Anti-Intentional sinking of own ship

[God Emperor Trump / Alan]

Hey there, didn't see any topics regarding this but please let me know if I missed anything.

 

I've noticed lately that players will intentionally ram you to get leaks, or simply not repair their current leaks. All so that they can deny you their ship.

 

1. This is not realistic in regards to how crews would operate, they wouldn't do something like that as it is extremely hazardous for themselves.

 

2. Ships do not sink easily and it's quite immersion breaking when a ship sinks simply because the other player decided to not press 8.

 

Something needs to be done about this in my opinion, for example changing the survival mechanics along with water pumping and repairs.

 

Maybe make it so that you constantly repair leaks slowly and pump out water slowly, just to avoid stuff like this.

 

What do you guys think?

[ObiQuiet]

If your crew got better at sailing and shooting the longer you keep them, that would be a reason not to sink yourself.

[God Emperor Trump / Alan]

If your crew got better at sailing and shooting the longer you keep them, that would be a reason not to sink yourself.

 

Did you even read my post and understand the point of it?

[akd]

This is the insidious effect of not having a meaningful surrender system. It corrupts many other aspects of Age of Sail tactics in game.

[Macjimm]

Sounds like a good tactic. As an option to deny your ship to the enemy. Sounds more gamey to be forced to give your ship away. This way we have a choice.

"An act of self-destruction to prevent the ship from being captured by an enemy force."

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scuttling

On a separate topic I would like have to other options available to the victor with surrender. As AKD says, a meaningful surrender system. Perhaps options to relieve the captured ship of its cargo and let it continue. Or allow the ship to leave with cargo. Provide small XP to the victor for the first successful detention.

Edited February 13, 2016 by Macjimm

[maturin]

 

"An act of self-destruction to prevent the ship from being captured by an enemy force."

https://en.m.wikiped.../wiki/Scuttling

Scuttling in deep water = suicide.

 

Not generally practiced in preference to becoming a prisoner of war. I'm sure your crew would also have some thoughts on being left to drown pointlessly.

[LeBoiteux]

Lands in battle instances will also provide means to run your ship aground (just kidding or not...).

Crew management and a new system of surrender may change the deal the other way around.

[ObiQuiet]

Did you even read my post and understand the point of it?

I thought I did. You want to have fewer enemies letting their own ships sink before capture. I see now that you mean only after the result is decided... so preserving the crew isn't an option.

[Admiral 8Q]

As a merchant ship, surrender makes sense. As a military ship, scuttling is preferable to capture.

[ObiQuiet]

Only after the crew were off. Capture is preferable to drowning.

[Macjimm]

Tend to agree with maturin and ObiQuite. Skuttling would have been most likely in shallow water or when the crew could be assured they would be rescued from drowning, albeit prisoners.

It is mostly the mechanics of the game that makes sinking our own ship (to deny the enemy) so appealing. Not so much the historical accuracy. I understand that lots of sailors could not swim, many enjoyed a frolic in the warm Caribbean on a hot day but only within the shallow pool created by a sail that was rigged for wading. It would have been terrifying to be on a quickly sinking ship if you were unable to swim.

[ObiQuiet]

An idea would be to give the sinking player an equivalent incentive to not sink.   

 

If the ship sinks, it loses a durability and any advantage from the crew working together is lost.

If the ship is surrendered and captured, the losing player keeps his sword PLUS some other advantage (hmm, what could it be?)

* keep a crew bonus.  Not realistic, but would be valuable to keep.

* get a reward or a medal for courageous attention to duty.  Not realistic either, he'd get a court martial

(these ideas aren't going well)

 

* keeps his rank (this could be it -- sink and lose a rank, or surrender/be captured and keep your rank)

* Reputation could go up -- if we had a reputation system, and if the opponent was equal or greater.

 

Maybe someone else has ideas.

[The MetaBaron]

HAHA since when is the Navy scuttling a ship to prevent the enemy getting it "not realistic". If anything there should be a way to rig the magazines to explode.... THAT my naive friend would realistic.

 

Use a touch of common sense please.

[maturin]

 

If anything there should be a way to rig the magazines to explode.... THAT my naive friend would realistic.

 

No navy ever did that with men on board.

 

Fanatical captains gave the order when they were losing, at which point their men quite sensibly smothered them with their own bandages.

[ObiQuiet]

HAHA since when is the Navy scuttling a ship to prevent the enemy getting it "not realistic". If anything there should be a way to rig the magazines to explode.... THAT my naive friend would realistic.

Use a touch of common sense please.

"Naive" is a fighting word. Please clarify your comments, sir, or I shall call you out.

[Macjimm]

Use a touch of common sense please.

We are attempting to explore some friendly suggestions ... it's unnecessary to be offensive .

[The MetaBaron]

No navy ever did that with men on board.

 

Fanatical captains gave the order when they were losing, at which point their men quite sensibly smothered them with their own bandages.

 

Obviously most of the time people would abandon ship before it was blown up...

 

But as a quick and random Wiki search proves, sinking your flagship to prevent the enemy from taking it while its boarded is a very valid tactic.

 

"The navy suffered several severe setbacks during the 1620s. In 1625, a squadron cruising in the Bay of Riga was caught in a storm and ten ships ran aground and were wrecked. In the Battle of Oliwa in 1627, a Swedish squadron was outmaneuvered and defeated by a Polish force and two large ships were lost. Tigern ("The Tiger"), which was the Swedish admiral's flagship, was captured by the Poles, and Solen ("The Sun") was blown up by her own crew when she was boarded and near capture."

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vasa_%28ship%29

 

notice "boarded and near capture".... 

[maturin]

Also notice "outside Danzig harbor." Not exactly the middle of the Caribbean Sea.

[The MetaBaron]

Also notice "outside Danzig harbor." Not exactly the middle of the Caribbean Sea.

 

when was the stipulation "the middle of the Caribbean Sea"? Most battles are close to land or literally within ports.

[maturin]

when was the stipulation "the middle of the Caribbean Sea"? Most battles are close to land or literally within ports.

PBs would be a good time and place for a scuttling mechanic. Because a fully-crewed vessel never has enough boats for everyone. You have to be right on the beach, basically.

 

Ships were most often scuttled when anchored or aground.