Adding PvP and PvE content should be the developers number one priority at this point:

[Yar Matey]

I don't have all the answers to the problems in this game, but one glaring problem is the lack of things to do.  I have done hundreds of hours of trade runs, participated in countless amounts of port battles, although most were on PvP2 months ago, and I have sailed round looking for open world PvP. 

The problem:  When I log on to the game, there is really not much to do but sail around and look for PvP out in the open world or do trade runs.  Even if there is a PvP admiralty event going on, its still basically the same thing as sailing around in OW looking for PvP near enemy nation capitals. 

What players need: Good quality PvP and PvE content the minute they log into game and open up their map.  When you log into a MMO like World of Warcraft, there is instantly things to do right off the bat.  You could run a dungeon, you could go participate in the PvP arena, you can go do quests.  This is what is missing from Naval Action right now.  There should be events going on all over the map at all times of the day. 

What I would like to see in this game:  When I open up my map I can easily see PvP and PvE events all over the place and all I should have to do to find some action is sail to that specific location and jump into the action. 

Events Should all be Queue and Instanced Based:  What I mean by this is, you sail to the event, and you join an instance and wait for more people to show up and challenge you and your team if it is a PvP event.  If it is a PvE event, you or your group join your own special instance and do the event. 

Events should have variety:  What I mean by this is that events should have different objectives for each team as I have discussed before in a separate post, destroy the tower missions, port battle type capture the point missions, escort the trade ship missions, maintain a blockade mission.  ect......  

Events should effect the game world somehow: 

If you do a trader escort mission, for example, and you are on the winning side the port at which the escort was made gets a production boost and more resources are available to be purchased.  If you are on the losing side and your trade ship is destroyed, the port will suffer a production penalty. 

If you do a destroy the fort mission, and you manage to actually destroy or capture the fort, then that fort will be ineffective for 48 hours and will show up as destroyed in Open world or in battle near that tower. 

If you do a blockade mission and win the battle, then a bunch of NPC line ships from that nation will sit outside the port and attack enemy players trying to enter or leave that port for 24 hours that are enemies to that nation.  

 

Edited January 23, 2017 by Yar Matey

[James Cornelius]

While I don't agree with all of your suggestions - for example, an accurate depiction of early 19th Century naval combat does entail a lot of sailing around and looking for something - I agree that the game needs much more content to make it seem more full and to draw people in and keep them there. I am not sure if I would agree that events should be instance or queue based.

 

The variety to events is a great suggestion, and your examples are all good. I also think that player actions should have an effect on the OW like you suggest as well.

[Yar Matey]

1 hour ago, James Cornelius said:

While I don't agree with all of your suggestions - for example, an accurate depiction of early 19th Century naval combat does entail a lot of sailing around and looking for something.

Hmm.. I am not quite following you here.  Could you be more specific?  My idea does not involve sailing around looking for something.  You open your map, find an event you would like to participate in and sail over to the event.

Some events can be Queue based and some can not be.  But I think queue based will provide the most even and balanced (fair and balanced) pvp.  non queued tends to be sporadic and imbalanced.  One side will usually be the chasers and the other side will be the chasees.  Reason why is you never know the fleet size and what ships they will have, and the enemy's BR will almost never match you and your groups BR.

Also, these events will tend to generate PvP outside of the instanced battle, because events will become PvP hotspots, even if it is a PvE event.

Edited January 23, 2017 by Yar Matey

[Angus McGregor]

I *think* (and hope) these events you're suggesting are what admin meant by...

Quote

• Mission changes
  • We believe the game was actually better before missions existed. As a result missions might turn into dailies. Hopefully we have enough time to tie them to admiralty orders and admiralty related organizations which will provide their own missions. 

But there's really not enough info to go on in that little bit of description. Other than that there have been several excellent ideas floated for different types of random PvE events, and player triggered PvP zone events.

In the end... what a difference having an active server population of closer to 2,000 would make.

[James Cornelius]

1 hour ago, Yar Matey said:

Hmm.. I am not quite following you here.  Could you be more specific?  My idea does not involve sailing around looking for something.  You open your map, find an event you would like to participate in and sail over to the event.

Some events can be Queue based and some can not be.  But I think queue based will provide the most even and balanced (fair and balanced) pvp.  non queued tends to be sporadic and imbalanced.  One side will usually be the chasers and the other side will be the chasees.  Reason why is you never know the fleet size and what ships they will have, and the enemy's BR will almost never match you and your groups BR.

Also, these events will tend to generate PvP outside of the instanced battle, because events will become PvP hotspots, even if it is a PvE event.

I suppose that makes more sense. My point was that, for example, a British lineship captain from 1800-1815 spent a lot of time blockading a port waiting for the French to come out...

