st. Pavel Original arment, and other ships arment

[Fuzzyhead12]

ive seen some problems with the arment of this ship, the original armend is mesured in Russian pounds, while the amount of cannons is right the caliber is wrong

 

British guns Caliber were designated to the weight of the cannon ball in 

Imperial Standard Pounds

 

0,4536kg= 1 lb

 

Russian funt

 

0.406kg = 1 russian funt

 

 

now do some new maths here XD

 

Main Gun Deck

 

36Rpdr = 14,1616kg = 32,2 lb

 

Second Gun Deck

 

24Rpd = 9,744 kg = 21,5lb

 

Quarterdeck + forcastle

 

18rpdr = 7,308 = 16,11 lb

 

quarterdeck got changed in 1798, to russian 6 pdr/ 5,4lb

 

 

still my earlier point still stands, that pavel would not carry 42 pdrs, maybe if you use 32 pdr instead of 42 you should have a better turningrate, or another aspect would be to give the ship

 

32pdr,24pdr and 18pdr instead of the 6 pdr

 

btw the 32pdr have nearly half the reload of the 42pdr

 

other pounds that were in use of the timeframe

 

 

That is trade pounds. By order of Peter I, Russian artillery used nearly the same pound (490g) as French / Spanish artillery. The only artillery weapons that used the trade pound (pood) for projectile weight were unicorns (edinorogs). See pg. 42 of Russian Warships in the Age of Sail 1696 - 1860.

Russian 36pdr gun = English 39pdr. But now that 36pdr gun is in game (currently only for Ocean), hopefully Pavel, Bucentaure and Santissima will all be limited to this gun as their max armament. 42pdr should be reserved as a unique armament for Victory, although practically there should not be a signicicant difference compared to the 36pdr (which again is really 39pds using the same standard as other guns in game).

Pavel did indeed start with 18pdrs on her weatherdeck, but this was removed very quickly and replaced with 6pdrs, so it was clearly a failed armament. Her sister ship always had 9pdrs on the weatherdeck, and I think Pavel should be allowed this armament. 9pdrs is also in line with French ships of almost the same design and dimensions.

 

thx for clearing this up with resources, even ge germans had a simpler way to designate a caliber to a gun

 

discuss and enjoy

Edited October 3, 2016 by Fuzzyhead12

[Fluffy Fishy]

It would be nice to see the whole cannons rebalanced as a whole before release, 42lbs should be rare, 36 should be the largest armament for most ships and there needs to be a few tweaks here and there when it comes to the availability and function of the highest tier ships, the whole area is a very difficult rope to walk on because sadly I can't see the game escaping a system where there is a "best" ship for a little while. Due to the way cannons and such currently operate there is a tendency to feel like more cannons = more fun, mainly due to the fact someone with an agile ship will find it hard to make the best of their ship if their opponent has a heavier armament and some competency on how to steer and manage damage output and intake. There was a reason a lot of ships preferred not to arm beyond about 32 and 36 or even 24lbs, I don't believe the game really reflects this properly in its current state, I don't personally know how to solve the problems but often scratch my head trying to think of some suggestions.

[dumpert]

nope. russian artillery pound was heavier than imperial pound (0.4914 kg), 36 rus = 42 lb.

 

in fact, pavel's ingame armament is lightest she ever had in reality - from the time she was used as a troops transport.

Edited October 3, 2016 by dumpert

[SteelSandwich]

Op, i think you are working with the merchant pound, which was lighter than the imperial pound.

Thr warship pounf, as dumpert posted above, was heavier than the IP therefore her armament is heavier ingame.

[Fuzzyhead12]

nope. russian artillery pound was heavier than imperial pound (0.4914 kg), 36 rus = 42 lb.

 

in fact, pavel's ingame armament is lightest she ever had in reality - from the time she was used as a troops transport.

 409.51718 grams russian  pound

 

 560.012 grams grams is german pound till 1816ish  then it was Prussian pound of 467.711 grams.

 

Britisch pounds

Troy = 373g used from 1758 - 1880

Tower=350g                  757AD- 1526

Merchant=437g            untill and around 1500

London=467g               was suded in the era of the Hansa

 

Metric pound is 500g

 

 

also here a list of a primary resource, 

 

 

so my question is now, wich pound was used for the british navy then?

Op, i think you are working with the merchant pound, which was lighter than the imperial pound.

Thr warship pounf, as dumpert posted above, was heavier than the IP therefore her armament is heavier ingame.

 

 

thx for that information no i can actuel calculate what arment she has

Edited October 3, 2016 by Fuzzyhead12

[akd]

That is trade pounds. By order of Peter I, Russian artillery used nearly the same pound (490g) as French / Spanish artillery. The only artillery weapons that used the trade pound (pood) for projectile weight were unicorns (edinorogs). See pg. 42 of Russian Warships in the Age of Sail 1696 - 1860.

Russian 36pdr gun = English 39pdr. But now that 36pdr gun is in game (currently only for Ocean), hopefully Pavel, Bucentaure and Santissima will all be limited to this gun as their max armament. 42pdr should be reserved as a unique armament for Victory, although practically there should not be a signicicant difference compared to the 36pdr (which again is really 39pds using the same standard as other guns in game).

Pavel did indeed start with 18pdrs on her weatherdeck, but this was removed very quickly and replaced with 6pdrs, so it was clearly a failed armament. Her sister ship always had 9pdrs on the weatherdeck, and I think Pavel should be allowed this armament. 9pdrs is also in line with French ships of almost the same design and dimensions.

[dumpert]

 

 

so my question is now, wich pound was used for the british navy then?

 

 

imperial standard pound.

 

Russia had even more insane measures system than british, in addition to merchant pound (409 g) there were mentioned above artillery pound (490 g), farmacy pound (358 g) and later metric pound (500g).

 

 

trade pound (pood) 

 

pood (пуд) = 40 merchant russian pounds. it just sounds similar.  

Edited October 3, 2016 by dumpert