Is the Snow model too small?

[Deltrex]

93

Currently in game the snow model seems to be about 50% to small. The Snow is supposed to be a bit bigger than the Brig with more crew, more guns and more cargo space, however the model of the Snow is just too small for that.

 

If you look carefully at the Snow model that is in game right now you will see that it is not even big enough for the guns that are displayed on it and it would be basically impossible to reload and fire the cannons on the Snow.

[Arvenski]

It does seem oddly small, doesn't it?

 

When I was in my Mercury, I helped out a guy in a Snow, and when the battle was over I took these screenshots of our ships side-by-side:

 

Also, a word to Game-Labs: Make your forum more accepting of images from different sources, please. When your game is a Steam game, it would make sense if I could use URLs to screenshots that I've uploaded to Steam, instead of having to find them in the file system, reupload them to Imgur, have the first set of Imgur URLs rejected, and only finally be able to post my screenshots via a different set of URLs that I found. 

[Henry d'Esterre Darby]

It looks tiny next to the cutter. I've wondered the same.

[admin]

well it was done to spec (blueprints)

It does look small

[Migui]

Do you guys wanna ruin the cutest machine gun of the game?

[Malachi]

The snow is based on the Ontario, right? Ontario length of gundeck: 77 feet, Mercury 96 feet, the cutter is about 70 feet, if I remember correctly.

[Porpoise]

I just wonder how can 120 men fit in that ship. But according to the records they did. I saw a record that the completement was arround 100 + they were transporting 30 POW when they sunk. So maybe the crew size should be reduced a bit.  

Edited April 6, 2016 by Porpoise

[maturin]

Difference in length that seem incremental make for really big differences when it comes to ship dimensions, I find.

[Henry d'Esterre Darby]

well it was done to spec (blueprints)

It does look small

 

I'm sure the dimensions on it are perfect.  I just noticed, whilest in the cutter yesterday, how the cutter looks so much larger.  

[akd]

Dimensions are correct, I am sure.  Problems I see:

 

1. Trader's snow treated as larger capacity than trader's brig.  The latter clearly has the much bigger hull and a design more suited to open ocean trading.

 

2. Crew complement.  This is tricky as she was a lake ship, so never would have needed to support a large complement for months at sea.  Consequently, she could probably pack more people in relative to her size, but sea-keeping is not a factor in game, so she is just over-crewed for her size compared to other ships in the game.

 

When she sank, she had a crew of only 40, but was transporting 60 troops and and possibly 30 prisoners.

 

3. She is both fast and weatherly.  This seems strange given her relatively short and tall hull and small rig (just compare the size of the snow's rig to the brig's rig in game).

[Ronald Speirs]

I actually thought it looked bigger back in sea trials then jumped on OW and was like OMG im a midget when i sailed her again

[Ratline]

well it was done to spec (blueprints)

It does look small

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pyh1Va_mYWI

[Cragger]

Dimensions are correct, I am sure.  Problems I see:

 

1. Trader's snow treated as larger capacity than trader's brig.  The latter clearly has the much bigger hull and a design more suited to open ocean trading.

 

2. Crew complement.  This is tricky as she was a lake ship, so never would have needed to support a large complement for months at sea.  Consequently, she could probably pack more people in relative to her size, but sea-keeping is not a factor in game, so she is just over-crewed for her size compared to other ships in the game.

 

When she sank, she had a crew of only 40, but was transporting 60 troops and and possibly 30 prisoners.

 

3. She is both fast and weatherly.  This seems strange given her relatively short and tall hull and small rig (just compare the size of the snow's rig to the brig's rig in game).

 

I'd like to know what the hold dimensions to the Ontario are. While the Ontario was 226 tons burden or there abouts to the Fair American's 160ish the Fair American's hold was 9ft deep. I can't find anything about the Ontario's. 

 

well it was done to spec (blueprints)

It does look small

 

All the information I can find on the HMS Ontario states it had 4lber guns instead of 6lber guns. Did you all find information stating otherwise or is this a gameplay concession much like the Mercury is limited to 6lbers when it had 8lbers (9lbers British) in real life?

