Idle Gains and More, Regarding Upcoming Changes

[Crayon]

Theres alot of changes coming up, and there are also lots of players leaving the game. I personally think its because the nature of the game requires people to team up in groups, to have any sort of OW function, even when it comes to missions. What I mean is that, there are no solo players, and if there are, they are traders. 

 

The game has lost many of its players since it went live on EA, many of whom probably did not have the opportunity, or time, to play with others. To look how many players are leaving the game, look at the steam charts here: http://steamcharts.com/app/311310

 

Most of these poll questions are there in regards to improving gameplay while alone especially. Some affect the games' feel while offline as well. Its just bad design to punish those who cannot be online 24/7.

 

Something needs to change to promote singular gameplay, so that it can rival that of a small groups' game play.This will obviously include more input from the singular player. At least this way, theres something to keep them coming back. Especially for those who are not able to contribute to a larger group due to time constraints or others. 

 

 

What can we do to promote people who cannot contribute many hours to this game, to log back in and play?

Edited May 3, 2016 by Crayon

[Dius]

Or maybe more emphasis on the benefits of joining groups for both PvE & PvP.

And an established clan...

 

End Game in Naval Action is very much a team game. 

 

I personally see no gain in promoting solo game play.

[Crayon]

Or maybe more emphasis on the benefits of joining groups for both PvE & PvP.

And an established clan...

 

End Game in Naval Action is very much a team game. 

 

I personally see no gain in promoting solo game play.

 

I agree! The vast majority of the players leaving never make it to even captain level before they get worn out from the grind. Many of these players are also in a clan where they just can not participate in the major ops because of the grind stands in their way.

 

A squad in their big ships go and do the PB in their firsts. While people in B and C squad in their mercs/frigs get to patrol on the screen. Everyone knows that once A squad gets close to each other B and C squads gotta do their own thing so to speak.

[Vernon Merrill]

It really boils down to the fact that some see this as a strategy game with the added bonus of really good battle and some see this as nothing more than a PEW PEW match where everything takes too long...

[jodgi]

I must admit I don't think I understand what I'm asked here. Maybe I need to be spoon-fed the relation between idle gain (?!) and solo play.

I'm in a tiny clan that very seldomly team up but mostly hunt solo and do duels. We have minimal interest in big ships and die on the inside at the very concept of PVE.

We work together on the resources, mats and crafting bit because there is no other way of securing the best fighting pixels. Someone else is enjoying that part, we're not.

[Crayon]

I must admit I don't think I understand what I'm asked here. Maybe I need to be spoon-fed the relation between idle gain (?!) and solo play.

I'm in a tiny clan that very seldomly team up but mostly hunt solo and do duels. We have minimal interest in big ships and die on the inside at the very concept of PVE.

We work together on the resources, mats and crafting bit because there is no other way of securing the best fighting pixels. Someone else is enjoying that part, we're not.

 

Logged out is idle time. Logged in and at port, and not actively pursuing something (in queue),  is idle time. 

[jodgi]

I get that. But how does that relate to solo play?

Break out the crayons and paint me a picture, slowly.

[Fastidius]

Personally i think that there are 2 levels of game,

 

Entry level - Explorer

 

PVP - 5 grades and up

 

in my view the explorer stage needs to be adjusted to make it more abut questing for gain. 

 

give missions about going to places like visit 10 other friendly ports

give missions about going to different land masses

give missions about engaging enemy AI from othercountries as incentive to get out and sail awayfrom KPR

feed them trading mission....supply x amount of randomobject to x place for xp& gold

make production buildings acheivemnt not a right

make ship access an acheivement not a right.

UNLOCKS

 

at Master and command give them a mission to find a clan just so they find a clan and see if they like it   this si the point they should get off the ride if they don't like the game.

 

This changes the game away from being a grind of basic-cutter/snow vs mission and makes it adventuring.