[Sir Texas Sir]

Content can wait, right now they need to get game mechanics done first.  We don't even have Pirate Mechanics and I'm not realy like the split Nation/Outlaw thing.  It should be more Privateer/Outlaw(pirate) isntead so you can help other nations if your a Privateer with contracts to work for them.   PvE/PvP content needs to come, but we still have a hostlity system that needs a lot of tweeking.  The RvR has a lot of issues.  US players still can't have port battles in there prime time and if there is an update port battles will start while the update is going on if they are set during maintance times.  This prob could be fixed with a simple hot fix with a move of the window to how it use to be on the flag system or so that it doesn't fall exactly like it does now.  You have PvP events during US time but you can't do port battles?  That tells you they know it's our prime time.

 

Yes I agree PvE/PvP content would be nice and would love to see some of the concepts folks have brought up for simple things like treasure fleets done right (not the events in the past) and other things.  Though it is not the main thing needed at this stage of game.

[Guest]

If we just had lossless small/large/trafalgar to get a quick action fix at will I reckon it would be alot easier to run a less constrained sandbox (people wont have to rely on its structure just to get basic entertainment out of their session), and cope better if it turned out to be boring or one-sided in the OW.

Both the guys who want evenly matched solid fights and those who want a holistic sandbox experience would be happy, not sure if trying to find a compromise between both is the best approach such as with creating queued mini-events all over the OW itself.

[The Spud]

Don't we just need more people on the servers?

[SirSamuelHood]

On 2017-01-24 at 0:00 AM, The Spud said:

Don't we just need more people on the servers?

filling a bucket with water before fixing the gaping holes in the bucket mean that the water will just keep pouring out.

 

On 2017-01-23 at 10:50 PM, Sir Texas Sir said:

Content can wait, right now they need to get game mechanics done first.

I can't agree more. While I would love to see more end game content (Being a RAdm is exceedingly boring at times), the base game mechanics are compulsory. 

Edited January 25, 2017 by SirSamuelHood

[Yar Matey]

6 hours ago, Sir Texas Sir said:

Content can wait, right now they need to get game mechanics done first.

What are you talking about?  We have a working game.  Mechanics only need minor tweets at this point.  If the game is not filled with content then people will not flock to the game.  You average player can care less about your complaints about pirate mechanics.  The average player just wants something to do.  That is why the game needs to be populated with content.

hostility can be tied to the pvp content easily.  You gain hostility when you blockade a port or destroy a tower or do a raid.  However, the devs said they are going back to a player triggered system for PB.

Seems like all you care about is your dumb pirate mechanics which is only a small portion of the game and is a moot point because the game desperately needs to be filled with players and that will only happen if we are given content.

Edited January 24, 2017 by Yar Matey

[Guest]

Isn't the point of a sandbox game to give the tools for players to create their own content rather than spoonfeeding them developer-made content?

Just saying, from a development perspective I doubt we have the time or manpower to create that much lasting content in events and whatnot, and even in cases that already exist it's pretty hit-and-miss and unlikely to be interesting for long. For example, the PvE event challenge was interesting for like...2 days? Nowadays I don't touch it with a ten-foot pole.

Pirate mechanics might not be 'content', but they're definitely a tool, and those guys are getting one helluva raw deal at the moment in being a nation without any perks.

Edited January 24, 2017 by Guest

[JeanJacques de Montpellier]

Honestly i think the NA priority is to change and find new game mechanics. Otherwise, new contents, new things to attract players, are very important, but it must come later.

I would like to examine, if possible, some things that are normal for a regular player (because he got used), but have not minimally sense. Totaly nonsense:

• Port battles: some solutions have been tried; i think that the current is the least logical. For a logical, rational issue port battles must at least in part to make sense. Conquest of a port should take place with the destruction of fortresses, towers and landing of troops from ships. So a simple but functional system should also be designed to allow to land troops embarked on SoLs.
• Screening: definitely something totally abstract made as it is now. Screening fleets and small anti-screenning fleets rival. The last trying to tag the screening fleet, although outnumbered, just to keep them engaged in battle and therefore not in OW. A total nonsense to realistic game purposes; but also no fun. They create totally unbalanced battles (which is not having fun then no). A science fiction mechanism not something suitable for a "AN EXCITING, REALISTIC, AND BEAUTIFULLY DETAILED NAVAL COMBAT GAME IMMERSING PLAYERS INTO THE EXPERIENCE OF THE MOST BEAUTIFUL PERIOD OF NAVAL HISTORY - WHEN SAILING SHIPS RULED THE SEAS".
• AI fleets: I never understood what they are, and the idea of placing AIs that can attack players is absurd.
• Etc...

