting random units sent between phases, I even have abused it brought the whole union army into phase 3 which was fun.

 

 

[GeneralPITA]

Be specific. I doubt it's random. Screenshots? Did you report with F11? 

[Nox165]

6 minutes ago, GeneralPITA said:

Be specific. I doubt it's random. Screenshots? Did you report with F11? 

This happened twice since the last patch, both times reported with f11, didn't take screens since it was reported with f11 both times A random unit made it into phase 3 that was not near the phase area. Both times the units were no where near the phase area.

[vren55]

9 hours ago, GeneralPITA said:

You'll be able to flank fortifications in the next patch. This will change fburg obviously. 

not sure if that would change Fredericksburg. THe CSA fortifications are rather well placed so its difficult to flank them unless you try an extreme flanking maneuver

IMO that patch would best impact Stones River and Chancelloresville. 

Edited January 31, 2017 by vren55

[Springfield]

9 hours ago, Nox165 said:

This happened twice since the last patch, both times reported with f11, didn't take screens since it was reported with f11 both times A random unit made it into phase 3 that was not near the phase area. Both times the units were no where near the phase area.

I did just have a random artillery battery spawn behind union lines (while playing as CSA) when the battle switched to the second Prospect Hill phase. 

 

I feel like the new phase is a great compromise, and allows you (if you know it's about to happen) to position enough of your middle corps to assist with the third phase if needed.  It's also nice to take a break from Marye's Heights, after 3+ hours the butchery needs to end.

[Squadron HQ]

Fburg is probably the most ridiculous battle. The Union irl lost 12,000 men and broke off the attack when it became obvious they would just lose more - in this game it's possible to inflict in excess of 40,000 men at Fredericksburg. I can't decide if Fredericksburg or Sharpsburg is more ridiculous.

In this game, dozens of brigades attack at once, moving up to Marye's Heights in march column, deploy into battle order, bayonet charge the wall and retreat. In real life the attacks were made one brigade at a time. 

Edited February 10, 2017 by Squadron HQ

[Nox165]

imo, fburg is the worse map they have released, it was designed to be a full battle ( ie all forces in the field at one time) but due to performance concerns they had to do phases but they never redesigned the map to meet that change. So fburg feels wired, Personally I think they should do a test version or let least give us a sandbox for it. I would love to through my 6700k 1080 gtx set up at it.

[Slobodan]

4 hours ago, Nox165 said:

imo, fburg is the worse map they have released, it was designed to be a full battle ( ie all forces in the field at one time) but due to performance concerns they had to do phases but they never redesigned the map to meet that change. So fburg feels wired, Personally I think they should do a test version or let least give us a sandbox for it. I would love to through my 6700k 1080 gtx set up at it.

 

I've tried Fburgh as historical battle, on Major General diff as Confederates...and it was victory (of course) with 70k Union loses !? 

As already said, blue coates just kept coming and were annihilated. To much imho

[Koro]

12 hours ago, Nox165 said:

imo, fburg is the worse map they have released, it was designed to be a full battle ( ie all forces in the field at one time) but due to performance concerns they had to do phases but they never redesigned the map to meet that change. So fburg feels wired, Personally I think they should do a test version or let least give us a sandbox for it. I would love to through my 6700k 1080 gtx set up at it.

Nox, your issue is different from what is being discussed here. It's not helpful to bring it up every time someone mentions Fredericksburg.

The casualties would probably get even higher if the whole map was there anyway. 

Fredericksburg won't be made whole. 

[Nox165]

32 minutes ago, Koro said:

Nox, your issue is different from what is being discussed here. It's not helpful to bring it up every time someone mentions Fredericksburg.

The casualties would probably get even higher if the whole map was there anyway. 

Fredericksburg won't be made whole. 

Koro I disagree, I think the problems are related, The original design was very accurate to the Confederates disposition a fburg, Longstreet in the north with the artillery reserves at Marye's Heights  and Stonewall Jackson in the south with J.E.B Stuart, Between those two forces the telegram line which is by far the weakest position in the confederate line. Do to the addition of phases, which basically cut the map in half it has creates a few design issues. First, If your the union your options on attacking are more limited, you will be forced to attack two Very strong positions which is fine due to historically those positions being strong. Secondly, this is bound to lead to way HIGHER losses if the map was opened up it would greatly benefit the union, they could lunch attack in the enemy center or at the very least force the Confederates to pull resources from their already strong potions which would give the union a better chance at breaking through. As for casualties, due to the nature of this being a game and given design choices I don't think this is really a huge issue, worse case give a buff to the rewards for winning the battle.

 

Again, There are 3 options to fix this: 1) open up the map fully, 2) resign the map get rid of the telegram, repostion units, finally, 3) The option I would choose, since its not possible to open up fburg due to performance issues, Allow us to play the map in skirmish mode with the historical forces, or custom forces. This way campaign will not be effected by performance issues and it will give people who want massive battles and replayability something to do.

 

[A. P. Hill]

Just a couple nit picky points.

It's Telegraph Road,  not telegram hill, & Stuart's Cavalry were on Jackson's right flank and not between Longstreet and Jackson's forces on Telegraph Road.

The only Confederate troops in the area you're discussion centers on were Pickett, Hood, and Thomas.  Pickett  & Hood of Longstreet's Corps and Thomas from A.P. Hill's division of Jackson's Corps.

 

[GeneralPITA]

On 2/10/2017 at 0:22 PM, Nox165 said:

Again, There are 3 options to fix this: 1) open up the map fully, 2) resign the map get rid of the telegram, repostion units, finally, 3) The option I would choose, since its not possible to open up fburg due to performance issues, Allow us to play the map in skirmish mode with the historical forces, or custom forces. This way campaign will not be effected by performance issues and it will give people who want massive battles and replayability something to do.

 

While it's true that an expanded Fburg will allow the union to concentrate its attacking force, it's simply not possible. Please drop the subject.

Get rid of Telegraph Road? lol...how is that an improvement?

Also...what's skirmisher mode?

Edit: I assume you mean custom battles. "Skirmisher mode" hearkens way back to Red Alert and C&C. I don't doubt that'll become an option eventually.

[Nox165]

57 minutes ago, GeneralPITA said:

While it's true that an expanded Fburg will allow the union to concentrate its attacking force, it's simply not possible. Please drop the subject.

Get rid of Telegraph Road? lol...how is that an improvement?

Also...what's skirmisher mode?

Edit: I assume you mean custom battles. "Skirmisher mode" hearkens way back to Red Alert and C&C. I don't doubt that'll become an option eventually.

How dose that improve the battle? In my option you could focus the battle more on maryes heights and prospect hills respectively, I would just move the units that are between the two locations into the phases by either positioning them at the edge of the map or have them show up as reinforcements. I think it makes more sense this way, given how the map structure changed due to the phase system.

 

I will bring it up as much as I like. I paided for the game like everyone else here (hopefully) I will state my option on it if you don't like it tough.

[GeneralPITA]

Pickett's Charge is a custom battle, so there's the replayability factor that you asked for.

You can bring it up all you want, but don't expect Fburg to expand. Better to focus on things that can be improved. 

[Nox165]

8 minutes ago, GeneralPITA said:

Pickett's Charge is a custom battle, so there's the replayability factor that you asked for.

You can bring it up all you want, but don't expect Fburg to expand. Better to focus on things that can be improved. 

And i will , Also yep pretty awesome custom battle