 

fix these kind of core issues with longevity and ignore the rubbish noise about i want free stuff while do nothing.  I accept your rubbish UI because it sorta works and i hope you are building better gameplay not faffing around with how to make things easier or more convoluted to get the same end results.

 

Fleet orders & Solo Missions = good, more comeptition but make them harder and harder. a 4 ship rear admiral vs 8 ships is easier than a commodore with 8 ships against..and stop giving us AI ships we don't need or want them.  Should be  BR locked/scaled  no need for rank missions base it of BR and make matchmaker work for you better once you have enough ship that matchmaker sucks then deal with it but really 7 tiers of ship cant be hard.  make it = BR + 1 of the highest ships in the battle as a guide and see how that works....

 

Small battles = needs a scoreboard to make it of interest. losing ships for no status gain is stupid

Large battles = non existent content due to population issue

Trafalgar = make an announcer in game so people join them when they happen make it fame game based game with no duro loss and set ships your given based on fame ranks.

 

fix the ui a little - make sliders from craft work on hours spent not items created would be a massive time saver on crap like make me ingots from all this stuff.

 

fix chat a little so you can have sub groups people can join.   /join gankers  /join yucatan defense with passwords etc  nations cant use nation chat because you cant stop spies. make it so you can use color properly and set it so that guild announcement have a colour and random chat has another and make it so  abusers can be modded by mods.....there are people interested in making the game better and are happy to do things like police non announcer using announce

 

make the scoreboards for fame and some form of a fame system and have people put up acheivement suggestions and see if you can get those stats easily and implement that stuff

 

PVP = EGO if you want pvp feed ego building stuff.

 

seriously hey if you sit around doing nothing ill give you stuff is just plain against what the game needs.....when we have a reason to need freebies people will ask loudly

 

 

once you get to M & C you should be looking to get into groups and clans for end game content.

 

anything less than 3rd rate should have no penalties

 

any idle gains should be aimed at clans because clans = nations. individuality in many ways are more of a hindrance to organized gameplay than a help.

 

 

sure make having 3rds and higher have a cost so that people are encouraged to goto war to keep thier ships/fleets "reputable"

 

idle gains should be based on a reputation which increases by attendance in pvp and decreased by nonattendance.

 

fleet farming is too lucrative in it's current form although challenging being able to farmgold in the 100s of thousands makes for a false economy.  max prices must be enforced as is max gold.  if you have more than 5 million then the gold should go to admiralty and you gain land and the amount of land you own shouldbe a scoreboard for players so they can see where they are in relation to other players.

 

at the moment winning ports has near zero affect beyond they enjoy the fight.  they need a carrot to make them keep up with the jones'.

 

If there was a series of scoreboards people could aspire to being on with special benefits like custom prize ships, custom artwork etc then at least there would be a reason to do things beyond the gloryof winning a battle.   ie top 100 land owners get thier own fleets to command.  more land better ships. etc etc.  it only is for use in OW but that makes the epic fleets accessible to attack more regularly.

 

make it so that there is competition for status as well as PBs.

 

idle gains is such a trivial thing when you look at things like what do i do as a rear admiral.  make better end game content and wasy to compare skill and rank and ignore noise features like i want crew to get old.

 

If you make it too spreadsheety you lose casual gamers

if you make it too easy you lose hardcore players.

if you make it too vanilla then you lose all players.

 

you need to build carrots to gather that are fun and difficult and lead people into chasing the carrots through missions.

 

there should be a progression as well as an option not to progress.

 

have 100 acheivments and make it that they get a gold santi with their own name or something that makes them unique,desirable and formidable at each status.

 

avoid roflstomping by making it less beneficial to fight sub par opposition.  2K experience for fleet battles where you outnumber the enemy and out class them is just time sinking.  base opposition on player reputations in ai stuff so that people of more experience get more ships against them and more reputation for winning and make it a fame game.

 

get a fame game for guilds going

 

make the grind longer but with more steps not shorter with less challenges.  people need small carrots and lots of them while having a big picture goal.