I realize that many of these problems are due to the difficult realization of OW / battles; but they are characterizing the game too; moving away from its original intent.
The game has not yet been released, we are testing. This OW system, despite the efforts and the time spent, not totally convincing me. There is still time to try other solutions.
I liked a lot more NA in the beginning, before OW; i saw a lot of potential. To date i see a game with strange mechanisms, often so illogical and battles almost always not even. Little fun.

[Yar Matey]

44 minutes ago, Aegir said:

Isn't the point of a sandbox game to give the tools for players to create their own content rather than spoonfeeding them developer-made content?

Just saying, from a development perspective I doubt we have the time or manpower to create that much lasting content in events and whatnot, and even in cases that already exist it's pretty hit-and-miss and unlikely to be interesting for long. For example, the PvE event challenge was interesting for like...2 days? Nowadays I don't touch it with a ten-foot pole.

Pirate mechanics might not be 'content', but they're definitely a tool, and those guys are getting one helluva raw deal at the moment in being a nation without any perks.

On your first point of this game being a sandbox game, this game is partially a sandbox game but mostly a PvP oriented MMO.  The people who come to play this game are looking for a good combat naval simulator during the age of sails and they are looking for good player vs player content.  The developers have done a fantastic job of building a beautiful world with beautiful ship models and great combat mechanics but there is very little PvP going on. 

In order for a game like this to succeed, there needs to be a mechanism that triggers PvP content.  In the old flag system that trigger was a player pulling a flag for a port battle, and it generated intense and action packed PvP content for hours.  When we moved to a hostility system, where there is only 1 or 2 port battles a day, this PvP content was throttled, and people left.  It does not matter if the PvP content is triggered by players pulling flags, or the developers spoon-feeding it to us through events.  The point is, the content needs to exist or there will be no action. 

On your second point.  You are basically saying, the devs have all this time to build a massive open world, with all these beautiful ship models, but they cannot build content, which if my ideas were taken seriously, would be nothing more than a circle near a port in a battle that a player controlled trade ships needs to sail to with friendly warships trying to defend the trade ship and enemy warships trying to sink the trade ship.  Or a blockade mission where the blockading ships need to stay in a large circle around a port to keep the port blockaded?  This type of content to add to this game is trivial in comparison to building ship models and building the open world. 

Your whole post boils down to, the devs putting all this effort into building this open world with all these ship models, but then turning around and saying "sorry, we are to lazy to add meaningful content to this game."

If we had PvP oriented raiding, and blockades, and trader escorts, and destroy the tower missions, then we wouldn't be sitting here twiddling our thumbs going, "those pirate mechanics, yeah, they need to be reworked again for the 3rd time."  We would be out in the game actually enjoying PvP content. 

[The Spud]

56 minutes ago, Yar Matey said:

If we had PvP oriented raiding, and blockades, and trader escorts, and destroy the tower missions, then we wouldn't be sitting here twiddling our thumbs going, "those pirate mechanics, yeah, they need to be reworked again for the 3rd time."  We would be out in the game actually enjoying PvP content. 

I get where you are going at, the thing is the battles are so addictive, whenever you had a good battle win or loss, you just want to do another one like instantly. The thing is with this game you just can't, its not War Thunder where you press an instant battle button, and thats a bit frustrating sometimes.

The idea of having other missions then the ones we have is good, especialy if they involv PvP, but I don't think its something that will bring the game back to life. In my opinion they need to bring back the flag system (exploit free version) like they are planning, so people will log on every day and will have RvR stuff to deal with every day. On a night we're not having any PB's you'll see 400 ish people online, on a good PB night there will be 550 ish online. Thats 150 people only logging on for PB's, not for any other PvP or what so ever.

With flags if you by coincidence had a big enough group together you would just buy a flag and have a go at a random enemy port. This might bring back allot of players and at the same time bring back a bigger chance of getting some random PvP.

 

 

[Anne Wildcat]

Right now there are 4 ways to get PVP, add to this list if I missed something  

1) Duels/Small Battles/Large battles from mission tab.  The quickest way but unfortunately not popular.

2) PVP events. 

3) Sail around the OW and look for PVP, my favorite but time consuming as it's hit or miss. Recently I've been able to find PVP in areas where port battles are scheduled. 

4) Attend a port battle/port battle screening  

 

I agree they need to work on PVE content but do not see PVP as requiring missions. What I think would help in finding PVP is a heat map, showing which areas of the open world have activity although it's not realistic. 

