Fix U.S. Ranks

[Lord Heyford]

Please fix the ranks for the USA players. There is no such rank as Lt. Commandant. It is Lt. Commander, Commander, and Captain.

 

Commandant was a shore position for schools and prisons, not a rank.

[Henry d'Esterre Darby]

As of 1825, the officers were effectively:

 

1. Lieutenant
2. Lieutenant, Commanding (A Lt. that is in command of a Vessel)
3. Master Commandant
4. Captain
5. Commodore
6. Admiral

 

No Commander anywhere in there.  The officer rank structure was actually quite flat in those days.  In short, there were a number of rank structures up to 1825, the limit more or less for this game.  Some ranks were invented to fill out all of the required slots, to be sure, but to claim that "Commander" and "Lt. Commander" were ranks in the United States Navy at the time is incorrect.  

[CptEdwardKenway]

Maybe they needed to fill the other ranks. Or were this the only ranks in that year? Brits have 10 ranks at the moment. I know it's not historical correct but it looks like 4 ranks are missing and they just needed to find some placeholders.

 

Beside that I would also like to have the original ranks.

[Henry d'Esterre Darby]

In fact, they were missing 5 ranks. Lieutenant and Lieutenant Commanding were the same - the latter was simply in command of a ship. So yes, some license was taken by inventing ranks.

[Hyperion74]

From what I have read, the British Royal Navy ranks were:

Lieutenant, which ever spot one held aboard ship by seniority.

Lieutenant or Commander, in command of a non rated ship, hence captain but still lieuy.

Captain of less that three years, in command of a rated ship. One epaulette.

Post Captain.

Flag Captain in command of a Flag ship but still captain of that ship only.

Commodore in command of a small fleet.

Admiral ranks. Overall command of lots of big boats.

There were no ensigns, they were midshipmen.

 

The U.S. Navy and Marine Corps were based on the British services.

 

Again, I derived this info from the many nautical fiction novels that I have read. Could be wrong.

 

Lieutenant Commander and Commander are both a modern ranks in the U.S. Navy. 

 

I think that Master and Commander was a term used to denote that the commander of a ship was both sailing master and Captain.

 

Henry, your an Englishman so school more if ye please.

Edited March 27, 2016 by Hyperion74

[CptEdwardKenway]

Ok thanks for the info. So it's also the same with british ranks. So how could we get those 10 ranks? Hm

[Henry d'Esterre Darby]

From what I have read, the British Royal Navy ranks were:

Lieutenant, which ever spot one held aboard ship by seniority.

Lieutenant or Commander, in command of a non rated ship, hence captain but still lieuy.

Captain of less that three years, in command of a rated ship. One epaulette.

Post Captain.

Flag Captain in command of a Flag ship but still captain of that ship only.

Commodore in command of a small fleet.

Admiral ranks. Overall command of lots of big boats.

There were no ensigns, they were midshipmen.

 

The U.S. Navy and Marine Corps were based on the British services.

 

Again, I derived this info from the many nautical fiction novels that I have read. Could be wrong.

 

Lieutenant Commander and Commander are both a modern ranks in the U.S. Navy. 

 

I think that Master and Commander was a term used to denote that the commander of a ship was both sailing master and Captain.

 

Henry, your an Englishman so school more if ye please.

 

hehe, that's pretty good.

 

• Midshipmen was a catch-all introductory officers rank.  A midshipman could be a boy of 9 or 10, learning the ropes so to speak, a youngster fit to reef and hand (and lead teams of seaman doing the same) or a 35 or 40 year old man who never managed to demonstrate enough influence or seamanship to pass for Lieutenant. Admittedly, I believe it was considered "embarassing" to still be a midshipman at an older age.
• Lieutenants often commanded packets, cutters, and other small ships, as well as acted as secondary commanders of larger ships.  A ship could have more than one lieutenant aboard, and often did.  They tended to assist the Captain in leading various watches, were trusted with taking prizes into port, etc.  Any person in command of his own ship was a "Commander", and was called "Captain" by courtesy.  The Lieutenant who was in charge of a Cutter was called Commander or Captain.  Lieutenants of small enough ships that did not have their own master sometimes were called "Master and Commander".  I believe the practice of not having a Ship's Master in small vessels declined significantly around 1715 or so.
• Post-Captain.  A Captain was made post when they were put into command of a 5th rate or larger by the Admiralty.  There were Post-Captains, and then Senior Post Captains who had held the rank for at least three years.  Once made post, your position on the "list" was fixed by seniority based on the date you were made post - it was important to achieve post rank as early as possible to maximize your chances of surviving to make Admiral.  The only way to gain rank after being made post was for someone above you on the list to die, or be dismissed from the service (we won't get into Admiral of the Yellow here).  No matter your abilities, your rank only advanced by a position opening above you, and the entire list then went up by one step.  There was no jumping the queue.
• Commodore - A temporary rank used only to denote a Post-Captain who had been put in charge of more than one ship.  This rank only lasted for the duration of those orders, after which you would be a Post-Captain again.
• Yellow Admiral - There was a period where there were too many Post Captains - some at the top of the list waiting for a Rear Admiral position to open up were "Yellowed", or effectively promoted to Admiral of the Yellow and then dismissed from the service on full pay.
• Rear Admiral - Of the Red, then the White, then the Blue.  You advanced through the different colors when positions opened up.  Once you were Rear Admiral of the Blue, you were promoted to:
• Vice Admiral - Again of the Red, then the White, then the Blue.  Finally, you ascended to:
• Admiral - Of the White, then the Blue.  I understand in 1805 Admiral of the Red was then created to work similarly to the Vice and Rear positions.

 

There was an "Admiral of the Fleet" position off and on, but I believe it was little used at that time.

[CptEdwardKenway]

Well that's interesting. So we have way too many admirals I guess

Edited March 28, 2016 by CptEdwardKenway

[Henry d'Esterre Darby]

Far, far, far, far too many.

[Prater]

Rear Admiral and above wasn't a rank until 1862. Master and Commander was not used. Instead it was Master Commandant, just like it is in game. Lt. Commandant wasn't used either, instead it was Lt. In Command, but w/e works.

Technically the highest permanent rank was Captain, but like all Commodores in Britain, US Commodores tended to keep the title after their position expired.