Justification of Regional Speed nerf?

[Liq]

Dear devs, today I realized that the regional Speed Bonus had received a massive nerf, It used to provide a speed boost of +5%, now it's only +2%. Now, I do agree that it wasn't going the right way with ships being able to do top speeds of 14-15 knots, and that, for example, a surprise shouldn't be able to do 15 knots, no matter the setup, BUT if you're going to nerf the regional speed bonus, why don't you also adjust the pirate refit perk? It currently provides a speed boost of +2% aswell as a mainsail force bonus of +10% (Basically twice the bonus of golden studdingsails without the penalties).
In my opinion, there currently is no reason to choose regional speed over pirate refit, since it has no benefits over it as it used to when it was +5% speed (a ship would be faster than pirate refit-modded ships in any direction except downwind).
Regional Speed should have a benefit over Pirate Refit, otherwise there is not much sense in it existing, is there?

Current Regional Bonusses
http://www.navalactionwiki.com/index.php?title=Crafting

Regional Bonusses before the nerf
http://www.navalactionwiki.com/index.php?title=Crafting&oldid=2338

Edited January 22, 2017 by Liquicity

[Yar Matey]

Pirate refit is so broken.  The main sail force bonus needs to be cut in half at least, and the speed increase should either be 1% or removed.  

[William Death]

It was my understanding...not sure exactly where I heard this (global chat maybe)...that someone said the bonuses with a nation or faction associated with it are better than the generic bonuses (pirate refit is faster than speed and has boarding perks to boot, Spanish hunter is better than mainsail force because it has more mainsail force and some turning and accuracy perks, French refit is more accurate than regional accuracy, has speed increase, etc...). I had just assumed this was the intended plans for the regions, have a few REALLY GOOD regions to fight over and some regions that were decent that can be spread throughout the nations, and have some regions that are no good at all.

I disagree with Pirate Refit, Spanish Hunter, Strong Hull, etc. being broken or OP. My reasoning: now I can finally make ships that reach their historic speeds with builds that can actually fight (live oak Constitution will do 13.8 knots, just like the real one, a Bellona made out of mahogany can hit 12.5 knots and fulfill her role as a frigate killer/group first rate hunter, my live oak strong hull Victory is impenetrable outside of 600 or 700 yards by most guns, as she should be). To address each region individually would take too much time, and drift too far off topic for this conversation, but the Pirate Refit seems to catch the most hatred, mainly by people who are sailing regional speed ships and expect to have the fastest setup on the ocean. Sure, I can make a Constitution hit almost 15 knots when built Pirate Refit, but do you know how thin that armor is going to be? How few hitpoints she will have? Sure, if you allow yourself to be boarded by one, you're in trouble if you are not boarding fitted, but that is the same with any ship rigged for boarding. If you want to beat said Constitution, all you need is a reasonably well handled Trincomalee that is not of a ridiculously weak build; and a well handled sturdily built fourth rate should easily turn one of those cedar coffins into matchsticks in about 4 broadsides.

PS: Regional Speed was never "faster on all points except downwind" than Pirate Refit. In fact, it was only ever faster close hauled, and only by a small amount. Here is a link to a comparison of two Surprises, one Regional Speed, one Pirate refit:

 

As you can see, Regional Speed was .3 knots faster upwind than Pirate Refit.

[Sir Max Magic]

2 hours ago, [IGG] Willis PVP2 said:

It was my understanding...not sure exactly where I heard this (global chat maybe)...that someone said the bonuses with a nation or faction associated with it are better than the generic bonuses (pirate refit is faster than speed and has boarding perks to boot, Spanish hunter is better than mainsail force because it has more mainsail force and some turning and accuracy perks, French refit is more accurate than regional accuracy, has speed increase, etc...). I had just assumed this was the intended plans for the regions, have a few REALLY GOOD regions to fight over and some regions that were decent that can be spread throughout the nations, and have some regions that are no good at all.

I disagree with Pirate Refit, Spanish Hunter, Strong Hull, etc. being broken or OP. My reasoning: now I can finally make ships that reach their historic speeds with builds that can actually fight (live oak Constitution will do 13.8 knots, just like the real one, a Bellona made out of mahogany can hit 12.5 knots and fulfill her role as a frigate killer/group first rate hunter, my live oak strong hull Victory is impenetrable outside of 600 or 700 yards by most guns, as she should be). To address each region individually would take too much time, and drift too far off topic for this conversation, but the Pirate Refit seems to catch the most hatred, mainly by people who are sailing regional speed ships and expect to have the fastest setup on the ocean. Sure, I can make a Constitution hit almost 15 knots when built Pirate Refit, but do you know how thin that armor is going to be? How few hitpoints she will have? Sure, if you allow yourself to be boarded by one, you're in trouble if you are not boarding fitted, but that is the same with any ship rigged for boarding. If you want to beat said Constitution, all you need is a reasonably well handled Trincomalee that is not of a ridiculously weak build; and a well handled sturdily built fourth rate should easily turn one of those cedar coffins into matchsticks in about 4 broadsides.

PS: Regional Speed was never "faster on all points except downwind" than Pirate Refit. In fact, it was only ever faster close hauled, and only by a small amount. Here is a link to a comparison of two Surprises, one Regional Speed, one Pirate refit:

 

As you can see, Regional Speed was .3 knots faster upwind than Pirate Refit.

Absolutely agree !!

I also do NOT see the needs to balance EVERY regional bonus against all others...some should be by design just MUCH stronger than others, creating hotspots on the map where the nations clash to get their hands on  

...not everything has to be the same in the end !!  

[Powderhorn]

If that is accurate, Spanish Hunters also gives more Mainsail Bonus than the Mainsail Regional Bonus, in addition to its other effects.

[Cmdr RideZ]

Regionals are not meant to be in balance.  I think this is a mistake tho, as it radically decreases your options.  Still, you can clearly see that it was not the goal in the 1st place.  The idea has been that there are good and better regionals, and we fight from regions to get best bonuses.

I believe Pirate Refit was meant to be better than Regional Speed.

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

SruPL

Other changes

• Some upgrades, perks, regional bonuses increasing ship speed were reduced. 

as in

 

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

I simply directed to the specific notes where it is noted.

On a personal note let us not forget one particular NA thing - the "dark souls" type of approach. You will find it several times on devs posts.

 

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

It is a Q&A. Ask me on another thread.