 

examples of solo carrots

 

own 2 outposts to own 10 outposts = rep and title  defender of the realm defender of the region as medals or something.

win 10 port battles with more than 10 defending ships in both shallow and deep 20 30 40 50 60 70 80 90 100+

 

PVP is all about meaningless pixel rewards so you can brag or be a tall poppy

 

give crafters similar things where they get custom blueprints like crew access versions of ships with bonus crew carrying if they build 10 of a type of ship but make the prize designs where you can only make one as a prototype.

 

give pvp ranks like the ability to rename your rank to a custom title after killing 100 enemy pvp in ow combat.  make them hunt for enemies

 

Team player badges for assists over kills in battles and for having 5 kills in a battle.  that kind of thing.

 

to many statistical acheivements would feed peoples interest after grinding to RA on AI farming.

 

big ships sailable at certain fame levels only.   use it or lose it system for high rate ships so admiralty own ships and you get given them for attending.

 

 

really the whole idea that making idle gains in a game where we don't have a reason to do anything once we get to rear admiral is plain silly the game already became shorter with the xp nerf and the gold supply increase for anyone who is goal driven.   sure it is nice to sail around in a pretty world but at the moment people run from even fights and cheat to avoid combat rather than facing a challenge becasue the is no gains for actually doing hard things.  now you want to spoon feed them things to make it easier to do the stuff that is already trivial.

 

if sailers are not available in port go capture stuff.....theres your easy gains and a corrot. dont give them stuff for sitting in port not playing thats just plain dumb

 

the idea is to give challengesthat lead to combat between players not ways to avoid it by waiting.

 

even the 25 vs 25 type santi PBs are a bit rubbish in a way......everyone looks to escape instead of killing ships against the odds.   every gun in a fight should eb aimed on the enemy and how you hide damaged ships is the way to win.  not lets wait for the ones more scared of losing 5 million santis from escaping.   Loss of reputation and possible rights to sail the big ships and acheive difficult acheivments is more important than losing a 5 million santi that you can grind a new one in a day and feel like your back at square one about to try and fight the same people who did the same people over something that has no affect to you status. outside of a adrenalin rush and red dot on the map smiley face from chat.

 

 

people want to be the best at the moment they are all the best once they get a santi and rear admiral....

 

sorry for the semi rant but really you want me to vote on if the game should get worse and how....

Edited May 3, 2016 by Fastidius

[Crayon]

First of all, I want to clarify my intentions. First what I mean by idle gameplay is mainly time afk, after 30 minutes of doing nothing and the timer boots you. When you are logged out for all intensive purposes.

 

But Crayon!? Why should we let people make idle gains??

 

My answer is to this question is not a superficial one. The actual answer to this question is to address the issue of players not logging back in. Keeping a stable population so to speak.

 

I refer everyone back to the steamcharts located here:  http://steamcharts.com/app/311310

 

Personally i think that there are 2 levels of game,

 

Entry level - Explorer

 

PVP - 5 grades and up

 

 

 

PVP = EGO if you want pvp feed ego building stuff.

 

 

idle gains should be based on a reputation which increases by attendance in pvp and decreased by nonattendance.

 

fleet farming is too lucrative in it's current form although challenging being able to farmgold in the 100s of thousands makes for a false economy.  max prices must be enforced as is max gold.  if you have more than 5 million then the gold should go to admiralty and you gain land and the amount of land you own shouldbe a scoreboard for players so they can see where they are in relation to other players.

 

at the moment winning ports has near zero affect beyond they enjoy the fight.  they need a carrot to make them keep up with the jones'.

 

If there was a series of scoreboards people could aspire to being on with special benefits like custom prize ships, custom artwork etc then at least there would be a reason to do things beyond the gloryof winning a battle.   ie top 100 land owners get thier own fleets to command.  more land better ships. etc etc.  it only is for use in OW but that makes the epic fleets accessible to attack more regularly.

 

make it so that there is competition for status as well as PBs.

