9.8 Damage Model Poll

[Unsubbed]

Self-exclamatory...  All questions are about the changes in current form, unless otherwise stated.

 

The question about what rank you are is just to get an idea if ppl who vote have been exposed to higher level combat as patch 9.8 seems to change higher tier ship combat more-so than lower.

 

Edit: Added a question about combat preference, solo/group pve and pvp.  Added option to question 3 for those who like new damage model over previous version but want it to be tweaked.

 

Posted in wrong forum... Could a mod/admin move this to combat discussion?

Edited May 21, 2016 by F4ppinFr3nzy

[Ronald Speirs]

I like the damage mod it just needs more tweaking to improve it, only thing i really noticed is you need to get within 100 meters to avoid any type of bounce, at that range your probably better off moving in for a boarding opportunity, so maybe they just need to tweak the range alittle more, what ever they decide they will find the fix.

[Vaz]

it needs more tweaking, the mechanics of the model i prefer any day over the previous version.

[vonKrimm]

marshmallow cannons against impervium hulls = zzzzZZZZZZZZZZZ fights.

 

can it at least be marshmallow cannons vs. graham cracker hulls?

Edited May 21, 2016 by vonKrimm

[Hethwill, the Red Duke]

Very pleased with the changes. Certainly need a improvement.

 

Combat is very engaging, positioning and wind very decisive and boarding suddenly comes into play, a lot like back in the day.

 

Sadly the morale system, to emulate battering another ship into submission by cannon fire ( the ranges we have now seem totally on par with the captain's logs and engagement descriptions from that era )  and boarding still is very deficiente.

[BeeRanch]

I think that for gameplay purposes that all three tactics ( sail/demast, boarding or sinking) should be balanced. Right now it leans too heavily towards boarding. Demasting is virtually impossible and sinking takes a bit too long.

 

I did not like the easy leak, easy sink model of the last patch.

[Musuko42]

It needs tweaking, certainly, but I like the fact that the larger ships actually FEEL larger now.

 

I suspect a lot of the complaints about battles taking to long will die down once people learn the new tactics needed to fight effectively.

[surfimp]

Overall I think some tweaking is needed, especially to grapeshot stern rakes. They should actually kill crew instead of failing to even reset the escape timer. IMHO of course

 

 

The guy in the LGV I was playing against had a number of pretty on-target shots on my hull but failed to really do much of anything beyond knocking out 2 cannons on my starboard side, killing 3 crew and knocking my sails down to the low 90%. He was mostly aiming for my masts and trying to get me to miscalculate and stall out alongside him so he could board me, but even so his broadsides should've done something a bit more meaningful to my armor IMHO.

 

I was able to knock his stern armor off pretty much the same as always, took about 2-3 broadsides from medium range IIRC. It was only when I'd switched to grape that the silliness began. I made at bunch of completely ineffectual passes before deciding to record the video. It seemed like I was firing actual grapes. I have used the same tactics in the past on a Frigate and brought it down to < 150 crew, have played since Sea Trials, and TBH this is the first time I've ever had trouble getting at least some crew killed when raking the stern with grape.

 

So... I don't mind the overall idea of this new damage model, but it definitely needs to be tweaked to correct situations like the above.

[akd]

Poll is flawed.  Improvement of new model (bug fixes, more realistic values, partial penetrations, etc.) is a valid alternate choice.

[Battlemetal]

It needs tweaking, certainly, but I like the fact that the larger ships actually FEEL larger now.

 

I suspect a lot of the complaints about battles taking to long will die down once people learn the new tactics needed to fight effectively.

 

    I don't mind long battles at all. However when I'm in a Santisima, and giving a full broadside to a Cerberus at ~200m with long guns doesn't do that much damage, that seems a bit unrealistic. Love the idea of the new armor mechanics, just needs to be tweaked a little to make long distance combat relevant again. Same goes for demasting, it feels like masts are nigh on invulnerable, even at close ranges.

    BTW, i'll be playing Naval Action until the last server shuts down

[Neptune]

New Damage model is so boring. Not really any fun in rage boarding 70% of the time or 50m continuous hull bashing. Most of the gameplay is chaining enemy to get close enough to do any damage. Great system for people who have unlimited time to play games. Most of the people going on the realism train don't realize you won't have anyone to battle because not everyone has 15 hours a day to sit behind a computer screen trying to sink a pixel ship.

Edited May 21, 2016 by Scotch

[Red Jack Walker]

I like the new system and most of all that the Game is moving toward simulation and realism. New damage model needs just a little tweak and bugfixing in my opinion (I'm referring also to the "powerless grape thing"). Crew management, officers and surrender mechanic should complete a good picture.

[Unsubbed]

Poll is flawed.  Improvement of new model (bug fixes, more realistic values, partial penetrations, etc.) is a valid alternate choice.

I agree, I added option to reflect.

Edited May 21, 2016 by F4ppinFr3nzy

[Hussar]

I like the new model,  you have to know your enemy better than before and what range your guns will penetrate. 

Besides the grape issue, this has introduce more tactical play which can only be a good thing in the long run....  more testing needed but it gets a + from me

[admin]

while forum polls can be useful

we are no longer accepting forum poll results as valid representation of the opinion of the majority

in game polls are coming soon

[Inkompetent]

I was able to knock his stern armor off pretty much the same as always, took about 2-3 broadsides from medium range IIRC. It was only when I'd switched to grape that the silliness began. I made at bunch of completely ineffectual passes before deciding to record the video. It seemed like I was firing actual grapes. I have used the same tactics in the past on a Frigate and brought it down to < 150 crew, have played since Sea Trials, and TBH this is the first time I've ever had trouble getting at least some crew killed when raking the stern with grape.

