Forthcoming shipbuilding changes [Heavily Moderated]

[admin]

Hello Сaptains!

 

We will abandon the 5 color grades for upgrades and ships. Fine (blue), Mastercraft (purple), Common (green) are not used and thus are useless. Nobody makes them and nobody buys them. 

 

As a result of testing the final ship quality and shipbuilding system will look like this. 

• Captured - captured (grey) will be assigned to all ships captured (except for ships captured from player fleets) 
• Сrafted (yellow) - ships built by players
• Special - events, rewards, tournament vessels, or maybe extremely rare and hard to craft (months of effort required)

Instead of quality (who would try to make a bad ship) players will select things they want they their ship to have sacrificing other elements if they want to improve one of the characteristics

 

Definitely will be done

• For example if a shipbuilder wants to increase speed it will increase ship cost AND will have to sacrifice the hull quality
• If they want to have additional slots for upgrades they will have to sacrifice space or increase weight
• If you take more crew you might need to reduce hold
• Cannons and ammo and powder supply will affect cargo hold and will reduce ship performance if you overgun it

Under consideration

• If you want to take 200 shots per gun instead of normal supply to battle you might need to sacrifice some space (this will solve cases of light ships unloading 10000 rounds in a battle into a first rate)
• You can determine the number of repair kits you can take for the vessel and affect the weight.
• Unstable designs - add to much sails (to increase speed) your ship might capsize in some cases
• Other experimental ideas like 1 durability ships and other changes

Same treatment will be applied to upgrades. 

 

Once this system is coded in all old ships and some upgrades will become unusable due to database changes and will have to be removed from the game. 

 

discuss

 

Update to answer some of the questions raised in the topic:

1. Regional bonuses will remain and NPC ships as well will have them too 
2. Regions and map will not change thus your repositioning to new areas will remain valid
3. ETA for the changes is somewhere between end december - end january. We will first add land in port battles and some other previously promised things.
4. Wood types will remain and will affect ships stats, what will change is how the ship general stats and upgrade slots and other elements are determined during crafting, giving more options to a crafter to build the ship just for him (or for his buyers)
5. The current proposal is a proposal and might change based on what is found during the design stage. 

[Vaan De Vries]

Still would like to have possbility for endgame to craft ship outstanding other ships from their class maybe from better wood or somehow else. It should be quite difficult (kinda like now with fine wood) and probably it shouldn't be color-coded - just change of parameters..

 

But don't like the idea of special ships availble ONLYfor special events, tournaments, etc. Make them hard to craft and give them as reward on all these events and tournaments, but still there SHOULD BE possibility for anyone to craft any ship in game. Otherwise it's just player discrimination.

Edited November 2, 2016 by Vaan De Vries

[Jeheil]

"Once this system is coded in all old ships and upgrades will become unusable due to database changes and will have to be removed from the game. "

 

Surely you could convert our ships...via redeemables rather than trash them !! I am actually good with a wipe when it comes but killing all the ships !!

[JollyRoger1516]

So anything we build and own right now will be useless - server will go into hibernation again... - didn't we just experience this with horrendous reception?!?!

 

Apart from that I think you highly overestimate the time people have for this game. I can tell you I do NOT have months to build good ships and we all know that the ships with 5 baording mdos will auto win. This game will become completely unplayable to the ships of the line and a buttlaod of captains will leave - this you CANNOT afford anymore...

 

Also as long as upgrades are lost when the ship goes down people won't use captured/1 dura ships making them utterly useless.

Edited November 2, 2016 by JollyRoger1516

[z4ys]

please make captured ships brown or blue or purple grey looks so wrong

[Black Spawn]

Definitely will be done

• For example if a shipbuilder wants to increase speed it will increase ship cost AND will have to sacrifice the hull quality
• If they want to have additional slots for upgrades they will have to sacrifice space or increase weight
• If you take more crew you might need to reduce hold
• Cannons and ammo and powder supply will affect cargo hold and will reduce ship performance if you overgun it

 How will this affect regional bonus, will it be replaced by this or reworked as well?

[Hagen v Martius]

Wait, so does that confirm having to worry about ammo supply and such? 

If so, yes please. 

 

Other than that this has a lot of potential.

The wipe is unfortunate but not unexpected. Dunno why people seem to be so surprised by it.

Edited November 2, 2016 by Hagen v Martius

[Powderhorn]

"If they want to have additional slots for upgrades they will have to sacrifice space or increase weight"

Will these values be altered in an absolute or percentage value?

Also, time frame?

[balticsailor]

I have to say i realy like that idea that you have to balance the ships stats while crafting. Are you planing to make it adjustible in multible steps (or with sliders) or just as a toggle option?

[Corona Lisa]

Sounds great overall, I especially like the fact that you can customize your ship to your needs.

The most important point imo is that even casual players are actually able to craft yellow ships relatively frequently again. Since the last patch it feels like there is much less PvP, due to the fact that people are even more scared then before to lose their ship. If you look at the player numbers of the Small Battle Challenge from Fellvred you see that before patch we had more players each week to a point were one lobby wasnt enough (> 50 players). Now since the patch there are only 15 players on average left.
 

If you want to take 200 shots per gun instead of normal supply to battle you might need to sacrifice some space (this will solve cases of light ships unloading 10000 rounds in a battle into a first rate)

So when people are doing good in battle and are able to survive vs 1st rates while doing good dmg at the same time you want to punish those players? Why?

[victor]

Frist: some questions:

 

- will regional bonus be still there (I assume yes)?

 

- will crafting level affect the capacity to add more "modifications" and/or diminish the drawbacks of the choice?