 

idle gains is such a trivial thing when you look at things like what do i do as a rear admiral.  make better end game content and wasy to compare skill and rank and ignore noise features like i want crew to get old.

 

If you make it too spreadsheety you lose casual gamers

if you make it too easy you lose hardcore players.

if you make it too vanilla then you lose all players.

 

you need to build carrots to gather that are fun and difficult and lead people into chasing the carrots through missions.

 

there should be a progression as well as an option not to progress.

 

get a fame game for guilds going

 

 

examples of solo carrots

 

people want to be the best at the moment they are all the best once they get a santi and rear admiral....

 

 

 

Very nice post. I read the whole thing! First of all I think there was a miscommunication on my part. Sorry!

 

My intent for this poll is not to spoon feed people, but in fact give incentives to log back in, to go out from port as well as do more pvp. I also put these polls up with the upcoming patches and what the developers are planning for us in general. 

1) I really like the idle gains increase by rank/rep idea. I had something similar in mind!

2) I'd like to avoid the topic of fleet farming, but you are correct. It detracts from the overall value of the game in a qualitative sense. What I mean, is its not readily definable. Im sure theres a statistician I can hit up real quick. but nahhh

3) Alot of your response has to do with 'epeen' and 'ego stroking'. You are 100% correct, and with the dwindling playerbase, that will only increase.

 

4) This one was great:

"If there was a series of scoreboards people could aspire to being on with special benefits like custom prize ships, custom artwork etc then at least there would be a reason to do things beyond the gloryof winning a battle.   ie top 100 land owners get thier own fleets to command.  more land better ships. etc etc.  it only is for use in OW but that makes the epic fleets accessible to attack more regularly.

 

make it so that there is competition for status as well as PBs."

 

I have no idea about the upcoming designs and plans the devs have in store for us. The only way I see to combat the 'ego stroking' and 'epeen' that is being demonstrated, is to implement something "Official". Something like, as you mention, a scoreboard. That way the 'Ego lords and ladies' can be directed at the scoreboard. 

 

5) To address the rest of the statements you made, I simply want to say nothing in a game is trivial. Anything and everything works in tandem with its pieces and provides some different value to whomever uses that functionality. Some people want to see dolphins where others want bigger guns, or just more 'stuff'. There is never a single thing that is more trivial than another when it comes to making a game. Its often the little things (thinking of Gandalf here actually lol) that keep the game moving forward. Its also the stuff that keep the people coming back on.

 

For example:

Crafting hours. How often have you logged in just to craft stuff for yourself or someone else!?!

^^^ @Devs We need more like this.

 

 

Edited for readability

Edited May 3, 2016 by Crayon

[GrapeShot]

Fastidious,

I like many of your suggestions but heartily disagree with making a player deal with a clan as one. Some people prefer solo play and pestering them with team stuff serves no purpose.

[BallsOfSteel]

How does a non clan member ever get above a connie?? you have to grind the craft and hope for the best. Its simply too hard and will see those players just leave in frustration unless you can buy the ships in port at the shop once you reach the level to crew them. Simple as that.

[ITFHunter]

How does a non clan member ever get above a connie?? you have to grind the craft and hope for the best. Its simply too hard and will see those players just leave in frustration unless you can buy the ships in port at the shop once you reach the level to crew them. Simple as that.

compass Wood lvl3 x 5 = 500k earning each day, after 8 days u can buy a Pavel MC. So it's quite easy even for solo players

[Fastidius]

Fastidious,

I like many of your suggestions but heartily disagree with making a player deal with a clan as one. Some people prefer solo play and pestering them with team stuff serves no purpose.

fair enough but in my opinion you are missing out on most of the game.

[haemol]

why not implement a feature like treasure hunt (sort of like exploration like in eve online)? 

this should be a risky undertaking but risk=fun (like gambling) which would only be profitable to do as solo players. also this would make it reasonable to go solo player hunting alone, cause you would specialize in hunting treasure hunters.

 

if this idea is interesting we could think about how this treasure hunting feature could look like in practise, what do you guys think?