Bjerg Bjergsson

Loki could be a neat idea on PvP. On PvE it is grief-y. Not sure what the goal of it really was, yeah it CAN create some good PvP content.. but there is a whole server where that should be happening. Coupled with AI that have speed reloads and magic damage + arcs of fire (if in a fleet battle) it is too much. Make some actual PvE content (convoy escorts/intercepts etc) instead please.

Interested

I left PvP because I couldn't keep up with crafting/ship build meta with the hours of gaming I had available. I left PvE because there was little to do besides Fleet Missions and Solo Missions and every patch seemed to cater to the PvP crowd. Will I come back for a new UI? No, but I will come back to try out the new mission types. If I stay will depend on how compelling and in-depth they make them.

Figured I'd post this here as I don't know if there is an off-topic forum. The US Brig Niagara is in need of restoration.. I guess they ran out of hull repairs. Erie Maritime Museum - U.S. Brig Niagara

Come to the PVE server! It's so calm and civilized and you can get enjoyment without the angst and venom of egos colliding.

The PVE and PVP community are at complete odds I can't ever see them "banding together". Until they do away with the ship building meta I don't see anything changing as the time investment is just too steep for any casuals. I gave up on PVP when I realized I just don't have the time to put into the game to be remotely competitive as I would need: 1. To stay current on shipbuilding meta (which ship build + upgrades are considered best for PvP and what suits my playstyle) 2. To stay supplied so if I lose a ship I won't be stuck building/gathering resources for a new one for two weeks or waiting on clan mates to build one for me (they all left anyways for the exact same reasons) 3. To keep my PvP skills honed through hunting/defending I'm now of the opinion there needs to be a separate forum for PVE as PVP is making the most noise and any PVE'er who raises their head seems to get shouted down anyways.

Please dear god yes. Get rid of modules and upgrades of all types. Make wood be the only variation and that's it. Level playing field and it is skill + crafter that makes the difference.

What difference does any of this debate actually make when establishing a baseline is so difficult? You adjust the base stats for a ship but ignore the dozens of speed/sail/hull mods which pile on stats multipliers to the degree that the base stats become meaningless. What SHOULD be the fastest ship in the game becomes outdone by the second fastest ship in the game + all the insane speed mods/wood builds. I chuckle at the comparisons people are trying to make Person A: "I achieve X kts at Y degrees in a teak/teak" while Person B "I achieve Zkts at Y degrees in a teak/teak" when no mods are mentioned, no bowsprits or rig refits or all the other stupid BS that is piled on top of what should be universal base stats. "How many Captains did it take to achieve that speed?" THAT IS THE RUB. Negating the degree of skill/luck/chance involved in actually managing your yards, firing your guns by piling on MOD META is making this totally moot. If the fully upgraded sports car is the only one that will win the race then why get on the road at all in your minivan?

How can you achieve "balance" and "performance" when you have over a dozen "upgrades" and wood builds that change all of these stats? Upgrades - both in the manner of acquiring them and the meta that they create - unbalance any small tweaks and changes made and further isolate the casuals from the hardcores.

So for a new player with 1 fighting ship and maybe 1 trade ship they are either going to lose at PvP or lose at PvE by that regard. How do you reconcile that? If they get jumped on the way to a PvE mission? With the current system in place the new player could be in a fast ship but easily get outpaced by a PvP built warship with speed mods. If you remove mods altogether or limit them to 1-2 (versus the FORTY-SIX that exist now) then you at least enable a bit more balance and lets ships play their roles a bit better. Diversity in cosmetics + ship type/play style would take over at that point.