[akd]

I'd like to know what the hold dimensions to the Ontario are. While the Ontario was 226 tons burden or there abouts to the Fair American's 160ish the Fair American's hold was 9ft deep. I can't find anything about the Ontario's. 

 

 

All the information I can find on the HMS Ontario states it had 4lber guns instead of 6lber guns. Did you all find information stating otherwise or is this a gameplay concession much like the Mercury is limited to 6lbers when it had 8lbers (9lbers British) in real life?

 

Ontario had 6 pdrs on her gundeck and 4 pdrs on her weatherdecks.  Mercury did not have 8 pdrs.  She had 24 pdr carronades and two 6 pdr chase guns.

[Cragger]

Ontario had 6 pdrs on her gundeck and 4 pdrs on her weatherdecks.  Mercury did not have 8 pdrs.  She had 24 pdr carronades and two 6 pdr chase guns.

 

All the sheets I find have 4lbs and the Mercury having 8lber chase guns supplemented by 3lbers they moved there.

 

Still that's not an absolute thing, so it's inconsequential. Often the guns on a ship where left to the discretion of the commander of it. If the eyes and timbers were judged capable of stopping the recoil of the carriage and wave action and the portholes and deck space sufficient  to draw the gun in and load it all manner could have been used. Captain David porter complained to the Navy several times about the all carronade armament on the U.S.S. Essex but lacked the personal funds to change it without navy providing them.

[Deltrex]

well it was done to spec (blueprints)

It does look small

 

Well the model in game still looks like a 1/2 or 2/3 scale rebuild model. 

A ship of the physical size of the ship we have in game would clearly not be capable of the things the ship is capable if in game.

I don't think ships in game all have to be replicas of real ships, as long as the ships we do get make sense and would work. The Snow we have right now should be replaced by a bigger Snow that would actually be capable of the tasks it is supposed to fulfil in the game.

 

Edit: A possible solution would be to scale the Snow model up until its sail area lightly exceeds the Brig.

177

Edited April 6, 2016 by Deltrex

[akd]

What are "sheets"?

 

Ontario armament is from Warships of the Great Lakes by Robert Malcomson via ThreeDecks.

 

Mercury armament is from Russian Warships in the Age of Sail by John Tredrea and Eduard Sozaev.

 

Incidentally, two of her carronades are preserved at the entrance to the Black Sea Fleet Museum in Crimea:

 

[Mayhem Like Me]

I'm not saying it is small, but it does suffer from short stature syndrome.  Perhaps the shipyard received a load of adolescent wood? Do the winches tell the crew that size doesn't matter, just give us your gold?  Does a snow receive a discount in harbor rates for docking?  .....

 

Add a joke and may yours be better than mine!

[Deltrex]

39

So Snow jokes as the opposite of Yo Mama jokes?

 

Your Snow is so small you only have room for two clowns.

[Arvenski]

Perhaps the shipyard received a load of adolescent wood? Do the winches tell the crew that size doesn't matter, just give us your gold?  Does a snow receive a discount in harbor rates for docking?  .....

I don't know whether laugh or facepalm.

[Mayhem Like Me]

Your snow is so small any winches that board are required to have breast reductions.

[LeBoiteux]

Speaking of ship sizes, Niagara looked quite small compared to LGV in battle instance for "only" a 3 meter length difference with that perspective (if I didn't mix up data). Both length about = 110 ft (?).

 

 

 

[maturin]

LGV's length on the gundeck is a bit over 120 modern-day feet. Niagara listed length is between perpendiculars, which isn't quite the same measure.

[LeBoiteux]

LGV's length on the gundeck is a bit over 120 modern-day feet. Niagara listed length is between perpendiculars, which isn't quite the same measure.

 

Thx for the information. 

[akd]

Your snow is so small any winches that board are required to have breast reductions.

You have strange sexual tastes.