The role of third rates in deep water PB

[Tenakha Kan]

We now have a new system in place and we were able to test it. Atm it goes like this:

- Regional capital cities are not limited in rank and as a result contains mainly first rates, few second rate and rarely 3rd rates
- Other Deep water ports: limited to 4rth rate => Constitution and Ingermanland
- Shallow water limited to shallow ship.

I have no real problem with the system for regional capital and shallow water ports, however now the most historically numerous ship of the line is completly left out of this system. PB are clearly line battle and frigates are not ship of the line.

1st rate, 2nd rate and 3rd rate are the ship that can form a line of battle and therefor should be the main ships for deep water PB. Frigate were never used for this!

They were used for screening, and hunting!

Pls make the system as follow:

Regional: no change
Deep water: up to 3rd rate
Shallow: no change

 

 

As an exemple: just look at the order of battle for the battle of cheasapeake!

 

British

Alfred Third rate 74 Belliqueux Third rate 64 Invincible Third rate 74 Barfleur Second rate 98 Monarch Third rate 74 Centaur Third rate 74 America Third rate 64 Bedford Third rate 74 Resolution Third rate 74 London Second rate 98 Royal Oak Third rate 74 Montagu Third rate 74 Europe Third rate 64 Terrible Third rate 74 Ajax Third rate 74 Princessa Third rate 70 Alcide Third rate 74 Intrepid Third rate 64 Shrewsbury Third rate 74      

 

French:

 

Pluton Third rate 74 Marseillois Third rate 74 Bourgogne Third rate 74 Diadème Third rate 74 Réfléchi Third rate 64 Auguste Third rate 80 Saint-Esprit Third rate 80 Caton Third rate 64 César Third rate 74 Destin Third rate 74 Ville de Paris First rate 110 Victoire Third rate 74 Sceptre Third rate 74 Northumberland Third rate 74 Palmier Third rate 74 Solitaire Third rate 64 Citoyen Third rate 74 Scipion Third rate 74 Magnanime Third rate 74 Hercule Third rate 74 Languedoc Third rate 80 Zélé Third rate 74 Hector Third rate 74 Souverain Third rate 74 Edited May 30, 2016 by Tenakha Kan

[Lyric]

Completely agreed. 3rd rates are just redundant atm.  Definitely not the direction this game should be going in as 3rd rates were THE most common SOLs in use historically.

[Ledinis]

On a personal perspective i really hope artificial ship limitations will be removed somewhere in the future from Port Battles and big ship will be limited by their cost and time to build and maintain.

[Nalyd]

On a personal perspective i really hope artificial ship limitations will be removed somewhere in the future from Port Battles and big ship will be limited by their cost and time to build and maintain.

 

This never works, it only delays the issue but in the end, you'll still have your death ball of 25 first rate.

[Ledinis]

This never works, it only delays the issue but in the end, you'll still have your death ball of 25 first rate.

Yeah but if building the said death ball would require the entire nation funneling its resources towards it, neglecting the enemy threat witch in the mean time could overrun you with smaller ships, loosing ports and economical power ( needs an economy rework and make ports have an actual use for it though ). Im fairly certain you would see a bigger variety of ships in PB (not to mention how painful it would be to loose the said death ball or even part of it). But yeah it cant be proven until its tested i guess

[Tenakha Kan]

The main problem (and the easiest to fix) now as I see it is the lack of role for the most important ship of its time ie. the 74

Edited May 30, 2016 by Tenakha Kan

[Horror]

Regional: no change

Deep water: up to 3rd rate

Shallow: no change

It is easy to predict that deep water will become ALL 3rd rates.

 

Best solution is in economics as it was in the day. Third rates were efficient/cheap.

First/Second rates should cost A LOT relative to 3rd, (give 3rds more durability or some such for example).

So if they bring the big boys to a PB and win, at least you might make their victory Pyrrhic. 

Edited May 30, 2016 by Horror

[Tenakha Kan]

It is easy to predict that deep water will become ALL 3rd rates.

 

Best solution is in economics as it was in the day. Third rates were efficient/cheap.

First/Second rates should cost A LOT relative to 3rd, (give 3rds more durability or some such for example).

So if they bring the big boys to a PB and win, at least you might make their victory Pyrrhic. 

 

Big battle were almomst always 3rd rate vs 3rd rate, it doesn't bother me, frigate were not used in the line of battle except to transmit signals or pick up survivors.

 

The role of frigates is to screen

[DazednConfused]

Or limit the amount of 1st/2nd rates allowed into a port battle to perhaps 1 vs 6 3rd rates - easy. It would mean you would need to co-ordinate to make sure you have good players in the 1st/2nd rates or get reckd

[Tenakha Kan]

Or limit the amount of 1st/2nd rates allowed into a port battle to perhaps 1 vs 6 3rd rates - easy. It would mean you would need to co-ordinate to make sure you have good players in the 1st/2nd rates or get reckd

 

ATM the number of regional capital is pretty low, so the vast majority of PB is without 1st and 2nd rates

[shaeberle84]

I agree with the OP.

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

Just a notice:

 

- the system is in play to allow more players to participate in Conquest if they so wish.

 

 

It is the start and end of it.