So mods only matter on the same skill level meaning.. mods do matter? I also hate to point out your experience as a pretty high skill level PvP player is not emblematic of a new player experience. I do think mods are a problem - certainly not the only one. PvP experience is absolutely learned and the only way to do it is by playing and getting sunk and playing more. I've fought players in PvP and done alright and I've fought players in PvP and lost. The biggest difference I found when losing was the times I didn't feel I learned anything when I got crushed thanks to faster reloads and more maneuverability - it was noticeable. Not as noticeable a difference as the old exceptional mods were back in the day but enough. Ultimately that is my point. As rediii said mods make a difference. Maybe to him it only seems so on the same skill level but when the skill level is asymmetric then the mods will help even more. The difference for a new player between a close fight - or even a pitched battle - where they can see how they were defeated and understand the mistakes they made versus a battle wherein they were just outclassed at every level does not make them feel like they have a chance. I think of War Thunder in this regard. You can get matches where you get outplayed and that's that but then there are matches where you just get humiliated thanks to max upgrades etc - and that is in a game with actual matchmaking not the OW encounters of Naval Action. The advantage of the rounds and matchmaking means that you can get in another match where that doesn't happen. In Naval Action when a PvP ship sinks your boat in such a manner the player is stuck begging on Nation chat for someone to fight the PvP-er keeping them penned into the port and if/when that doesn't happen they log out - not something we want players to be doing. Mods can have a place in Naval Action: Legends as maybe that works better with the PvP and matchmaking system but in regular NA I just think it doesn't add anything to the gameplay and instead detracts from it. If someone can please tell me though - what do they add to gameplay - I would love to hear it!

Certainly a vet vs. noob is going to be an imbalanced fight based purely on experience of player, that's in some ways my point. It is already going to be one sided, adding mods + perks + wood types on top of pure player experience only tips the scales that much further. Does this make for good gameplay for the noob? Or even for the vet? Let me ask you, what does refits/books/slots bring to the table? What do they add gameplay wise beyond speed meta and many other issues? You say you do both PvE and PvP in your ship - what is your ship and what is the breakdown of your build? Would a simplified system and build not be also PvE and PvP capable?

Problem: As I see it experienced players gaining even more of an edge over new players through ship experience and upgrades/builds. For veteran players it upgrades + mods + builds means a player must have a PvE ship and a PvP ship if they want to do both. If they are on a PvE mission and are jumped they are at a disadvantage or if they want to now PvP they have to sail back and change to their PvP build (how many times have I seen/heard "let me go back to port and get my PvP build..."). Evidence: Two players encounter each other in OW, both of them in say a Lynx. One is brand new and the other is a veteran. The new player has a base ship (say oak with oak planking) and medium 6pdrs with no ship knowledge and thus no upgrades. The veteran player can use his ship knowledge + permanent upgrade slots to fit a combination of, what.. seven out of FORTY SIX different Upgrades that when stacked can give (him as a singular example) +16% hull penetration (Bow Figure - Rattlesnake + Almeria Superior Gunpowder) or +22% hull penetration if you can stack Guacata Superior Gunpowder on top of that - not including if he is using 6pdr longs. 46 upgrades is way too many - especially coupled with the various wood combinations and planking and then add Officer Perks and you can have a crushing imbalance for a new player to try and overcome. Are all these upgrades really necessary? What do they add to gameplay other than imbalance? Why does a veteran and experienced player even need these things? The example I gave above is regarding guns but the issue travels into the speed meta problems as well. Having a handful of speed mods + wood choices + officer perks and suddenly you are untouchable in your Wasa (or pfrig etc). You can gank and run as you choose and none can touch you. Solution: Level the playing field. Officer perks are gained through experience and they provide any sort of "mod" abilities across all ships. Ship "knowledge" is Ship Veterancy and takes the form of purely cosmetic effects like sail colours or paintjobs or signal flags. Number of woods reduced to 4 or 5 (not 8) and values tweaked accordingly. In Conclusion: A player shouldn't need a PvE ship AND a PvP ship. More Byzantine systems of mods and tweaks and upgrades and perks and woods do not great gameplay make. Getting people on the water and letting player experience and knowledge decide a battle is far more fun, realistic and challenging than who has the better upgrades/speed meta.

I am totally stuck on swivel guns. Please, please, please can we have a different button for loading swivel guns vs. lumping them into the "Left Side, Right Side". Stopping a gun deck reloading ball 2-3 floors below the sterncastle so that the 2pdr swivels can load grape to ward off boarding parties is kinda crazy making.