[Yar Matey]

@The Spud  I am not advocating for war thunder type click a button and join a battle type game.  However, I would like to see tournament based PvP content added to the game as well as lobbies for dueling or team vs team action that is more like this.  What I am advocating for is more dynamic PvP scenarios.  Currently, the only dynamic and interesting PvP content we have is port battles, and they are loads of fun when you participate in one.  Adding different scenarios to different types of PvP content will make PvP meaningful and dynamic, like port battles.  This is not to say that open world PvP is not fun, sometimes it is loads of fun, but as Anne pointed out, its hit or miss. 

The thing that is forgotten though is what is is the average gamer who logs into Naval Action looking for.  These types of players need some sort of guidance as to what to do.  These are the silent majority that don't even know these forums exist.  When the average gamer opens up his map and sees different events all over the map, PvP and PvE it is a way to give that gamer who has 2 hours of free time to entertain himself something to do. 

I would really like to see both player triggered PvP content where flags are pulled and PvP/PvE content guided by the developers with events that shows up on the map when people in game open up their maps.  This would give both hardcore gamer who wants conquest their content, and the more casual gamer who wants to find quick and easy content his entertainment for the evening.  The game needs to have mass appeal to succeed. 

We need conquest type PvP content where players trigger attacks on ports (flags)

We need guided PvP and PvE content for more casual gamers. (player opens up his map and can see where events are)

And we need lobbies for the gamer who wants to participate in a tournament or duel his friends.

Keep in mind that with the addition of developer guided PvP and PvE content on the map, it will generate more OW PvP as well, as wolves who roam the sees will linger in those areas looking for prey. 

@Anne Wildcat  Heat maps are a great idea! 

 

Edited January 24, 2017 by Yar Matey

[Seaside]

For PVE, sailing to an event is fine but I don't think everything should be event driven.

If I'm sailing in open world doing my own thing and I happen across an enemy ship/fleet that is as strong or stronger there should be a chance that they chase me.

 

[Yar Matey]

1 hour ago, Seaside said:

For PVE, sailing to an event is fine but I don't think everything should be event driven.

If I'm sailing in open world doing my own thing and I happen across an enemy ship/fleet that is as strong or stronger there should be a chance that they chase me.

 

PvP content should be both event driven and player driven.  When you log into game, players should have the option to attack ports at any time and everyone in game should be made aware like in the old flag system.  The nation being attacked can form a group and go defend their ports. 

However, players also need PvP content that is driven by events as well.  You open up your map, and their is a PvP mission marked on your map and you sail their and join an instance and you wait until a minimum BR requirement is met on both sides, and then you battle against the enemy team. 

Players need options as soon as they log into game.  They need the option to go participate in an event.  They need the option to declare war and attack ports.  They need the option to go do a PvE event. 

When you log into game and you are sitting in port, you always ask yourself "what am I going to do today?"  And there needs to be things for you to do.  and there needs to be lots of things for you to do. 

 

 

Edited January 25, 2017 by Yar Matey

[Anne Wildcat]

@Yar Matey

Sounds like you are looking for a MOBA. Not even in POTBS is there event driven pvp.  There if you are in the red zone, a contested area, you can be attacked. Here every area of the map is like a red zone, no safe place. 

[Yar Matey]

1 hour ago, Anne Wildcat said:

Sounds like you are looking for a MOBA. Not even in POTBS is there event driven pvp.  There if you are in the red zone, a contested area, you can be attacked. Here every area of the map is like a red zone, no safe place. 

There is not enough players to drive a fully player driven content world and with restrictions on port battles along with how they are throttled due to hostility generation, it is impossible to have a fully player driven content world.  Although it would be awesome of the devs would give us the tools to do so. 

Edited January 25, 2017 by Yar Matey

[Fargo]

In simple words: players are the content of this game. The devs are just building the environment. Its about the freedom to do what you want, make friends, invent your story, be successful in pvp and pve or with your nation, etc.

The problem atm: there is no motivation to do anything other than playing your own story or enjoying the great ships. But many players want to achieve something special. For NA this could be a rank, a ship, a blueprint, or just a lot of money.

But beeing successful in conquest has no meaning, beeing a good trader or crafter has no meaning. Beeing successful in the game has no meaning... You cant give easy access to everything and reward more hardcore players at the same time. I think partly thats the result of players complaining about everything they dont get immediately. 

Pls dont punish me, but i think one thing this game needs is more grinding... Not exiting, not necessary to just play the game, but motivation.

Edited January 25, 2017 by Fargo

[monk33y]

To get any combat all the Devs need to do is set up the AI so they attack any nation that they are at war with (apart from single trader AI) 

 

[JeanJacques de Montpellier]

19 minutes ago, monk33y said:

To get any combat all the Devs need to do is set up the AI so they attack any nation that they are at war with (apart from single trader AI) 

 

Just remove all AI.