 

So... I don't mind the overall idea of this new damage model, but it definitely needs to be tweaked to correct situations like the above.

It actually seems like the hit/damage models are more accurately represented than before, and as such your Privateer is simply too small to be able to aim at any meaningful angle. Either your shots simply hit the stern planking and don't get through, or they are aimed high enough and shoot into the ship's ceiling since you need to aim so high that you can't fire into the ship with any depth.

Better or worse for gameplay? I dunno. But it certainly is more realistic to be unable to use grape shot the way it has been used.

Edited May 21, 2016 by Inkompetent

[surfimp]

It actually seems like the hit/damage models are more accurately represented than before, and as such your Privateer is simply too small to be able to aim at any meaningful angle. Either your shots simply hit the stern planking and don't get through, or they are aimed high enough and shoot into the ship's ceiling since you need to aim so high that you can't fire into the ship with any depth.

Well I kept that video short but what's not shown are the dozen (?) other passes I made, at a variety of distances and angles.

After a first grape pass which brought the crew down to 228, there were no more kills.

Also notice that there were no hull hits being recorded either, although the shots were clearly in target.

I'm going with "bugged" and not reading more into it about hit boxes and what not. Stern rakes with grape were and rightly should be absolutely deadly. Captains struck colors before letting their entire crew be slaughtered in that fashion.

Edit: should also point out that admin/devs have indicated that bow & stern raking should be deadly. At least until this gets hot fixed/patched, looks like there's not much point to using grape while doing so.

Edited May 21, 2016 by Sansón Carrasco

[Unsubbed]

while forum polls can be useful

we are no longer accepting forum poll results as valid representation of the opinion of the majority

in game polls are coming soon

I PAID to help critique and revise YOUR alpha game.  You don't want to listen, that's your choice.  You won't have to worry about seeing me posting anything else on these apparently invalid forums.  

 

Keep all your 'yes men' around, it will make you feel happy as the product sinks.

Edited May 21, 2016 by F4ppinFr3nzy

[la Touche-Treville]

To be honest it's not so much the damage model in itself, it's the radical change in tactics that it brings.

 

Before we were all at more or less equal as anyone could penetrate anyone (at least compared to now). Goal was you sink the enemy, you win. Oh, we did also see the alternative for some lucky ones (more of this in a second) that consisted in boarding the enemy.

The new damage model has left us with pretty much boarding as the only valid tactic as you can no longer sink a ship, well it takes ages so better to board.

 

And here is were my grief is:

I can craft exceptional Grog Rations, Exceptional Extra Hammocks and one or two other upgrades that are essential for successful boarding however I CAN NOT craft or buy:

• Exceptional Marines
• Exceptional Boarding Parties
• Exceptional Swordfighting Books
• etc ...

So at this stage I feel that the game is no longer playable in fair terms. 

 

Thoughts?

[ragnar hairy trousers]

the new damage model is great... its the boarding system that is broken... boarding mods are op

[admin]

I PAID to help critique and revise YOUR alpha game.  You don't want to listen, that's your choice.  You won't have to worry about seeing me posting anything else on these apparently invalid forums.  

 

Keep all your 'yes men' around, it will make you feel happy as the product sinks.

 

Please read our post again and carefully Captain

 

we just said that polls are not useful because forum = 20% of population

forum poll results are not representing the opinion of the majority and we all know it

we are going to move the polls into the game to get the real voting data in the future

 

Your reaction to our comment shows that you are maybe not fit to hear honest feedback flipping by a neutral comment about polls in general

You even changed your name

[Chromey]

Loving new damage patch. Only canons need a slight hp buff but great. Loving the march towards more realistic gameplay and giving that realistic feel. God speed NA DEVS! I hope  you clinch the economy and then throw in some diplo ftw!

[delaine]

Please read our post again and carefully Captain

 

we just said that polls are not useful because forum = 20% of population

forum poll results are not representing the opinion of the majority and we all know it

we are going to move the polls into the game to get the real voting data in the future

 

Your reaction to our comment shows that you are maybe not fit to hear honest feedback flipping by a neutral comment about polls in general

You even changed your name

people will be people admin in all honestly what i think of the damage model(been here sence sea trials) its somthing different  ships have more surviveablity like my ingerm honestly was pretty needed i can understand ops grape rakes are rendered useless however i still kill more crew with cannon ball rakes in the current patch  compaired to grape however i do pitch alot more cannons compaired to the old damage model but that is just my 2cents about my personal thoughts about it

[charognard666]

 

 

1. Grape damage bugs are fixed. Destroyed planking will allow better grape penetration
2. Cannon loss addressed. Destroyed planking will affect cannon destruction but the main damage to guns will happen during raking
3. Penetration values will be adjusted for ships of the line
4. Cannon penetration values will be tuned a bit
5. Ingermanland and Indiaman are in the wrong place in the food chain. HP and planking values for these ships will be adjusted

 

 

The damage 5.0 is great, more realistic, it need many tweaks and first are coming. I'm a satisfied tester customer