 

- will the BP system remain the same?

 

- will the upgrade system remain the same?

 

Second: some comments:

 

- 1 dura ship makes sense only if crafting of ships is made less expensive (and if you can "add" duras to the first dura up to a certain number, so basically each ship with the same features can be merged with anorther one resulting in a 2 dura ship with those features)

 

- all ships should be craftable (with big effort) by crafters, even the rarest one.

 

- replace some of the wiped ships at least with grey ones with basic balanced stats (or it will take too long to start building new high end ships).

Edited November 2, 2016 by victor

[Paulus de Boskabouter]

Once this system is coded in all old ships and some upgrades will become unusable due to database changes and will have to be removed from the game. 

 

Just to make it clear - all current ships will be removed after you add this new system? And will it happen next hotfix or more like next big patch?

 

please make captured ships brown or blue or purple grey looks so wrong 

 

I agree, please give basic ships a different colour. I know this shouldnt matter but it still does

Edited November 2, 2016 by Paulus de Boskabouter

[Black Spawn]

I think this is generally a step in the right direction, the fewer RNG in crafting the better.

[CeltiberoCaesar]

• Special - events, rewards, tournament vessels, or maybe extremely rare and hard to craft (months of effort required)

It sounds like another step in the grinding gamestyle

[victor]

The most important point imo is that even casual players are actually able to craft yellow ships relatively frequently again.

 

I disagree. Fine wood thing was a tremendous nerfbat on yellow crafting ships (and much more for low and mid level crafters that have no deep pocket to rely on in order to buy fine wood from the market).

Edited November 2, 2016 by victor

[Rychu Karas]

Uffff....

A lot changes...

But it can work.

[Corona Lisa]

I disagree. Fine wood thing was a tremendous nerfbat on yellow crafting ships (and much more for low and mid level crafters that have no deep pocket to rely on in order to buy fine wood from the market).

 

So you like that every1 is scared of losing their ships, so they dont want to use them except for special cases?

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

The opening line for the basis of the system - "Instead of quality (who would try to make a bad ship) players will select things they want they their ship to have sacrificing other elements if they want to improve one of the characteristics" - is exceptional gold.

 

Ordering ships from armateurs with specific characteristics and not by "quality" is how it was done.

[Liq]

Hard to imagine crafting stuff without the quality steps, but we'll see. I'm looking forward to it.

[Twig]

 

 

Once this system is coded in all old ships and some upgrades will become unusable due to database changes and will have to be removed from the game. 

W8 What?

So, I've build over a few month a Victory (looking for the best possible ship). Now shes done: 3/5 Live Oak - Speed - Build Strg. (yeah old system)

Painted! All slots filled with golden upgrades - and those were crafted to be on this ship the whole time.

Now you want to take that beauty from me for which I used quite some time to get/craft? I can understand if I loose the ship cause stupidness but not like this.

If this patch comes - Count me out of this game.

Edit: dont get me wrong - I am totaly behind the new system but remove all other ships is crazy.

Edit2: I dont care If I loose any other ship but not that one.

Edited November 2, 2016 by Twig

[Jeheil]

OK having climbed back onto my chair.....and having just spent 34270470 hours moving good around......to make new sexytime ships....

 

I like repair and ammo effecting storage (assume it refreshes on leaving battle instance) not making me go back to port.

 

1 Dura ends mods...unless you give mods dura ?? or make em super cheapo...

 

This seems such a big depature from current mechanisms just put in....need more time to think about stuff here...

 

WE NEED A TIMELINE FOR ALL OUR SHIPS BEING DELETED !!

 

Oh and a player who puts 100 hours into gathering the bits SHOULD MAKE A BETTER SHIP than someone who puts 10 hours in.

 

Casual players shouldn't get welfare epics.

Edited November 2, 2016 by Jeheil

[Corona Lisa]

 

 

Oh and a player who puts 100 hours into gathering the bits SHOULD MAKE A BETTER SHIP than someone who puts 10 hours in.

 

Casual players shouldn't get welfare epics.

 

But it shouldnt take you 100 hours to craft a ship.

 

When casuals dont have ships to fight, then theres not much fighting left ( like in the current system)

Edited November 2, 2016 by JonSnowLetsGo

[Hagen v Martius]

W8 What?

So, I've build over a few month a Victory (looking for the best possible ship). Now shes done: 3/5 Live Oak - Speed - Build Strg. (yeah old system)

Painted! All slots filled with golden upgrades - and those were crafted to be on this ship the whole time.

Now you want to take that beauty from me for which I used quite some time to get/craft? I can understand if I loose the ship cause stupidness but not like this.

If this patch comes - Count me out of this game.

 

I get the frustration - I have a few ships that I will dearly miss - but why are you surprised by this?

They have been saying that a major rework of the crafting system will likely result in an asset wipe for ages and ages and ages. Hell, I remember mention of that back in March...

[Herpaderp64]

"maybe extremely rare and hard to craft (months of effort required)"  ?

Erm im sorry but we do have lives outside of naval action you know

[Wolfram Harms]

All in all, this announcement sounds interesting and good to me; but this bit...

 

We will abandon the 5 color grades for upgrades and ships. Fine (blue), Mastercraft (purple), Common (green) are not used and thus are useless. Nobody makes them and nobody buys them. 

 

...is not correct; at least for Danmark-Norge: people do build green and blue and purple qualities.

The changes are still very young since the last patch, and everyone is still trying to get enough FINE quality wood to be able to build.

But some such new-crafted ships are already available in Christiansted.

It would need more time to test it, before you could say, nobody would build a blue quality ship.